OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE.   Posted by edgtheowson.Group: archive 0
Odel de Vries
 player, 478 posts
 Sommlending Knight
 Knight Dexter
Thu 3 Nov 2011
at 16:04
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
edgtheowson:
Wow, so it turns out the person who has the best ending was the one who got stabbed repeatedly to death by himself* and a Vordak! When did this become a call of Cthulhu game??? With Knud getting second place for at least doing his duty before being shot into obscurity :(

Now, aren't we a joyful lot? ;)



quote:
Powerful stuff Odel!

Thanks. This "broken" Odel is not entirely broken the way I intended him to be - somehow, it just turned out to be this way...



quote:
Anyway, I will be distracted until Sunday evening now, though should be able to answer questions if you have any from the revealed threads.

I'll be away this weekend, too.



Knud Anleifr:
Odel's last post made me think that maybe those who had tried capturing Torygan and failed (but survived) might in the end call themselves lucky.

Looks like Torygan's twisted nature was more than enough to twist Odel's nature and begin haunting some other guys in their sleep, too.



quote:
The direct link thread is cool, Edge - makes reading the story from the beginning very easy.

Second that, heartily.

This message was last edited by the player at 16:10, Thu 03 Nov 2011.

Knud Anleifr
 player, 459 posts
 Border Ranger
 Sommlending
Fri 4 Nov 2011
at 09:53
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Re-reading and skimming over the previous posts I realized there are also revealed private lines in OOC threads; with open cards, it gets quite an interesting read, I have to say. (For instance when Gwindel was planning on killing Knud some 4-5 pages of posts into the game. ;) And I have yet to see what Torygan was up to.)

It has only just now come to me: the sniper in the Wildlands was that dead Szall, reanimated by magic, right?

This message was last edited by the player at 09:58, Fri 04 Nov 2011.

edgtheowson
 GM, 1038 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Fri 4 Nov 2011
at 10:15
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Lol, indeed the private lines are half the fun!

Zipp was definitely fixated on killing you off at the start of the game, I think for the metagame fun of 'being' a different player/character as a disguise as much as that being a good tactic of the Helghast. Luckily for you, the opportunity never presented itself. Or lucky for him. He was a little overconfident in his abilitiers. Zipp's build meant he was vulnerable to normal weapons, and Knud had Mark of Instinct and Rider. And I hinted at horse reaction to darklanders. So the second Gwindel dropped his disguise to attack, he would have found a forewarned ranger. Perhaps a ranger on a bucking horse that Gwindel couldn't control and Knud could :)


Ah, the Szall :)  There was a village of Szalls that had been slaughtered by the giaks/Drakkarim (that's what the crows kept flying back to at the very start). It's a little bit of a waste of a Nadziran's power to animate Szalls. So he used a portion of the dead to pollute the underground stream at the source in the mountains (hence the contamination). The rest were to be used as a distraction.The idea being giak scouts would carry szalls around. If they cencountered a lone rider coming to/from the keep, they would kill that rider, and then deposit the Szall body. The Drakkar had used normal swords (though giak ragged blade marks might have been spotted beneath on a good perception roll).

So the idea was that any dead scouts/messengers would be found with evidence of Szall attacks - dead Szall with blade marks, most likely from the riders. The giak dropping his own blade in the process.

Thing is, giaks ain't smart. So when the sniper opportunity presented itself, the giak shoots at you guys, then drops the body of the Szall, and runs away. Even though, for a sniper attack with no counter attack and still living people, it makes no sense :D But that's the varioation of the orders that seemed 'logical' to the giak!

So the idea being to create a wft thing, that made logical sense to a giak but was actually stupid, and as you say it almost hints at the dead walking. So the giak unwittingly leaving you that clue, even though the Nadziran would have disguised his undead til far later otherwise (I love the 'Flint's body, where is it? stuff early on. Question - do you think Flint was standing watching Velena in the crypt when she got the water sample...?)

Of course, funnily Zipp spotted it was a giak arrow and yelled 'giak!', then made such a fuss about it that later that Arkan went off to kill crows and discover the undead second party. Gwindel even said 'Vordak!' at the double bluff vision that Velena overheard.


That's why, in 'A Murderer's Crow', the Nadziran isn't a happy bunny with Gwindel. Gwindel basically went 'Darklanders' loudly and clearly every step of the way. I think Zipp assumed I was bluffing, when in reality I was double bluffing, and looking forwards to playing it straight with the classic creatures. After screwing with your heads first and distracting you as I could. After all, giaks are scary if they arehidden snipers or assaulting you alone. Or a tide charging at crappy defenses. Drakkarim are hardy evil warriors. Sadly the Vordak did not get to be the silent, creeping death and unsettings figures in the distances that I hoped they'd get to be, though they were still wonderfully tough opponents.


