Pensive, Hoskar rubs his temples as he thinks through the implications of what is being said; eyes lighting up as he makes a connection with the walled city and the sun.

You know, there's a hill sacred to the Sun folks inside the walls. Not the new walls either - the old ones. Out by that part where the trees seem to move and the city's gone back to garden. Maybe we will learn something on our next journey. He pauses, mind working frantically at further connections. Maybe Kinamasi would know more - I recall someone saying she'd lived within those old walls.

Having exhausted his line of thought, he merely nods at the idea of shrines to the Rivals, then furrows his brow. The rivals underground? Odd. But then everything we do seems odd somehow.

He chuckles from the shadows, "Its a good story, remind me to tell you it one night once we're on the way back to the clan." He helps himself to yet another skin of kumiss, "I think the shrines to the Rivals should be above ground, open to the elements, that way anyone can use them."

"I'm not sure I agree with that. The wandering rangers are not a feathered rivals tradition. That we were picked by the rivals is one thing, but not every ranger was picked by one. It does not make them any less rangers than us, or make their sacrifices for the Green any less worthy. That a large number of us were picked and have become rangers is noteworthy, but we were picked before we became rangers. I fear you might alienate some of those who might otherwise care to join us." Amara commented.

Ohanzee leans back smiling with his eyes closed listening to the words of the others "Well for those of you who loose your connection to your Rival down here I feel pity. I for one have no such problem and I know from personal experience that Raven has no problem coming down here either."

He opens his eyes at Amara's words though "Ah, but is that just because they have not been approached about it, whether by man or spirit? Hmmm?" Closing his eyes again he lays back on his elbows "Most have already been followers of one Rival or another even if at a lower level than others. And when asked, those who have not been have expressed an interest in one Rival or another."

"The only ones who expressed an interest in the rivals were due to coaxing and cajoling on the part of those of us who felt our spirit needed more representation." Amara said accusingly "Those who were persuaded have not been visited by the rivals themselves or granted any of the gifts. Making it a part of joining the rangers is unnecessary. The rivals will visit those they really want. There are many spirits on the wastes. The rangers are supposed to be about inclusion, about restoring the green for all. Adding conditions that they must follow one of the rivals seems like a ridiculous barrier."

He doesn't sit back up this time "I didn't say must, I said should, but could would be a better word."

He smiles "And I quite agree, the way certain Thunderbirds have been using getting closer to you as a draw their Rival is quite atrocious!"

Amara scowled as she looked at Ohanzee "Now...what exactly do you mean by that." she said in an icy tone.

"I for one don't want a Raven shrine down here." He pauses for a moment, "We store a lot of gear in these caves, do we really want more Ravens down here?" he laughs which turns in to a lot of coughing.

"No! It's more than enough having to cope with you two!"

Whether Salen means that truly or not is hard to say, but he is grinning.

"Then you didn't miss me while you were harpy hunting?" His voice carries a hint of the smile that is hidden in shadows. "I can't speak for Ohanzee, but normally I don't steal off of friends."

"Surely any shrines should be under the clear skies where the rivals fly not buried deep in the ground. We might fight for the Earth but our strength comes from above where the mighty thunder can strike down chaos".

"This foolish argument is accomplishing nothing! I am new to the Rangers, so I will not take sides as to who should or should not be admitted to the order, but surely it can be discussed without such vitriol."

Voras glances back at the disk.  "I agree with those who say that the shrines to the Rivals should be above ground.  It feels wrong to worship Sun Hawk where one cannot even see the sun.  After an appropriate shrine has been constructed, I will ask Sun Hawk about the disk."

Kobal's first reaction to Ohanzee's suggestion of a Raven shrine within the Rangers' quarters had been to object.  But the other Rangers get in first with their arguments.  He holds his tongue and let the others have their say.  There are others in the group who are smarter than he is.

Only a Raven, who likes hiding, and darkness, would suggest a shrine in a cave.
This message was last edited by the player at 06:13, Thu 10 Mar 2016.

Still looking up at the ceiling of the cave he responds "Oh just something I overheard."

"Perhaps I misinterpreted it."

"Forget I said anything."



Ohanzee smiles "Not stealing from friends comes easier to some."




Looking from the ceiling to Voras quizzically he replies "You think this is an argument? You have had too sheltered a life, this is a discussion."

