OOC: Utterly Out-of-Character.   Posted by Control.Group: 0
 player, 67 posts
Thu 6 Apr 2017
at 21:14
Sorry folks.  It's done.
I'm really enjoying that DFA character creation, and am playing another over at Tavern Keeper. Feel free to rmail me when you get settled enough to start one.
 Player, 126 posts
Fri 7 Apr 2017
at 04:05
Sorry folks.  It's done.
In reply to Control (msg # 67):

I'm always up for viewing your work! So, you didn't like the DFA take on spellcasting then?
 Player, 210 posts
Fri 7 Apr 2017
at 11:10
Sorry folks.  It's done.
I'm in!

I'd be really happy to see some work arounds for thaumaturgy.  Making any kind of magical item or setting up a simple ward is extremely difficult!

The mechanics steers like a train.
 GM, 443 posts
Mon 10 Apr 2017
at 08:27
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
So, you didn't like the DFA take on spellcasting then?

I did, actually.   I'm probably going to mine it for putting together the Ritual step-by-step.

This system is meant to be integrated into a fantasy setting for Fate Core, where anybody has the potential to perform ritual magic, but only the really talented or educated can perform fast-casts.     Of course, talent and education will really help the ability to perform rituals, too...

I'm not sure if I've made this simple and straight-forward enough.  And, obviously, it's not near finished.     I started a fate core game before shutting everything down, and I liked the integration of magic into the general world...

Hopefully, I don't go too far off-track.

Magical Aptitude:  The Magical Aspect
The Magical Aspect reflects that a character has some innate magical aptitude.  This may or may not be expressed in the character.  In order for a character to justify a Mana stress-track, one must have a Magical Aspect somewhere in the character build.

The Mana Stress-Tracks
The Mana Stress-track is based on the LORE skill.  Like other stress-tracks, it has 2-dots as a base, 3-dots for Lore(+1) and Lore(+2), 4-dots for Lore(+3) or Lore(+4).  While the Mana Stress Track may not exceed 4, Stunts can be built to alter the Stress Track.

Lore Rating
Lore(+0)2 dotsMana OO 
Lore(+1)3 dotsMana OOO 
Lore(+2)3 dotsMana OOOMay be able to create one-use enchantments
Lore(+3)4 dotsMana OOOOMay be able to create multiple-use enchantments
Lore(+4)4 dotsMana OOOOMay be able to create permanent enchantments

Some variations are possible where a character has a Magic Aspect but not a Mana Stress-Track, or vice-versa:
  • UNAWAKENED ADEPT - Lore(+0) with a Mana Stress-track
    This guy has enormous potential that has never been realized...  He might be stuck to fairly mundane ritual magics, or might believe he has no competence in magic at all.
  • MAGICAL SCHOLAR - Lore(+4) but no Mana Stress-track
    He's done all the research... He knows the stuff, but the player has chosen for him to NOT have any magical ability, no matter how much he might wish it.

Channeling and Ritual Magic
Mechanically there are two types of magic:  Channeling and Ritual Magic.

Channeling is the immediate direction of energy through sheer will.  It can be used to attack, overcome, defend, or create an advantage.  It is a fast-cast kind of thing done with no other preparation than the narrative focusing of one's will.

Channeling is available only to those with magical potential (represented by a Mana stress-track and at least one Aspect that represents magical ability).

To channel magic, the caster must declare how much power to call, then roll 4dF + WILL to determine how much power he successfully calls.   He will take one mana-stress for each casting, and one stress for each shift he calls upon that exceeds his LORE rating.

If the roll was negative, this amount is leeched from the caster's Mana stress track first, then one of the other stress-tracks (player's choice).

Casting Channeling Magic
Details forthcoming

Ritual Magic
Ritual Magic covers magic that take time to shape.

Ritual allow one to create lasting changes (enchantment, abjuration, etc.), provide inaccessible knowledge (tracking & divination, etc.), allow interactions with the supernatural (summoning, binding, etc.), the shaping of magical energies into physical forms (conjuration & illusion, etc.) and the discovery of the solutions to improbable problems.  This too can be expressed as an attack, defend, overcome or create-an-advantage, but scale rules may apply.

Anybody may cast a ritual, provided they have the appropriate narrative resources.   While a Mana stress-track may help, it is not required for casting ritual spells.

