An other question, did the Eidolon avoid all damage from fireball, or is that an oversight?

In reply to Josep Gavinho (msg # 63):

The Eidolon has Evasion, due to being an Eidolon of summoner level 2nd level or greater. (I think maybe the Minion statblocks need to be slightly more expansive to include resistances)

The Eidolon has Greater Invisibility, giving him +2 to hit and making you Flat-Footed, if I'm not mistaken.

The Eidolon closed its eyes and ignored the Images entirely on the first attack, making it a flat 50% miss chance (thus the d% miss chance on the first attack). Since that hit, it opened its eyes and just swiped at images the other attacks that hit. This is my bad, I think - I had the strategy planned a long time ago and I guess I stopped thinking about it actively.

Edit - Missed a question, and adding another couple notes, since I believe that is ok for noncombat posts:

The attack that initiated the grab was a Claw attack. I'm... not sure what the protocol is if you avoid that attack, as I've already rolled the Mirrors, but at the same time, the point of switching to open-eyed attacking was "I've already grabbed him", so the Eidolon would continue close-eyed if possible...

Also this assumed that blinking is a free action.

Lastly, I did look up the Charge rules, which state you must have line of sight of the target at the beginning of the turn to charge. However I learned from the whole illegal potion thing that one place not prohibiting something does not mean it is not prohibited by another section of the rules. I haven't found anything contradictory yet, though...
This message was last edited by the player at 17:20, Sat 27 Aug 2016.

All right, I understand what you were doing now.
I suppose you had these actions listed in private to the ref, hence why I didn't see them.
You should still specify, for each minion, which type of action was taken.
Pathfinder doesn't specify what kind of action it is to close or open your eyes.
Last time I remember someone closing their eyes to avoid Mirror Image, it was ruled by the GM that I was a free action, but the creature remains blind until their next turn. Also, your take penalties on your attack roll and movement for being blind.

I'll wait for Ario to rule on what happens in that end of round 1 and beginning of round 2 before I post my actions.

I actually didn't specify in PM that the eidolon was doing that, only that it was attacking (and then I rolled following that strategy). Like I mentioned, I basically had it set in my head, so I stopped thinking of it actively as anything different than the "normal attack pattern", which is my bad. Edit: I guess I was kind of thinking that it was obvious from my rolls, but that clearly wasn't the case, so again, my fault. Apologies. I haven't had enough time to compensate for my bad proofreading and checking skills to really look before I leap.
This message was last edited by the player at 21:28, Sat 27 Aug 2016.

Per a ruling by Sely, the eyes close at the beginning of the turn and are closed until the start of the next turn.

Nothing of what Kecil said was in private action lines other than "charge with pounce".  No justification was made for making a roll other than what was called for.  As Josep called out the failure to make a proper roll, and Kecil had no reason for not making it, Kecil's Eidolon's grabbing attack fails to hit Josep's actual self.  As the failure to roll for images does not mitigate having hit Josep's AC, and as the attacks were not labeled with any kind of order, all 3 hits will pop images.

The Brownie may re-roll its images are there is only 1 image remaining when it goes.

Kecil may then edit his turn 2 post to strike through it (just select all and click on the strike option and post the turn's actions as he sees fit, or he may post that he will be leaving it as it stands.

Can I ask to have the attacks be made as simply eyes-closed (50% miss chance on each)? I noted the lack of notation before anybody else pointed it out, saying it was my bad in the post before Josep mentioned he didn't see anything like that in public posts. I didn't think a free action like that needed to be mentioned beyond rolling appropriately for that action, as I believed it was obvious, which again is now clearly untrue.

If that is not acceptable, then I would like to request that I be dropped from the match and Erelace be allowed to take additional attacks as if she did not have to move out the way for me, as I believe she'd have a better chance with that. I would really rather not reduce my teammate's chances because I wasn't able to spend sufficient time proofreading, clarifying, or thinking through my actions sufficiently.

