Fuse - are Gang Anjo aware of where Oskar and Young's team are? I have assumed not, but I may be wrong.

In reply to Istvan Medgyessy (msg #933):

No. They don't know where anyone is except for the Major. Volodya's radio isn't working for some reason and JJM is the only person they've had direct contact with (although they did get in a brief firefight with the Mortar det at their old location).

How tall is Jed?

In reply to Robert Mitchell (msg #932):

Absolutely. There's a serious lack of communication between all elements with most unlikely to have a clue as to the disposition of anyone even a few dozen metres away - take JJ and Anjo for example, on opposite sides of a wall and about to grenade each other...

Naturally it's impossible for anyone to know anything about what's going on, unless of course they're the effective commander and all information is routed up to them in a timely manner. In our case we effectively no longer have a commander.In reply to Varis Babicevs (msg #935):

About 178cm (5'10").

Hey all, sorry for not posting  (this goes to all GM's present of games I'm in).  I've been pretty heavily involved in a research paper on Politburo - Military relations in the Soviet Union.*  Just about done though, then I'll let my sleep cycle recover and will be back up and ready to go.


_{*Hint: A bunch of paranoid political types finding creative ways to purge senior military leadership every few years.}

Just to say that your response is a complete twisting of what I said and that my criticism is for Jed (and for Jed alone) whose reaction, on being told that we're pulling out, was to try to get someone else to overload themselves with an AK rather than taking the opportunity to find out what was going on and to take command of the situation (as he is the ranking person amongst the rearguard).

In my book people are more important than equipment and a competent leader would know that.

In reply to Mike Catchings (msg #937):

No problem. We're still missing a couple posts so I'll hold off the turn for a little while longer.

Firstly, from my personal experience in the infantry, I've never once been less than overloaded in the field for more than about five minutes. This is situation normal and plans are made with this fact of life in mind.

Secondly, Jed is and always has been in the overloaded state ever since this battle was first in the planning stages. It's obvious to everyone who's laid eyes on him at any time in the prior several hours IC. In fact it's hard not to know this when you look at the equipment listed in his combat block in each IC post.
This situation is extremely unlikely to change.

And thirdly, if he's unable to run, he's the slowest in the group. Given that restriction, don't you think it's a good idea to carry as much firepower as possible without further slowing the group? from what I can see Rooke is lightly loaded with just his rifle, webbing and a few mags and definitely has the capability IC to carry more of the firepower the group so desperately NEEDS to SURVIVE.

And before anyone mentions that speed is key, let me point out that the rearguard is outnumbered something like 5 to 1, surrounded, their most likely path of escape currently has a BTR watching over it, and the ZSU was last seen in a position where it could very quickly support the BTR. The RPG represents the rearguard's ONLY known and effective AT capability.

Sure the AK mags aren't necessary - this is why they've been left behind without further comment. Even the mines aren't all that necessary, but they do have the potential to be used offensively, or slow the enemy behind the rearguard. I'm definitely not suggesting they need to be carried further if utilising them takes more than the few moments available.

And once again it comes back to communication. Jed (and others) simply doesn't know the full situation because nobody has communicated that effectively beyond yelling at their immediate companions.

Just take a look at what happened when Jed called for mortar support from Young. Young relocated the mortar without informing anyone, especially Jed, the acting Forward Observer of the fact. It took several rounds for Young to respond to the call and then, even before the fire mission was (in Jeds opinion) began to relocate a second time - this time radioing the information and a brief reason why. Now as Young is an NPC I'm certainly not going to hold it against Fuse (he's just following players lead in running the NPCs), but as a character and supposedly professional soldier, he should have acted differently.

Looking still further at comms, it's still unknown to most (not just Jed) that Weiss, St Gil, and many of the locals are dead, not to mention almost everyone is injured to some degree.

So, to summarise, we need everything we can get our hands on. If we don't we could well need it, or worse, it's left in the enemy's hands to use against us. Personally, I'm totally against my character being shot in the back by an NPC who happened to reload with a magazine one of my companions left behind.

I disagree with you about speed of movement being important and if Jed becomes the only person who is encumbered then he may well get left behind.

We'll see what happens!

Ok, lets put forward a scenario then...

The rearguard rushes out into the lane to our rear and finds there's enemy on the other side of it. Not a major problem, at least nothing a handful of grenades can't solve (using up about half of what's available).
This has involved a movement of what, half a dozen metres?

Then, across the wall, with the rearguard burning mag after mag back the way they came in order to keep pursuers heads down.

At this point the BTR comes into view. It's known by one or two members of the group that it took a 40mm grenade to the turret, and Jed knows he slotted a 12 gauge tungsten slug into it's already damaged suspension, but nobody knows if it's weapons still fire (according to the rules, Jeds hit should also have immobilised it for hours, but it's moved since so apparently not). Thanks to a certain officer's foresight, the group has an RPG to use against it and put an end to the stubborn damn vehicle once and for all.

Meyer takes the shot (he's the most skilled I think) and hits, blowing it to hell and back while others in the rearguard fend off the rapidly advancing infantry through the buildings with a couple more mags and a handful of grenades.

And then the ZSU rolls into sight, with all of it's 23mm barrels pointed directly at Meyers position...
Frantically the RPG is reloaded and the ZSU taken out leaving one RPG round left.