Rituals are not instantaneous, though they can be very quick.  The benefit to ritual magic is that is enormous power can be raised over time with comparative safety.

At advanced levels, rituals can be used to create enchantments on objects (magic swords, etc.), foods (magic potions), etc. This would require levels of the LORE skill.

Casting Ritual Magic
Details forthcoming

Mana Consequences
Those who've chosen to have their character with a Mana Stress-Track may also take on Magic Consequences.  These are consequences that come on from over-exerting ones-self with Magic.  Cast too much magic or overreach yourself, and you risk taking on Magical Consequences.

Like the other Consequence tracks, all characters have one minor(-2), one moderate(-4) and one major(-6) Magic Consequence.   These may manifest, narratively, as physical, social or mental consequences, but they are funded by mana, and can only be healed through the application of magic.

In addition, there is the possibility of a Massive(-8) magic Consequence, which requires the cost of changing one of the existing Aspects into a corrupted version of itself.   In this way, a mage who consistently over-extends himself runs the risk of becoming a twisted, corrupted version of himself.

I haven't decided if taking on a massive magic consequence should clear away all other magic consequences or not.  On the one hand, I like it because it gives a cheap and easy way out... with an associated narrative cost that twists the individual's very nature.

This message was last edited by the GM at 22:39, Mon 10 Apr 2017.

 player, 68 posts
Mon 10 Apr 2017
at 20:15
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
Well, I look at this and want to write up a magical scholar/artificer.

Does this magic work with technology? How about healing?
 GM, 444 posts
Mon 10 Apr 2017
at 22:58
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
Thanks for taking a look at it!

The setting has a generalized feel of late medieval.  Just before the introduction of gunpowder.   But there is no inherent incompatibility of magic & science in the associated setting.

I've renamed Fate Core's LORE skill to SCHOLARSHIP.  I figure that the application of lore (as a separate skill entirely) will reflect magical learning and/or training.  If one is going to cast big magics, one should understand the risks and rewards.   There will always be some fool willing to take on those risks!

The Magical Scholar
The magical scholar might still be able to cast rituals. He might potentially be able to do some very complex rituals, because he has Lore for it.   It would be entirely up to you, as the player, whether he can or not.

It's one of the logical "it-follows" of this set-up that very complex and very powerful rituals could quite potentially be performed by the mundane folks.  So, as a result, there is the existence of a "magical college", sort of like a college of heralds and possibly, I suppose, a little like Hogwarts.  I sort of envision it more like the College in the Heralds of Valdemar series...  a very big part of the collegiate alumni's role is to "police" ritual magic.

The policing of ritual magics isn't like the Dresden Files seven laws...  it's simply keeping the more complex rituals out of the public access.   This does, however, result in silo-ing and hoarding of magical recipes.   In the now-defunct game, we'd worked out the idea that there had been a war between countries and great magics were brought to bear, decimating a great swath of land.  The collegiate was formed to ensure that that kind of destruction wouldn't happen again.  Of course, different kingdoms police this in different ways.

I considered tweaking things a little to make magic a little more inaccessible, but I figure I can keep it narrative, and state that in the setting magic potential is present in a huge amount of the population, but it's just not realized in all but a very few.   I can see the mundane populace using cantrip-level spells in every-day life.  Anything to make things easier.

Again, thanks for looking it over.

I figure, if I've barred myself from playing or running until I'm settled, I can still keep some rule-familiarity by playing with this.
 player, 69 posts
Mon 10 Apr 2017
at 23:11
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
So you don't want to play with the idea of a world where larger rituals are incorporated into how the world works (no one bothers inventing gunpowder, instead relying on fireball wands; sailing is only done by explorers because, once at a destination, the ship's scholar can create a teleportation ring to tie into the worldwide transportation network; healing charms have largely stymied the study of anatomy and the need for surgery, but counterfeit healing charms are a booming industry; and so on)? If any trained scholar can use ritual to create permanent enchantments, many will.
 Player, 211 posts
Mon 10 Apr 2017
at 23:20
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
What is the scaling on rituals?

Is a +1 ritual ward a significant deterrent to a thief?  A dog posing on the lawn?