Yeah, my idea for how the game would play out was wildly different from how it turned out. No more time to type, really, but will have to post about my expectations later :D
edgtheowson
 GM, 1039 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Fri 4 Nov 2011
at 10:19
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Oh, one last thing, I almost regret mentioning the Helghast and a player controlled Helghast when Knud was facing Flint alone in the crypt stairs. I was trying to create a low expectation and creepy atmosphere where a single undead foe was scary enough, or even nothing could be terrifying, without it needing  to be 'you might get killed by an unkillable thing!) That was for later :D

Still worked well, I just regret building upon that beat too far!
Skyldig Avsvaghen
 player, 319 posts
 Corporal
 Sommlending army
Fri 4 Nov 2011
at 11:12
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Wow. Aren't we a cheery lot?

Spent far too long reading to post anything now, I think, but if I manage it, it will have to be something with flowers and candyfloss and balloons.

Top stuff though y'all - have been internet-cafe-ing for an extra hour due to the compellingness of it all! :)

Not got on to the secret threads revealed bits yet, but I know it's gonna be cool. Just why couldn't this have ended when I was at home!? :D
Knud Anleifr
 player, 460 posts
 Border Ranger
 Sommlending
Fri 4 Nov 2011
at 14:21
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Heh, I like that 'Giaks are stupid in their own way' bit. And as you say - things went differently than how I have expected; and in my opinion that's a very interesting aspect of RPing (you never know how players/GM will react to one's ideas).

I keep forgetting Gwindel/Akakaan was vulnerable to normal weapons. But I hadn't even expected a Helghast in the game until told by Gwindel. So Flint was scary enough for Knud I'd say (saving Gorste was one of the several moments when I had really tough, but simultaneously fun, time deciding what to do). I thought him to be something akin to Vordak - a powerful undead.

Well, will keep reading on.

Skyl, I'm not sure whether you're being serious about Skyl's epilogue, neither I'm sure which way I want it to be. :)

[Private to edgtheowson: Since I'm reading through the game anyways, I though I'd help with linking individual sub-threads in the STORY ORDER tread:
 - Growing Anxiety (concurrent with pages 5-6, message #122 - #127 of 'The Wildlands' thread)
]

This message was last edited by the player at 20:11, Fri 04 Nov 2011.

Skyldig Avsvaghen
 player, 321 posts
 Corporal
 Sommlending army
Fri 4 Nov 2011
at 22:24
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Oh yeah, I knew what I forgot to say amongst all the gloom: Three cheers for Teeley having survived! :D His not being added to the looooong list of NPC casualties did rather become a high priority for me from early in the attack on the keep, particularly having nearly killed him myself when trying to fend off an invisible giak!

That's something I have been wondering for....well, pretty much for as long as Teeley's been with us Keep types: when I read the Wildlands thread it may well enlighten me, but is/was Teeley the decent chap I took him to be? For Skyl he kind of rose to be almost as important as Knud, and likely more important than anyone else, except hapless NPC soldiers who have to come first because they just do. But as a player, I had to occasionally wonder if I'd made a mistake and he wasn't really the genuine, honourable man Skyl had taken him for.
Velena
 player, 557 posts
 Brotherhood Mage
Sat 5 Nov 2011
at 01:21
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Yeah, I;m kind of interested in the NPC back stories/plot ideas, if you have it. I sort of became attached to the good lieutenant, Falla, Chills, and Halbrow. Heck even Golgem. I sort of got the impression there was something shaddy going on with Falla and Halbrow.
edgtheowson
 GM, 1040 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Sat 5 Nov 2011
at 08:01
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Yay, candy and unicorn ending! And who doesn't like balloons? Tie some kittens to them and we are golden.

And lol, once more Zipp tipped the Helghast angle. I totally forgot that too. I wonder how long the Darklands paranoia would have taken to manifest - or if it would have at all - without those comments? :)

[Private to Knud Anleifr: Cheers for the stuff!! No need to make it private, really, though iat least it jumped out at me :)]



Yeah, Teelay and at least the senior mercenaries were supposed to be 'good', though of course just as flexible to the corruption of hopelessness and so forth as anyone.

