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22:26, 28th March 2024 (GMT+0)

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Posted by ashberg
ashberg
member, 615 posts
Beware the Groove.
Groooooove.
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 02:27
  • msg #1

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

I've had this idea lingering for a while...

A game where players are trying to build up their faction from the ground up.

It would be setting agnostic... sci fi colonies, fantasy kingdoms, post apocalyptic survivalists.

Players use RP Scenes to earn Action Points (APs). Scenes might be solo, or include other players. The outcome of the scene to be determined by the GM; and APs awarded accordingly. The characters in the scenes might have a very basic set of stats to roll for challenges / opposed conflict.

Players then use APs to buy actions for each game week. Actions could be anything like: Spy, Steal, Buy a resource, Attack, Boost defenses, Extort, Bribe, Influence... etc etc...

The results, being determined by either rolls or the GM, will give players' factions bonuses, buffs or special abilities.

"Winning" isn't the ultimate goal here... but building up an interesting a story, with a timeline of events that have unfolded is.

---

So does such a game exist?
Tyr Hawk
member, 243 posts
You know that one guy?
Yeah, that's me.
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 02:57
  • msg #2

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

You are describing House of the Blooded almost to a t.

Like, quite literally.

HotB isn't exactly what you described, but it's so close that they're probably brother and sister.
ashberg
member, 616 posts
Beware the Groove.
Groooooove.
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 03:37
  • msg #3

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

I just had a peek at HotB - and it's got some good ideas in it; but it's drenched in setting.

I'm thinking of something that is generalised enough to be applicable to any setting.

If nothing else exists; I'll have a crack at writing some lite rules to run something as an experiment here on RPOL, I daresay.
Nintaku
member, 487 posts
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 04:00
  • msg #4

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

See also the Stars Without Number faction rules, the Savage Worlds rules for communities from Broken Earth, the Fate rules for communities from Burn Shift, Cortex Plus's rules for factions from the "Players As Kingdoms" section of the Cortex Plus Hacker's Guide, and the Headquarters rules from Doctor Who's Defending the Earth: UNIT sourcebook.

There are several more, but these are the least steeped in their respective settings. Especially the Cortex Plus one. It's designed specifically as "generic rules for creating factions, businesses, communities, or kingdoms", and can be applied to anything with the right narration behind it. The Fate rules are also pretty blank slate, since that's simply an implementation of the Fate Fractal: treat communities as PCs on a larger scale and you're done there.
ashberg
member, 618 posts
Beware the Groove.
Groooooove.
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 05:11
  • msg #5

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Thanks Nintaku! Some awesome leads here. Muchly appreciated.

Fate & Cortex sound like the hottest leads at this point.

I SWN regularly, and the Faction Turns are fun, but don't lend themselves well to a group or PvP experience... That said, I could borrow some of the mechanics for Managing Assets. In other words, SWN Factions would only be a partial solution...
icosahedron152
member, 683 posts
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 07:39
  • msg #6

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Take a look at 'An Echo Resounding' by Kevin Crawford. It's pretty much what you're asking for and it's a lot simpler and more generic than HotB.

I'm interested in linking personal scale and strategic scale actions myself and I've looked into a number of rule sets. AER is the best I've found so far. If you want a more in-depth chat about this type of game development by Rmail, feel free to drop me a line. :)
ashberg
member, 619 posts
Beware the Groove.
Groooooove.
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 10:17
  • msg #7

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Okay. I've read some reviews of the Burn Shift Communities section; and it sounds very promising.

The underpinning framework could be recycled & mashed up with some other mechanics, like SWN's asset management. A player's primary character could be a senior member or elder in the faction; not necessarily the kingpin... which keeps things open...


Hmm... /me taps fingers & ponders on this some more...
Eduardo
member, 53 posts
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 12:56
  • msg #8

Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Reign has company rules that are kind of generic.
Flint_A
member, 571 posts
Wed 2 Nov 2016
at 13:49
  • msg #9

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

ashberg:
"Winning" isn't the ultimate goal here...


That really depends more on the players than the system.
ashberg
member, 621 posts
Thu 3 Nov 2016
at 04:35
  • [deleted]
  • msg #10

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

This message was deleted by a moderator, as it was against the forum rules, at 13:54, Thu 03 Nov 2016.
Sir Swindle
member, 107 posts
Thu 3 Nov 2016
at 13:10
  • msg #11

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

One Roll Engine has a game where you play mercenaries as a individuals and also control their company as a distinct character. I am totally blanking on the name but it's one of the One Roll Engine games on DriveThru.
Nintaku
member, 488 posts
Fri 4 Nov 2016
at 17:48
  • msg #12

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Sir Swindle, you're thinking of the game Eduardo brought up. It's called Reign, and was specifically designed for companies, factions, countries, planets, galaxy-spanning empires, all that good stuff. The best part is that it uses the same mechanics as the character-scale rules, very much like with Fate and Cortex Plus. Makes it super easy to get into. Definitely would have been on my list of suggestions, but I totally forgot about it. Good call, you guys. :D
StarMaster
member, 223 posts
Fri 4 Nov 2016
at 18:54
  • msg #13

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Even with a game system already, you might want to check out the rules for Birthright, CORPS, and even the Pathfinder Intrigue rules. Birthright was D&D turn-based development of a kingdom. CORPS was originally a conspiracy game (unless I'm getting my games mixed up), and the PF Intrigue is bound to have some additional ideas.
Malakhon
member, 1983 posts
Tue 15 Nov 2016
at 19:58
  • msg #14

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?