How difficult is it to do the equivalent of a professionally competent ritual?   How much protection does it provide?
 GM, 445 posts
Tue 11 Apr 2017
at 05:10
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
Admittedly, this approach was built to allow the two casters in the game to battle-cast.  I just want Rituals to be accessible from an intellectual standpoint... and do-able if not easy for the general populace.

Larger rituals are a part of the world.   But like, say, nuclear power, it's secrets are pretty closely guarded.  It's one thing to have all the necessary resources, it's another thing to know how to put it all together in the proper form.

I haven't gone so far as to define to what extent the magic has been integrated into the day-to-day workings.   I figure that's very much the sort of thing the table can work out together when setting up the game, itself.   I don't feel I need to define that.  In this way, the potential is there for an Earthdawn-esque setting (where magic is as natural as breathing) or a more sedated approach.  So long as magic has an impact and must cost the caster enough that he's got to weigh whether it's worth casting, I'm satisfied.

If any trained lore-scholar can use rituals to create permanent enchantments, many will.

Yup.  But the cost for making something permanent needs to be sufficiently high to ensure that the enchantment can be triggered and recharged...  There really should be magical artifacts that powerful out in the world.  This is where the idea of scale comes in, I think.  So, I foresee future work on Rituals to include a rough approach to costing a Ritual out.

I don't really want to create a menu-list for rituals.  But I feel I can give rough ideas for costs of the factors involved.  It should all be subject to discussion, anyway.
 GM, 446 posts
Tue 11 Apr 2017
at 05:26
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
A +1 ritual ward should provide a +1 barrier for the thief to overcome.

I'd imagine that most thieves wouldn't be magic-users.  From a strictly dice perspective an unskilled(+0) thief might still roll 4dF(+4), giving him a +4 to overcome to +1 Ward...  Of course, there's really only a 1.2% chance that'll happen...   In fact, a +1 ward will typically present and unskilled thief with a 38% chance to overcome, without any Aspects invoked.

  -4       1/81        1.235%
  -3       4/81        4.938%
  -2      10/81       12.346%
  -1      16/81       19.753%
   0      19/81       23.457%
   1      16/81       19.753%
   2      10/81       12.346%
   3       4/81        4.938%
   4       1/81        1.235%

I accept that there's a huge difference between doing a commonplace rote ritual to light a fire in the hearth and a larger ritual to set the entire church on fire.   Or, that and setting a single, specific candle on fire inside the church a block away...

I haven't looked too closely at scale yet.
 player, 70 posts
Tue 11 Apr 2017
at 06:46
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
So long as magic has an impact and must cost the caster enough that he's got to weigh whether it's worth casting, I'm satisfied.

So, what sorts of costs are you thinking for ritual magicians with no Mana pool, besides time?
 GM, 447 posts
Tue 11 Apr 2017
at 19:19
Re: Sorry folks.  It's done.
Still working on it:

But the first step, I figure, is to introduce other facets to the Ladder:

Basic defaults are in Bold Blue
The LadderTimeMassDistance
2 Terrible
1 Poor
+0 Mediocre
+1 Average
+2 Fair
+3 Good
+4 Great
+5 Superb
+6 Fantastic
+7 Epic
+8 Legendary

An Instant
A few moments
Half a minute
A Minute
A few minutes
15 minutes
Half an hour
An hour
A Few hours
An afternoon
A day
A few days
A week
A few weeks
A month
A few months
A Season
Half a year
A year
A few years
A decade
A generation
A mortal lifetime
Several mortal lifetimes
1 pound
5 pounds
20 pounds
50 pounds
100 pounds
250 pounds
500 pounds
2000 pounds
1 ton
5 tons
20 tons
50 tons

1 foot
5 feet
20 feet
50 feet
100 feet
500 feet
2000 feet
1/2 mile
1 mile
5 miles
20 miles
50 miles
100 miles
500 miles
2000 miles
5000 miles

So... Want to teleport a 5 pound package (=2) to the next village over (call it 5 miles +7)... it'd cost +5 shifts, right off the bat, not including other modifiers such as:
  • Specific spell components (symbolic & sympathetic magic)
  • Assistance  (power of numbers)
  • Special Requirements (specific place, time, etc.)
  • Attention/Distraction
  • Elevated Complexities (conditional and/or multiple triggers, conditional and/or multiple disablers)
  • Other circumstances (perhaps a teleport spell needs to overcome a ward?)