Teelay's story was that he had been a commander in the Slovian army, and had previously lost soldiers under his command to spurious reasons and the shifting p[olitics of the Stornlands and the various battles. He basically took a few known soldiers and simply left the whole area becoming a mercenary instead. Hence, he had that sort of military honour that perhaps a lesser mercenary might not. He had grown a tight knit company and had operated out of Kadan mist recently, where he also had some romantic entanglements.

The idea was that this Torygan situation had caught him right when he was breaking in a selection of new recruits. And that the actual battle with Torygan had cost him some of his senior men - the ones who would have attacked with him first, obviously, the juniors not as reckless given their new status. afetr all, they were only fighting for the money right then!

So there was this odd divide at the start of the game. Teelay - superstitious anyway - was rightly paranoid that they were being watched, and so drove the company recklessly in the dark out of Kadan and in to the Wildands, which proved trickier to negotiate than normal. Obviously, he had simmering resentment to the junior men under his command now, especially as they would still expect the same cut, and also a fear for something happening to the rest of the senior men under his command - subconciously having so many of them die at once shaking his faith in himself.

Obviously, to the senior men, they felt the a little of the resentment to the junior men too, but knew they needed to keep the comapny together, so hated being piggy in the middle with Teelay. Plus of course Teelay was acting strangely and not communicating.

And as far as the junior men would go, they obviously had signed up to a crazy company that ent right for a mage of Torygan's power, and now even though they had all captured him, the seniors and the Captain were acting pissy at them. So obviously a worry over the honesty of the company they had joined, and a worry over being paid.

And that's before you factor in the worry of what the Sommlending might be like, and if they would pay! :p


So as you can see, they senior mercenaries and Teelay were, indeed, good. even someone like Blake, who came across as an obnoxious bully to start with, was a person who would stand shoulder to shoulder instantly in the fighting and along with Velena talked Clive through killing Flint. However there was enough tension and wedges introduced that they may well have done bad things had things gone badly. Obviously that was spotted with Tuld, where the medic kept his sympathy and felt at odds with Teelay, and Teelay even allowed the medic to trail behind. You can bet that will haunt Teelay for the rest of his life :(


So fear not Skyldig! Your actions kept the senior mercenaries and Teelay on an even keel, and even ensured the Teelay/Tor tensions and even possible split disappeared so they could respect each other in the end. They were indeed good, and even though the rest of the mercenaries died (didn't want that!) they died fighting at the side of the keep. Of course, for Teelay it was the worst and best thing. as you can see, a terrible tragedy for him as his worst fears happened again. But it's also the distancing thing - combined with perhaps Tor's own influence - that meant Teelay will make an effective leader in the Slovian army again. So yes, once more bittersweet - he lost his company and walked away from whatever life he might have had in Kadan, but reconnected with his homeland and came full circle back to where he had once been.



Falla and Halbrow, darn I had a chart to denote their relationship as family. Perhaps I will wait until I find it so I can post a little better with their relationship - that and time marches on and this post is getting huge :)


Lieutenant Tor and medic Tyna were the only two volunteers to the keep. Tyna had been a very good battlefield medic who had always been on the front lines as it were in the small skirmishes that Sommerlund would have undertaken, and so was getting burnt out. She had been allowed to rotate to the keep for an extended period, and basically could have arranged a transfer back out at any time - and undoubtedly would have by MS5050. I was never quite sure if Tor had known her / known of her and suggested it or not. Obviously they never had further interactions for me to figure that one out :)

Tor was a good organiser, and a good warrior, but seen to be a poor strategist and leader. Hence he was usually kept far back at the equivalent of desk jobs as he had advanced. Tor basically saw an opportunity to mold the poor post, and was happily given it. And his influence before and after Outler was assigned there probably kept the keep together. Obviously, in times of stress he was by default not as good - see his ideas that led to the keep not being at full fitness, and his inability to focus on more than one thing.

Obviously, he was another good man that his inflexibility and discomfort in a crisis might have seen doing very bad things. He and Teelay could have come to metaphorical or even real blows, and obviously we saw the tensions that developed with Gwindel and Odel/Arkan to the point that they were all locked up at some point!

Still, the man was the first to jump in front of a Helghast and he at least tried to rally the men. Although some of his decisions were questionable at the end, they came from a place of him actually leading men by directly taking on responsibility for the situation, rather than trying to shepherd them and trying to figure out the best way to maintain order and work things through. And so I guess it all came good. Certainly, he's done what Teelay did from the opposite point of view. Where Teelay connected with him men perhaps too much, and now sadly with the disconnect will be a better commander, obvouslyt Tor earned the respect of the remaining keep men who have followed him. So at Alema you know he would have had a connection to build upon and a greater certainty in his actions that would have seen him become a better commander in all situations.