If this is not possible, I apologize and will continue the fight.

Under the assumption that the ruling is final and will not be altered, I will not take the implied optional reroll, because I must note that there would not be one, but two mirror images left, and thus my roll of 3 would simply hit an image.

I don't see anything of you explaining why no mirror image roll made prior to Josep calling it on post 63.  If I'm missing something, let me know - all actions (free or not) that you intend to have  an in game effect need to be declared.

Per the previous ruling from Sely, if you wanted your eidolon to close his eyes, he closes his eyes at the start of turn, can't charge and passes turn as you gave him no legal actions with his eyes closed.  The ruling I gave was the most fair I could work out as your only problem with the post as written was not rolling the mirror image and not labeling your attacks.

You cannot walk away from a match once it is started, and you have not yet reached the conditions for concession.  (Check defeat and victory section of the arena rules - you'd lose 5% of your total BP. Leaving a game early is pure bad for you, and does not in any way buff your ally.)

I think this chain of quotes make my mistake most clear:







I did not mention it before post 63, but I did note that I didn't write out what I considered trivial, before Josep said he saw no such action.

I see now your complete ruling includes closing eyes at the beginning of the turn resulting in not ever having sight at the start of the turn. Therefore my proposed action is illegal, which was not clear to me until just now.

My proposed action was a retcon to simply erase my actions, and as a courtesy allow the most recent actions to be changes as if they were mistakes from a misunderstanding. I do not mind the BP loss as I then intended on quitting the Arena entirely, as it has become clear I do not have time to properly abide by its rules.

However, since it is clear you would not allow that, I will take the actions noted:



One final confirmation: This is valid, correct? Because I believe Josep has lost one entity from Erelace, and three from my Eidolon, out of six to begin with.

 I won't comment on the rulings and options, as it would only add a layer of complexity to an already tangled situation.

 I just want to say, bear with us.
 The rules of the arena can be overwhelming at first (and you wouldn't be the first one to drop after their first couple of fights because of how tedious it is), but it's also great fun once you master the format (and it gets easier to know what you can and can't do).

 Your build is solid and it doesn't take much to bring your formatting in line with the arena standard.
 (Sorry if this sound patronising, it is not my intent.)

 We should probably have played with the "hidden on the map" optional rule, it makes things easier to manage.

Yeah, I still have things that come up in matches that I didn't know were rulings.  And to be clear about the ruling, if (as josep was willing to assume) you had clearly declared the eyes open/eyes closed/eyes open thing I would have encouraged josep to let you roll the 1d4 miss chance for the claw to resolve the illegal action legally.  Every action (free or not) needs to be visible to the ref.

Thanks for the integrity with the brownie - I had miss-counted.  Also, you're playing up 1200 bp and aren't dead round one... in fact 2/3 of your minions aren't dead in round one also, so congrats on that.

Lastly, agreement between the players trumps ruling by ref in an individual match, so if Josep wants to offer you something else as an alternative, he's welcome to.  Otherwise, on with round 2.

Can someone summarize this for me where I can hit someone. Please.

Thank you for your kind words, but I think I will have to at the very least stop playing for some time. The realization came in two parts, both that this is a lot more bookwork than I anticipated, and also that classes are starting and I just got assigned 150 pages of reading in 2 days before the class even started o.O

I'll be giving it at least a week before I settle into a schedule and can (hopefully) give this the attention it deserves.

In reply to Erelace Barrityl (msg # 74):

I'll do my best...

Essentially, my Eidolon cannot open/close it's eyes at will as a free action - It can intentionally blind itself as a free action, but then its eyes are closed the whole turn. Thus, i can't bypass the normal Mirror miss chance in favor of blindness miss chance. So, my actions had to be edited somewhat.

Now it is Josep's turn, and he has one Mirror Image left.
This message was last edited by the player at 18:19, Sun 28 Aug 2016.

Noted. I'll try and post later today.