I love games like this but what I find difficult is not creating six mini-solo games happening in the same scenario.

If each of the player's is a stand alone star empire they may or may not have any need to interact.

I prefer starting with the players all belonging to the same Federation and they get to decide on council issues the same way a party of adventurers decide on whether to take the quest or trust the NPC.

They can pull out of the federation or go to war with their allies if they want too once it begins (just like you can pick the pockets of fellow party members in a more traditional AD&D game) but at least I've set the stage for the interaction so that there is some reason for them to interact.

I like to give them common goals but sometimes overlapping or counter goals. As an example, a game where the players are all running a fantasy Kingdom. The head of the Mage's Guild may want to keep a pristine swamp in tact because it a source of raw magical energy while another player may want to drain it and put up border keeps so that the kingdom can prosper on it's frontiers.


That is the essence to me of the most fun of RPG - more so than random encounters and dungeon crawls.
Jhaelan
member, 153 posts
Prefers roles to rolls
Based in UTC+1
Tue 15 Nov 2016
at 20:36
  • msg #15

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Federation campaigns work really well, if you've a set of players happy to collaborate. Naturally, like any party-based game, a bad apple sours things immensely
spectre
member, 844 posts
Myriad paths fell
away from that moment....
Tue 15 Nov 2016
at 21:17
  • msg #16

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

A god game's rules could easily be adapted to handle something like this with only a page of rules.
Malakhon
member, 1984 posts
Tue 15 Nov 2016
at 21:30
  • msg #17

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

Jhaelan:
Federation campaigns work really well, if you've a set of players happy to collaborate. Naturally, like any party-based game, a bad apple sours things immensely


Absolutely agreed.

I think there is this notion all RPG's must be some sort of Sandbox where you can play a Lord or a Fisherman or anything in between.

I prefer to give players freedom - but at least set the stage for things where they all share some stake from their faction or individual perspective and that is where we begin. I like to give them all resources they can trade or be stingy with - because the other mistake is to make each Kingdom quite self-sufficient.

I have had real life table top sessions where the players are like this:

Me as GM: : Okay you are all walking towards the Vale of the Magi on your quest and you come upon an Elf on the way. It is Jerry's character Applewinnigan.

Applewinnigan: "Hey guys, I am Applewinnigan an Elven Magi and if you are going to stop the Magi of the Vale I would like to help." says Jerry.

Dave the established Player: : "Why should we let this guy in our adventuring party?"

Me as GM: : "C'mon Dave, just do it. It's Jerry okay? He is just here for today and he has to go back to college. Can't you just let him in the group so we can move on?"

Dave the established Player: : "No, I would never trust someone just standing on the road waiting to go adventuring. He could be an agent of the Magi or the Mage himself seeking to trick us. I tell him "AppleWinnigan, you are a new adventurer are you? I bet you just spent 200GP on adventuring supplies on the back of the player's handbook, huh? or are you really an agent of the vale?" I cast magic missile.

Me as GM: : "C'mon Dave, not this again."


Which is why I am careful to craft a story that has some plausible reason for player interaction to begin immediately but also for ways to add players once it starts instead of just "well, this guy is a PC so you trust him for some reason and let him on the High Council."
This message was last edited by the user at 21:32, Tue 15 Nov 2016.
ashberg
member, 629 posts
Beware the Groove.
Groooooove.
Wed 16 Nov 2016
at 03:37
  • msg #18

Re: Players as Factions or Organisations: Is there such a thing?

In reply to Malakhon (msg # 17):

With the players I usually roll with; I couldn't imagine this happening... but I know enough about humans to appreciate this could quite easily occur.

I agree that establishing a framework of "us & them" gives the players equal footing to start from... ie, "The council has called you here to fight the forces of opposition".

Ie, engineer the start of the game to be an "us" framework to get the momentum started.

But then, as the game unfolds, challenge the PCs or PFs (because Factions) motives, morals & limits. Trying to allow some to fall into the "them" camp through role playing & player agency.

Ie, over time the inter-PF & PC relationships will develop, along with NPFs & Cs; to the point that texture & complexity has been allowed to grow organically; and players will naturally take sides as the situation & environment changes around them.

--

I'm using a mashup of Stars Without Number & Fate mechanics to run a "faction scale" game.
This message was last edited by the user at 03:38, Wed 16 Nov 2016.
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