Then laying fully back and gazing up at the ceiling again he adds "You can ask Sun Hawk anything you want, but you will not be doing it with the disc until I get that promise to share what you learn."

Good grief this got us divided up more than I'd expected.

Although Hoskar's eyes widen through the debate, so does his smile.

Come, come now. Voras has a point here - we might be a bit less blunt he glances over at Voras as he speaks these words; adding although this really is how we usually get things done: squabble a bit and sort it out. Especially if the leaders we don't actually have turn out on different sides of things.

His gaze shifts to Ohanzee, seeming almost aplogetic. Afraid I'm with Melock and Amara on this one. As I've said before, I've been amazed how often the two of them manage to get hold of opposite ends of exactly the right rope for the job, and somehow a confined space and a new requirement for the Rangers feels...off, I guess. Not wrong, just uncomfortable somehow. After all, if a Rival wants to call someone, they've lots of opportunity.

"Think what you will.  I've always found that more gets done when backbiting is kept to a minimum," Voras replies coolly, though he continues with a slight smirk on his face. "Though I won't deny your wit is entertaining.  I've no problem agreeing to your demand, though I will not gainsay Sun Hawk should I be told to keep what I learn on a short leash."

Laying on his back still Ohanzee closes his eyes "No promise, no disc." is all he says in response.

Kobal inspects the cavern floor with great interest as Ohanzee and Amara discuss matters.

After Two-Feather speaks, he decides to chip in.  "Aye, the Feathered Rivals are the Air.  They will hear our prayers better above the ground."  Where we Dedra should be as well.  "After what happened with Cantalas and the Blue Llamas, I'm not sure the Earth Priestesses would be keen on Raven rituals within their temple complex either..."

From where she sits watching the exchange Whispers voice suddenly enters the mix, sharp and cutting

"So this is how you plan to work together...The feathered rivals making a bad thing good...By being rude to someone who wishes to join your ranks. Typical Raven and the cause of everyones' problems. He is a Sun Hawk and you call his honesty into question. You who bend the truth any which way you can.

The disc is not yours to hold on to, it's is the groups and was found before your time Ohanzee Shappa."

Tarnessh nods his head in reply "This is Sun magic and not your domain Raven."

The Agimori all shift slightly so that they can give Ohanzee the benefit of their combined stare...

Having kept his peace until now Gloaming speaks, his voice emotionless and cold

"Aye... Raven's darkness will hide what needs to be seen under Bright Treasure's gaze and if Voras says he can ask for Sun Hawk's divination than I say he should. It is our holy day after the wedding. Then would be a good time if he so wished. "

"While Whispers is right that Ohanzee wasn't there, another Raven was responsible for finding it." He leans out of the shadows, "It was with that self heating canteen I found. While I don't doubt a Sun Hawks word. At the time we found it we had an Impala brave with us, he refused to tell Greeshar what it said, which resulted in Greeshar killing him. So I think it must be a great secret, which means I want to know whats on it." He smiles as he relaxes back in to the dark. "Its time we find out what it says and Sun Hawks holy day would be a good day to find out."

Still laying on his back, Ohanzee now opens his eyes and pushes himself up to a seated position "Now this," he looks at Voras "This is getting towards being an argument."

Next he looks at the Seza "Strictly speaking this disc is new, it is not the one that was found before I joined, that is gone and this is a new one I got a friend to make."

He shakes his head "But that is besides the point, I do not doubt that any Sun Hawk would speak only truth, but what I do doubt is that they would share all they learn with the rest of us. And it is because we work together that I raise this.

"The information that the disc holds is important to all of us, Raven showed me this. He showed me that the information that it holds would be dangerous if not shared between all Rivals, that it would split friends apart. He showed Sun Hawk perched upon keeping it to himself and behind him a golden wheel whispering in his ear."

Ohanzee sighs looking at Whispers "I don't pick this fight to hinder our task, I pick it for the better of us all. Followers of every Rival should know all the secrets known to the others equally and if that means we all know nothing then so be it."

Looking back at Gloaming he adds "If this Raven wanted to keep the secrets just for Ravens then I'd have kept the disc secret, no one else knew I had a copy made."

He looks about at the others "There's a whole flock of Sun Hawks here, ask any of them if I'm lying. Ask all of them!"

In reply to Ohanzee Shappa (msg # 87):



Melock starts coughing violently, after about a minute it subsides. "Other points of view are also valid."