Whether he survived or not... I will leave that to your imaginations. History seems to have not mentioned it one way or the other :)


Ok, I'm going to have to leave it there for the moment, but I'll do another post regarding some of the others - certainly Falla and Halbrow - when I ge a moment :)
Knud Anleifr
 player, 461 posts
 Border Ranger
 Sommlending
Sat 5 Nov 2011
at 09:41
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Interesting stuff! Good to hear that about Teelay - I came to like the man, too.

Edg...:
I wonder how long the Darklands paranoia would have taken to manifest - or if it would have at all - without those comments? :)

As a player I did expected an attack on the keep (only a direct one, though), which transferred to Knud feeling uneasy (when he had a rare moment to stop and think about such things) (I hope it's not too meta-game-y, but I think anyone would feel 'nervous' having Torygan in the keep and would expect the mage'd attempt an escape before crossing Sommerlund's borders.) The involvement of the Darklands would certainly not be the first guess, though, indeed.

I know you're probably tight on time this weekend, but could you also share Jobard's backstory? Come on - a store man who fights better than many a soldier (my impression, at least)? There must be something to it... :)
edgtheowson
 GM, 1041 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Sat 5 Nov 2011
at 10:02
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Jobard was the son of a middle noble (see that his full name on the roster even has 'the Second' attached :D). He was given all the training in sword and horse, etc you'd expect of a noble, but had such an entitled and selfish attitude to it all - even though his family were not that highly placed - that he failed to get in to the knighthood that one might expect, and certainly had no talents for magic nor potential as a Kai. He become an ordinary solder, where his sense of entitlement still did not abate, and turned to petty thefts for profit and other abuses of his position.

Basically, where Skyldig's backstory has a similar thing and Skyldig was saved by the higher regard people held for him, Jobard was only 'saved' by the few connections his family still possessed, fighting to at least keep him in the military. Jobard was still stripped of any standing as a soldier, attached as the storeman of the keep. Being in amongst others woith more reason to resent thier positions, and even the fresh faced new soldiers who still had some odd spark to them despite their terrible positing probably kept him from being compltely bitter and carrying on his old ways. Certainly making him question his position he'd let himself come to. Captain Outler and Lieutenant Tor, in different ways, probably softened him to his situation aswell. Certain by the time the game started, he was a quiet presence who simply did his job, even if some of the soldiers would not have fully trusted him.

Had he survived the attack - especially given some of the fights he was in and people he fought beside - I think he would have turned over a new leaf. :(
Skyldig Avsvaghen
 player, 323 posts
 Corporal
 Sommlending army
Sat 5 Nov 2011
at 22:39
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Apologies, apologies. Skyl's epilogue got kind of out of hand and goes on a bit. And then a bit more. And then a lot more.

So, er, sorry about that.

Ooh, it says below that we're nearing a 1000 post limit. Does that mean we need a new OUT OF CHARACTER EPILOGUE thread? :D
edgtheowson
 GM, 1042 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Sat 5 Nov 2011
at 23:33
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Fine, force my hand in to revealing your backstory first so that nice closure makes sense to everyone else! I love the twisted complex emotion of the ending too :D


This OOC thread I will indeed have to close - nicely timed -  and reveal the hidden discussion thread I created to hang around and catch any end comments in. I might slip all the old answers in to it, and leave this one as the final ga,e comments thread :)


Not tonight, of course! Still, skyldig had given you all something cool to read in my absense, so it's all good.


Now go enjoy Europe and stop using internet cafes Skyldig! We;ll be here when you get back properly :p
Knud Anleifr
 player, 462 posts
 Border Ranger
 Sommlending
Sun 6 Nov 2011
at 13:31
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Hehee, we did get candy and balloons. :) Nice!
edgtheowson
 GM, 1044 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Sun 6 Nov 2011
at 16:42
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Did I miss them between the savage beatings and the Skyldig hatred? :p
Knud Anleifr
 player, 463 posts
 Border Ranger
 Sommlending
Sun 6 Nov 2011
at 17:34
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
--- SPOILER below for anyone not having read the IC (Epilogue) thread ---

Skyl:
So Skyl's cousin Bleget wouldn't be up to his usual tricks for a while - not with jelly for light-fingers and a purple balloon for a smooth-talking face - but so what?

I thought that was a nod towards our previous conversation (calling jelly candy wasn't a stretch to my non-native-English-speaker ears).

This message was last edited by the player at 17:35, Sun 06 Nov 2011.

edgtheowson
 GM, 1045 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Sun 6 Nov 2011
at 19:59
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

LMAO!