At this point the tank, realising that it must wait for infantry support before proceeding comes around to help finish off the rearguard to open a clear path eastward for the entire offensive. Meyer, with a little luck, takes it out after both Oskar and Frank miss/are ineffective with their weapons (provided they're even in a position, or willing to fire).

With only infantry remaining, the rearguard cross the roadway northward under cover of a couple of smoke grenades. By this time virtually all the frags are gone and most are down to their last couple of mags.

Now lets look at it again without the extra gear...

All is basically the same until the BTR appears. With no AT weapons available, at least half the rearguard are chewed up crossing the open road, even with copious use of smoke (which doesn't stop bullets nor autocannon rounds remember). Meanwhile, the enemy have found the RPG, etc that was left behind and put it to use against the rearguard from the 2nd floor. Althout the rearguard have some cover amongst bushes and rubble, the height advantage (and the fact the RPG can be fired indoors like an Armbrust) render this useless. This explosive weapon, plus the additional ammo and weapons others have gathered, is sufficient to wipe out the rearguard, almost to a man.

Now, can I make it any clearer why we need firepower when faced with overwhelming odds and armoured vehicles? Our path of retreat is cut off. We MUST cross open ground covered by automatic weapons. Those weapons MUST be dealt with.

This... this is offensive.

Personally, I've always been a fan of the Queen's Gambit, but I've never been able to get it to work. I still try occasionally though.
This message was last edited by the player at 13:34, Mon 11 Apr 2011.

Given that Oskar and Frank are about to climb aboard the Humvee, I'd have to say it's a definite possibility, no matter how good Oskar thinks he is.
Their injuries can't help either.

In reply to Jed Black (msg #942):

We can all write up potential situations one way or another.  It doesn't answer anything, only time will.  And just to be clear I've never objected to getting the RPG and if you had sent Rooke off to get it while Jed came do to get a better understanding of the situation then Rooke would have done so.

My point is simply that when Jed was told what that he needed to pull out his reaction was to tell Rooke to pick up a random spare AK and a few mines rather than attempting to provide some leadership as he's supposed to do.  That was a poor decision and has coloured everything else.

Personally I think that we should be pulling the bolts from Jed's Bren and Meyer's M240, ditching them and their ammo and then taking off at speed with Meyer on the RPG, Ferro carrying the spare rockets and everyone able to move a lot faster than they can at present.  The stuff that gets dumped won't be available for use by the enemy immediately (as there won't be any bolts in them) and will have a WP grenade thrown on it all as well anyway.

One thing.

Are you sure about this statement?

We had a discussion about this quite a while ago in the OOC thread and I was under the impression (as a result) that an RPG-16 had a significant backblast and therefore couldn't be fired indoors (in the same way that an Armbrust can be fired) without significant risk to the firer.

I'm not meaning the emergency set up you outlined where you use something solid behind you to provide cover - I'm mean in general.

Remember that Young did have Volodya and company briefly engage them in a firefight.  Yes none of the PC's know this, but with the mortar as close as it is there were risks involved.  Fortunately it seems no one was killed.

As for equipment, I see the logic in your argument, but I feel it's too late to go back and change anything.  Fighting OOC is pointless as it accomplishes nothing, and fighting IC will get you killed.  Actions have been posted, let's roll with it (get it, cause you roll dice.....).  Also, Jed is a newcomer and self-admitted asshole in an otherwise close knit unit.  My interpretation is some characters still respect rank, like Mitch and Mike, whereas some couldn't give a rats ass, like Field Marshal Friedmann and Rooke, so using that card isn't always going to be effective.  Both Rooke and Jed come across as sarcastic assholes who would probably be good in a bar together (Jed's overwhelming hatred of foreigners notwithstanding), but right now not so much.

In reply to Robert Mitchell (msg #946):

No, it is correct. The RPG can be fired indoors. I have a manual for the RPG-7 and I assume the RPG-16 is no different in that matter.

It does have a fairly strong backblast, but the rocket has two stages and the main backblast doesn't occur until the 2nd stage has fired (several meters out). This enables the launcher to be safely fired indoors, but at the cost of accuracy.
This message was last edited by the GM at 14:26, Mon 11 Apr 2011.

In reply to Fusilier (msg #948):

Balls, I misunderstood that discussion a while ago.  Sorry.


My apologies - I'll shut up about this now.


I reckon that Jed would kick Rooke's arse though!

No, actually I think I didn't get back to the discussion. I went off searching for the manual but ended up forgetting about it before I could make it clear what weapons could be fired or not. My fault.

In reply to Fusilier (msg #950):

OK - it's your fault then! <G>

A 49 year old Special Forces operator against a young British whipper snapper? No contest. ;)

They're both rated as "Above Average" for unarmed martial arts though so it would be interesting!

Rooke would cheat though.  He'd get Jed pissed first! <G>

Like I said, 49 year old operator from the deep south. You think he hasn't applied almost all of those years developing a resistance to alcohol (and punishing his liver)?

:D

In reply to Jed Black (msg #954):

Yea but Rooke is British and Jed is American and there are no finer drunken fighters than the British!  When it comes to drunken fighting we Brits are experts!

Beaten only by either the Scots, the Irish, or the Australians...

Of course Jed has learnt in all his years that clean fighting is a fast way to loose. That's why he carries an automatic shotgun. :P

That lassie got glassed, and no cunt leaves here till we find out what cunt did it.