Josep's upper torso was still the only visible part of him.

  He started shooting rays of fire, aiming at an invisible opponent.

 Finally he ducked out of sight.


ROUND: 1
POSITION: J1(-1) to J1(-4)
 ACTIONS: Perception (free)
 Cast Empowered Maximized Scorching Ray (standard)
  Cast Quickened Scorching Ray (swift)
  Burrow 15ft down (move)

 HP: 108/108 (0 nonlethal)
 AC: 22; FFAC: 17; Touch: 15
CMD: 21; FFCMD: 16; FFTAC: 10

EFFECTS: Elemental Body II : Earth (minutes) ; Mirror Image: 1 figments (minutes) ; total cover
   GEAR: Ioun Stone, Bracers, Free Gear, Rod
   USES: - SPELLS: 6th level 3, 5th level 3

Dodo: I1, HP 54/54, [AC 11, FFAC 11, TAC 11, CMD 11, FFCMD 7, FFTAC 10, Fort +4, Refl +2, Will -1]
 Actions: perception
 Effects: -

ROLLS:

23:55, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 12,20 using 4d6+4,4d6+4 with rolls of 2,1,2,3,4,4,2,6.  Quickened Scorching Ray vs Eidolon (damage).
23:54, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 78,17,98 using d100,d100,d100 with rolls of 78,17,98.  Quickened Scorching Ray vs Eidolon (miss chance) .
23:53, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 19,19,20 using d20+11,d20+11,d20+11 with rolls of 8,8,9.  Quickened Scorching Ray vs Eidolon TAC.
23:53, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 16 using 4d6 with rolls of 5,4,5,2.  Empowered Maxmimized Scorching Ray vs Eidolon (damage).
23:52, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 83,25,22 using d100,d100,d100 with rolls of 83,25,22.  Empowered Maxmimized Scorching Ray vs Eidolon (miss chance) .
23:51, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 14,30,22 using d20+11,d20+11,d20+11 with rolls of 3,19,11.  Empowered Maxmimized Scorching Ray vs Eidolon TAC.
23:49, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 14 using 1d20+10 with rolls of 4.  Perception (dodo, free).
23:49, Today: Josep Gavinho rolled 16 using 1d20+14 with rolls of 2.  perception (josep, free).

 SUMMARY: Josep listens for the Eidolon and shoots where he thinks the centauric creature is; he strikes true 3 out of 6 times, totaling 36+20+12= 68 fire damage. He then disappears under the earth.

I'm assuming my roll of 16 is enough to pinpoint the eidolon. If that is not the case, the Scorching Rays are fired at the I3 square.

That should read round 2, evidently

PM

PM

 I think Erelace is up, right?
 Kecil, would you mind updating the initiative of you and your minions, since some of you have delayed actions? Thanks.

In reply to Josep Gavinho (msg # 81):

Ah, you're right. How do I do that, though? Just post a round with no actions?

In reply to Kecil (msg # 82):

 You could just post it as an informal post.
 And then update it in your next combat post.

Erelace? We're waiting for you I think.

So, I guess it'd be:
Round 2:
Eidolon initiative: 6

 I was willing to be lenient, but it's been almost five days now...
 I call 48h on Erelace.

 Once confirmed by Ario, you're up Kecil.

48 hour call confirmed.

Kecil is up.  Kecil please roll all of your actions for you and the Eidolon (Eidolon then you, or have the Eidolon delay to be in your same initiative) into one post.  Also, please make sure you are posting publicly what kinds of actions invisible creatures are taking.  Like [private what creature is doing with move action] "(move)", [private what creature is doing with standard action] "(standard)".  Please also post the initiative standing of all your people in your post as well.

Sorry, I realize I've been extending an already long period without posting. I've been figuring out my plan assuming Erelace is absent in my currently limited spare time. I should have the full post up within 24 hours.
This message was last edited by the player at 07:42, Mon 05 Sept 2016.