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Out of Character discussions.

Posted by RefereeFor group 0
Germany
player, 555 posts
Wed 28 Aug 2019
at 12:06
  • msg #133

Re: Updates!

Co-GM:
In reply to Germany (msg # 131):

The problem with the old style of articles was that no one knew what was relevant and what was not and it was a massive info dump for new players - we lost time and potential players to that style of news.

Flavour and player action needs to be differentiated - now we have important information being supplied by the GM in a list of actions, as posts on here saying what NPCs are doing when its important to the world and info given with budgets & orders.

We have separated the actual meat of 'what is going on' and the news becomes more about putting together something that captures the zeitgeist of that turn.

NPCs can only do so much, and story is coming more and more from the players interactions - for this to work we need to remove all the superfluous nonsense we used to publish that just distracted from actual player interaction.

What is happening is covered by your budget and the other resources, what the world feels like to those in it is what we're trying to capture in the news now.

I hope that makes sense?


While seeing your point, I mostly disagree. One important part of any RPG (and real life, for what is worth) is to discriminate what information is relevant and what is a red hirring, or just color.

The way you say, the Korean Nuclear Crisis would probably have been different:

  • where would have the appearance of the space objects (that we all ignored as color, and they ended up to be the only warning) have been published?
  • not appearing in nay of the players' actions list, we would not have the many suspicions we had, and that probably added to the Crisis (to the GM joy, I guess)


Worst yet, I’m afraid this is only a symptom of the course the game is taking, one that I don’t like too much

Let me explain myself (and rant a while):

Formerly (for those new players that have not lived it), the turn began with a few news, mostly events and color, that might give clues about what was going on, with time to react. Now, having no news previous to making our turns, we have no clues, and an ycrisis must be reacted when our assets are committed.

Reacting after the crisis begins limits our possibilities to reaction PA (more expensive, despite the lowering of the Price in the new rules) or direct military action.

So, we must either invest strongly in reaction PA, so limiting our action capacity just in case there's some crisis, or be left unable to react (military action aside) in case there is. Buying PAs mid-turn to respond would  (aside from needing GM approval)mean being quite indebted for next turn, so increasing the problem until it snowballs, while resorting to military action is quite expensive in SU terms, probably leading to having to shortcut other projects.

This way, I’m afraid we will all end to be just spectators of the world history when we should be the history makers, limited to watch and see what crisis come over us and react to them, unable to any preventive measures (as we have no clues) other than accumulate resources to react, never being able to stop them on a preemptive way.

This is fine for most RPGs, where the players are minor actors unable to have any influence in the general course of timeline, but here we’re supposed to be the powers that decide the timeline, and, IMHO, the game is taking just the opposite course. As the game is now, we don’t have the flexibility for it to be a RPG nor the information to be a strategic game, keeping it as a pure reactive game with little (if any) maneuver margin for the players.

I’m sorry to be so negative in my foreseeing, but, once again, I’ll feel to be failing you all if I just stood silent hoping my fears do not come true and not sharing them with you just in case they have some basis.
Referee
GM, 163 posts
Thu 29 Aug 2019
at 21:36
  • msg #134

Re: Updates!

In reply to Germany (msg # 133):

I personally wrote many of the old style articles, and had a significant role in the writing and editing of all of the rest. I know what is behind each of those old style articles, why they were written, how they were written, how much effort they took to write, which details are true or important, which details are false or irrelevant, and what the Management hoped to achieve. From countless emails and posts I know what players think when they see the old style articles, what they believe these articles represent, and what use they hope they can make out of the articles.

The new style of articles is how it is going to be.
Germany
player, 556 posts
Thu 29 Aug 2019
at 21:48
  • msg #135

Re: Updates!

My opiniĆ³n was asked, I answered. What you do with my answer it's up to you , of course.

In any case, I won't send more news for the PAs, as now it's irrelevant . I guess you've deleted the part about them from the rules.
Germany
player, 557 posts
Mon 23 Sep 2019
at 14:35
  • msg #136

Re: Any news about Michael?

Germany:
Referee:
In reply to Germany (msg # 82):

>I just realized China and France logged up again in August 5th. They hadn't
>since February 27th (IIRC).
I sent emails to him weeks ago. No response.


So did I though CotI, whose Email adress is not the same, and with the same results...

That's why I was so surprised to see they had loged in.


To those more veteran that may be interested:

I've just received a short answer (as CotI PM) where he just tells me that he's alive, but that he had a painful year (not entering details, nor have I asked).

I thought I had to share this piece of news with you who might still be concered about him.
Co-GM
GM, 218 posts
Mon 23 Sep 2019
at 16:09
  • msg #137

Re: Any news about Michael?

In reply to Germany (msg # 136):

Its good to know he's ok.
Germany
player, 558 posts
Mon 23 Sep 2019
at 16:13
  • msg #138

Re: Any news about Michael?

Co-GM:
In reply to Germany (msg # 136):

Its good to know he's ok.