I blame the circumstances that I was reading it (in between mum doing things) for me not spotting the brilliant significance of the wording :D


Now I doubly love it!
Odel de Vries
 player, 479 posts
 Sommlending Knight
 Knight Dexter
Sun 6 Nov 2011
at 23:16
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Geee, Skyl. Is that a book excerpt or something? Looks like it is ;)

Very nice, very nice...
edgtheowson
 GM, 1048 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 20:57
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Getting to work on the charcter threads, so you'll probably start seeing threads by yourselves that you never posted. Let me know if anything needs changed, if you can't edit it yourself.


Next will be closing this OOC thread and opening a new geeneral thread before we hit the 1000 post limit. I'll transfer a few of the posts to that new thread, and then add a few NPC revelations for your consideration too.


And then *sniff* that will be it, really. Nothing left to do but admire all the hard work of you guys, wonder why I never managed to edit half my post before hitting send, and maybe occasionally leaving a question regarding something it took you months to realise was evil/sneaky/bad/wrong
Velena
 player, 559 posts
 Brotherhood Mage
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 21:43
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
I'm so jealous of all of you with CS scores in the double digits. . .curses!

Also, damn posting all this must be mountains of work, Beo. Thanks, and you rock, and all that :-)
edgtheowson
 GM, 1050 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 21:54
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

It's just my notes I trimmed from PMs, etc. The only work is trying to decide how to arrange it in a way that's even semi-useful :)

Eh, if your raw CS roll had been higher, you'd have gone with a warrior and we'd have never had Velena! No undercutting Knud and Skyldig, no stopping the posioning, no fun interactions and investigations, oh and of course no stopping the Nadzirtan's magical powers stone dead in the final battle!

Skyldig and Odel really tanked it up this game with the highest CCs, and their EPs were (respectively) -18 and 2 by the end of the game. Wait, Skyldig might have ended up on -24 or so upon death, I forget!

Even Torygan ended up on 1EP, and he scrounged some healing not long before. So yeah, I htink high CS was overrated. At best it made the player confident, and at worst it painted a target on the player's back :D
Velena
 player, 560 posts
 Brotherhood Mage
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 21:58
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Although in my case it made for a one shot player death :(

But yeah, I think I liked playing the mage background type over warrior (althought the violent crazy warrior I'm playing now is fun for other reasons).

On the note of Sky's EP - that has got to be a record or something, I mean. . .hot damn o.o
edgtheowson
 GM, 1051 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 22:09
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE
Yeah, several factors kinda combined there to make for that :( Good one player roll, bad other player roll, the gamble on the Net spell which if successful would have stuffed Torygan, so kinda needed a similar megative risk, a double damage weapon not recovered from a Vordak earlier, and that pesky raised undead who also rolled well and added a CS bonus :( If I coulda mitigated the auto-kill in a way that didn't completely screw over Torygan in the process I woulda (he did have two foes moving forwards to flank at the time and as I said he risked being captured in the Net without a save if you'd aced that roll). Sadly it just became a coin toss between you two.

Still, for a low CS caster Velena managed to Net the undead Lok without apparently breaking a sweat earlier, and certainly the well placed Mind Charms managed to turn the tide a couple of times. Heck, let's not forget the crow was one-shotted to death and completely obliterated the Nadziran's psychic range. Dice are funny things :(



And yeah, even Skyldig on his CS 23 at the time was taking double damage from a CS 22 Vordak foe. His nobility pledge gave him three rounds grace when fighting with a lower ranked soldier (Hope in this case), but yeah, I might have needed to invoke the forewarned rule of sanity regarding exceptional damage if he managed to get to his EP total again in negative!
edgtheowson
 GM, 1052 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 22:55
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Ok, I'm starting to flag now! Anyway, the straightforward character sheets are up now, as well as the slightly less straightforward sheet of Odel's :)

I left creation of Odel's character mostly in at the end, hoping it is of interest to you all!


I might leave Akakaan and Torygan's threads until tomorrow - them being the more complicated, in some ways. Certainly Akakaan's, you'll see how his entry complicated the plot fiurther :)
edgtheowson
 GM, 1059 posts
 Dreamweaver
 Deceiver
Mon 7 Nov 2011
at 23:13
Re: OUT OF CHARACTER: FINALE

Lol, and last of my occasional triple posts! I've opened up a new discussion thread so this one can be closed before it hits 1000 posts. Since we've only just started discussing some game stuff in here, I thought it made sense to repost those questions and answers in that post for rveryone to find them more easily.


See you in the other thread, I guess!