If there's no drama behind it, why even bother statting it out?  If the character has all the time in the world and meets or can meet all the requirements, call it a success and move on.

Mechanics should only come into it when it matters, when there's drama.  So, maybe the PC has to spirit a child away to it's aunt and uncle before the raiders attack...  That kind of situation suggests that we'd need to discuss the the need for appropriate time for the ritual and concentration, probably also some sort of sympathetic magic representing the location the child should be sent to...  Otherwise, it might end up anywhere in the general vicinity of the aunt & uncle's place (which, in the face of a raider's attack, might well be good enough).

It is quite possible that there are circumstances in play that the PCs are not aware of.   The PCs calculate out their requirements and perform the ritual but it doesn't succeed.  Why?  Well, the table knows that there's a +3 Ward around the house, preventing any magic from going in or going out.   They need to add another +3 shifts to their magic to overcome it.    What if there's also a ward around the place they want to send the child?

Ultimately, this needs to be a discussion of the table.
 NPC, 3 posts
Tue 18 Apr 2017
at 06:25
DFA: River City
Who all is in the DFA River City game?

From the looks of things, The GM of that game got his alternate account (Gryhawk) banned.
 If he got into an argument with the moderators, or tried to create a different second account, he might've had his account pulled altogether.   I don't know anythign but what I saw in the Double Trouble (aka, Identity Crisis) thread.   I hope he comes back in time to pull it together.

This message was last edited by the player at 06:25, Tue 18 Apr 2017.

 Player, 212 posts
Tue 18 Apr 2017
at 23:54
DFA: River City
It's like someone is shining a big spot light that says: please GM soon!

 Player, 49 posts
Wed 19 Apr 2017
at 00:45
DFA: River City
I am in it.
 Player, 50 posts
Wed 19 Apr 2017
at 00:46
DFA: River City
What kind of stuff do you gotta do to get banned?
 GM, 449 posts
Wed 19 Apr 2017
at 02:19
DFA: River City

I have come close a couple of times, and both times it came down to talking back to the moderators.  The reality is... no matter what you might think of the site or the people who maintain it, without a money-model behind it, the site is the equivalent of private property.  The owners can always tell you to get out.

The supervisor who I put forth to replace me is down south getting some training and undergoing her regulatory interviews.  So, hopefully, I'll have an exit date soon.
 Player, 51 posts
Wed 19 Apr 2017
at 07:30
DFA: River City
 GM, 450 posts
Sat 22 Apr 2017
at 02:45
DFA: River City
If you guys want, I'm willing to take you guys on.  Since I've been lurking, I know that you've got some neat characters and have given some real thought to tying them together and to developing the setting.

I'm not trying to hijack the other game, but I don't want to see your work go to waste.  I'm willing to take your characters on with a minimum of discussion.

I have glanced through the rulebook, but don't consider myself conversant with it.  Have barely played, let alone run a FAE game.

I've got a game set-up at:
link to another game

You're welcome to suggest this to the other players (though, out of courtesy, I suggest getting their RPOL-ID and doing it via rMail rather than in the game threads or even Private threads in that game).

To be clear, if that GM comes back, I'm all for you pushing forward with that game.   Playing with me comes with an inconsistent schedule and the guarantee of a week or two disappearance during my move.... for which I still don't have an ETA.
 Player, 213 posts
Sat 22 Apr 2017
at 02:50
DFA: River City
Is this one open to those of us not already in the DFA game?
 GM, 451 posts
Sat 22 Apr 2017
at 06:31
DFA: River City
Yup.  might as well be.

Don't expect a faster pace until I move and get settled.
 GM, 452 posts
Thu 4 May 2017
at 21:31
CLosing this one down
Deleting this game soon.

Want the 1000th post?

Respond quick.

This message was last edited by the GM at 21:49, Thu 04 May 2017.

 Player, 162 posts
Thu 4 May 2017
at 21:41
CLosing this one down
Make sure the last one out turns off the lights.
 Player, 52 posts
Thu 4 May 2017
at 21:51
CLosing this one down

(I missed it...darn)
 GM, 453 posts
Sat 25 Nov 2017
at 15:51
CLosing this one down
Briefly resurrected this game to make available resource links to another GM who's starting up a DFRPG game.  check it out at:  ( link to another game )