Yes,that's why I wanted to share the news. We can rarely share good ones...
Referee
GM, 168 posts
Sun 27 Oct 2019
at 23:15
  • msg #139

Re: Updates!

In reply to Germany (msg # 135):

>In any case, I won't send more news for the PAs, as now it's
>irrelevant . I guess you've deleted the part about them from the rules.

I do not see a single word of section 3.4 that is at odds with the new policy on articles.
This message was last edited by the GM at 23:22, Sun 27 Oct 2019.
Germany
player, 559 posts
Mon 28 Oct 2019
at 08:07
  • msg #140

Re: Updates!

Referee:
In reply to Germany (msg # 135):

>In any case, I won't send more news for the PAs, as now it's
>irrelevant . I guess you've deleted the part about them from the rules.

I do not see a single word of section 3.4 that is at odds with the new policy on articles.


Well, when I read the example given in 3.4:

quote:
Dateline: Turkmenistan, Ashgabat: Military units on all sides were seen to be returning to their barracks today after Turkmenistan publicly agreed to the compromise solution over the division of the Caspian Sea in a Russian brokered agreement. The brief but heavy clashes threatened to engulf the whole region in an all-out war started 2 weeks ago over water rights in this area that is in the grips of its 3rd straight year of drought.

I see it quite different fro mthe current news style.

Maybe I need to check my sight, of course...
Canada
player, 10 posts
Mon 25 Nov 2019
at 17:45
  • msg #141

Re: Updates!


< begin press release>

The recent suite of National Elections in Canada saw the old regime swept away in a surge of popular opinion. The newly installed Prime Minister and Cabinet look forward to working with your great nations to assure the freedom and prosperity of all Mankind, whoever he may dwell.

<end press release>

G'Day all - Paul from Australia checking in as the new Canadian player. Looking forward to the fun, having been a keen 2300 player since the release of 1st edition. Still getting myself sorted with the GG rules so please be gentle!

You can get hold of me via email if required at Pauljamesog (at) gmail etc

thanks!
Paul
This message was last edited by the player at 17:45, Mon 25 Nov 2019.
Co-GM
GM, 219 posts
Thu 12 Dec 2019
at 12:59
  • msg #142

New Players

In reply to Canada (msg # 141):

I'm a bit late to the party as they've introduced themselves already, but just to keep everyone up to date we now have players for Canada and Indonesia. Paul taking Canada and Kerry taking Indonesia.

If you have deals or arrangements with these nations from previous turns make sure you re-introduce yourselves to the new players if you have not already!
This message was last edited by the GM at 13:00, Thu 12 Dec 2019.
Germany
player, 568 posts
Sat 14 Dec 2019
at 11:38
  • msg #143

New Players

I've seen in another game (completly a different one) I play in rpol that the GM has asked OOC comments outside OOC threads (here they would be this one and the rules one, I guess) to be posted in Orange.

I find it a great idea, and I will do it from now on. I suggest other players to do it too, so OOC comments are easier to distinguish them (the OOC note is still written):

E.g.:

OOC: happy christmas to everyone
Germany
player, 570 posts
Sun 15 Dec 2019
at 12:58
  • msg #144

New Players

Another stupid question:

Shoudn't also Puerto Rico appear in the US as a separate settlement?

I guess most US players would know more about it tan myself, but, for what I know, its sttus would be closer to it than anything...
Referee
GM, 179 posts
Tue 17 Dec 2019
at 21:29
  • msg #145

New Players

In reply to Germany (msg # 144):

Okay, that is reasonable. It is though something that can wait until next Turn.
USA
player, 114 posts
Tue 17 Dec 2019
at 22:00
  • msg #146

New Players

In reply to Referee (msg # 145):

quote:
Shoudn't also Puerto Rico appear in the US as a separate settlement?


Nooooo. nope nope nope

Whilst I'm all for giving the USA another Hex, are we really sold on adding another settlement?

Firstly I will argue that the USA is more than complex enough to manage without having to deal with a fourth core settlement, especially one that is already connected to settlement #145 by contiguous hexes now - I get why Hawaii and Alaska are split, they're geographically large, important and not contiguous with the mainland USA, but adding Puerto Rico just means more work for everyone.

Secondly - If we take Puerto Rico as a separate thing then what next, the French Overseas territories? British crown colonies? Guam and other US Pacific islands? Kaliningrad? These are all significant population centres separate from their home settlements but integral parts of them. How about Hong Kong, since although it is connected to China its under a different government system and so should arguably have a different auth and stability score from the mainland?

We should draw a line on how detailed we want Earth to be, and that line should be drawn in big, chunky crayon - simple and obvious!

If we are absolutely determined that Puerto Rico has to be a separate settlement then let me know because I'll spend PAs on turning it into the 52nd state and incorporating it into the America settlement this turn!
Germany
player, 577 posts
Tue 17 Dec 2019
at 23:14
  • msg #147

Re: New Players

USA:
In reply to Referee (msg # 145):

quote:
Shoudn't also Puerto Rico appear in the US as a separate settlement?


Nooooo. nope nope nope

Whilst I'm all for giving the USA another Hex, are we really sold on adding another settlement?

Firstly I will argue that the USA is more than complex enough to manage without having to deal with a fourth core settlement, especially one that is already connected to settlement #145 by contiguous hexes now - I get why Hawaii and Alaska are split, they're geographically large, important and not contiguous with the mainland USA, but adding Puerto Rico just means more work for everyone.

Secondly - If we take Puerto Rico as a separate thing then what next, the French Overseas territories? British crown colonies? Guam and other US Pacific islands? Kaliningrad? These are all significant population centres separate from their home settlements but integral parts of them. How about Hong Kong, since although it is connected to China its under a different government system and so should arguably have a different auth and stability score from the mainland?

We should draw a line on how detailed we want Earth to be, and that line should be drawn in big, chunky crayon - simple and obvious!

If we are absolutely determined that Puerto Rico has to be a separate settlement then let me know because I'll spend PAs on turning it into the 52nd state and incorporating it into the America settlement this turn!

Sorry, not my intent. I just had talked to a friend from Puerto Rico and thought about it...

I'm good at any option, and I understand your point about simplifying the game (though, as you named French Overseas Territories, the specificcase of French Guyana should, IMHO, be,  as it's the site of its launching facilities, even if only as a colony with those facilities...
Co-GM
GM, 223 posts
Thu 26 Dec 2019
at 22:45
  • msg #148

Re: New Players

In reply to Germany (msg # 147):

Everyone welcome Robert - who is taking Korea from me.

If you have / had deals or outstanding messages to Korea - it's his problem now!

Welcome to the game Robert!
UK
player, 86 posts
Rule Britannia!
To the stars!
Tue 31 Dec 2019
at 02:42
  • msg #149

New Players

Hello All!

Another new player here. <waves>

I will be playing the UK and India, as separate countries, that is.

I haven't fully read *all* of the game history, but I think I have most of it.  If I make any errors in this first turn, I apologize in advance.

Good Luck and Good Gaming, All!
Germany
player, 593 posts
Tue 31 Dec 2019
at 18:06
  • msg #150

Re: New Players

UK:
I haven't fully read *all* of the game history, but I think I have most of it.


You must be quite a quick reader then...

UK:
If I make any errors in this first turn, I apologize in advance.


We all make them, so don't worry.


**************

Happy 2020 to everyone.

As this means the begining of a new turn, I hope you all have you turns ready ;)
China
player, 69 posts
Fri 3 Jan 2020
at 23:32
  • msg #151

Re: New Players

UK:
Hello All!

Another new player here. <waves>

I will be playing the UK and India, as separate countries, that is.

I haven't fully read *all* of the game history, but I think I have most of it.  If I make any errors in this first turn, I apologize in advance.

Good Luck and Good Gaming, All!

Hi! Welcome aboard!
Russia
player, 100 posts
Mon 27 Jan 2020
at 12:39
  • msg #152

Better International Forum Organizing

It is not convenient that all the international talks are held in a single thread. We can sink in the various talks about oil, nuclear weapons, African water projects... It will be better if we have separate threads for every such theme.
UK
player, 87 posts
Rule Britannia!
To the stars!
Mon 3 Feb 2020
at 17:38
  • msg #153

Better International Forum Organizing

In reply to Russia (msg # 152):

I agree with the Russian player on this comment. :D
India
player, 4 posts
Mon 3 Feb 2020
at 17:52
  • msg #154

Re: New Players

In reply to China (msg # 151):

Thank you!

So ... when does the next phase of 2060 AD begin?
Germany
player, 594 posts
Mon 3 Feb 2020
at 22:26
  • msg #155

Re: Better International Forum Organizing

Russia:
It is not convenient that all the international talks are held in a single thread. We can sink in the various talks about oil, nuclear weapons, African water projects... It will be better if we have separate threads for every such theme.


I fully agree with this problem, but I'm afraid Rpol, for good or bad, only allows the GM(s) to start public threads. Of course we can ask them each time we see a reason for another public thread (mostly an international discussion in UN or other forums), but they are not always available, andwhen they are they use to be busy.

Another option is to start a "private" thread marking all players. Probablynot as good, but it works too...
UK
player, 88 posts
Rule Britannia!
To the stars!
Wed 5 Feb 2020
at 21:50
  • msg #156

Sequence of Events (N00b) Question

Next up is Combat and once that is resolved, it is end of turn processing then AD 2065 Turn begins, yes?
Germany
player, 595 posts
Wed 5 Feb 2020
at 23:13
  • msg #157

Sequence of Events (N00b) Question

It depends.

Usually the GM specified in each combat round what combat would be expected. As he has specified none, I guess that's what he expects (of course, things may change if any player decides to make a show or byGM decision).

After the WaR Rounds are finished, the GM uses to issue an "end of turn warning" message, and give us some days for final dispositions (as investing unused response PAs).

After that, he began with the updating of budgets and other spreadsheets for the new turn (to begin this can take a while).
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