I wouldn't allow any offensive spells, that defeats the purpose of the challenge. Something like mage armor or shield would be fine, but spells are just too easy to overpower the opponent.

As for a crit, either the double hit or disadvantage to the defender's attack as they got knocked back.

For the crit I prefer the 'gives you advantage on next attack' or 'gives opponent disadvantage on next attack' options rather than 2 successes. My reasoning being 2 hits is twice as good in this fight, but in a normal fight a crit is not twice as good it's more like 1.5 times as good (since you dont add your mod twice). Additionally in a crit you have not 'technically' hit the opponent twice, just once but really well.

Additionally, I see it this way because I have always seen HP as not just a representation of 'how much damage you can take' but as a catch all for both physical and mental capability like tiredness, actual cuts/bruises/burns/etc, willingness to continue fighting, etc. So to me a critical hit isn't doing more damage because the cut is deeper (I mean it could be) but more generally it's an attack that took advantage of an opening/weakness from the opponent to 'damage' their 'ability to fight' better than normal, what better way to demonstrate that than the advantage/disadvantage mechanic if HP is not being used.

As for spells I would actually argue that attacking spells should be used, they can just be used in a 'minimal' state. It's the equivalent of playing laser tag. Instead of throwing a ball of fire at full force you're throwing a 'warm ball' if you like. That does get into the question of 'do spells that have an effect on a successful save still hit?'.

The other alternatives would be 'spells never give a hit, they just make landing a hit easier' (which I do like) or, 'no spells allowed' (which hurts spell casters).

If you're a spell caster you're probably not as good at stabbing someone (some exceptions do apply of course) but spells are your balancer. You are less likely to land a hit, but if that person is blinded you're getting advantage, it balances out. And for the comment of 'well sleep is OP because I can just tap them 5 times lightly and be good' that would not work. In a tournament like that they would be counting 'fatal' hits or at least 'good' hits. Tapping someone lightly so as not to wake them would not count as one. A sleep spell would essentially just give you a free crit (which goes back to how do you award crits above). Then the fight continues as normal since a 'good' hit would definitely wake someone from the spell. The more OP stuff would be something like hold person but even then they will have chances to save out of it.

Interesting point about granting advantage potentially snowballing (which might be desired).
And about crits normally only doubling the die, not the modifier, thus double point might be too much.
With the above in mind, I'd probably go the disadvantage route. (Though the other options aren't bad.)
Knocking down... unless the attacker is able to attack multiple times (follow up attack when they're down, thus getting advantage), I don't think there would be a point since the defender can just get right back up?

On magic, it might help if we knew the context of the sparring match.
If it's only a contest of strength and weapon skill, magic might be out.
Friendly sparring match, the PC and NPC might set their own terms.
Maybe all magic is allowed, and just handwave it being nonlethal. (If you do that, maybe drop the point system and just go normal HP.)
If those involved are lunatics, they go at it with full lethal force, and just have a healer on standby. :P

Unless the stakes are high, I wouldn't overthink it, and wouldn't allow it to bog the game down.

Wanted to bounce some ideas off people:

Most game settings have a “common” language that most people speak, and then a bunch of other languages. It’s pretty much assumed PC’s know common, and then maybe some other languages.
I was debating having a setting where “common” is only a plurality, not a majority, and try to emphasize that most people (both PC and NPC) don’t know it.
Does that sound like it could make things interesting, or just make communication a chore? And potentially closing off players from certain opportunities, or other players.
Maybe it depends how many other languages there are. (Fewer probably works better.)
Might depend on the nature of the game too. (I was picturing a contained sandbox/open world, with different areas being populated by certain groups/languages.)

Another idea was having sign language be more commonly used. Besides being a different language, it has some added utility (silent) but also drawbacks (hands free, takes longer) to a spoken language.
Similar idea with like morse code.
DnD has Thieves’ Cant as like a language of code words and gestures with alternate meanings.

Any thoughts on how to make languages more interesting beyond “Orcish is spoken by orcs, Evlish is spoken by elves”?
I debated once having a language that is very simple and limited, but easy to learn, thus it acts like a “common” language.
Maybe some languages are sister languages (like real life).

Firefly, if I remember, had English as the common language, but Mandarin was also largely present, and phrases from it were often used by English speakers (often for cursing). (I believe the history was the USA/West merged with China.)

Any other cool tips or tricks people have done to incorporate languages?

I think the biggest issue with this would be that the players would always have to type speech in a language group...  Secondly, as you said, you could wind up with a party that can't speak to each other...
This message was last edited by the player at 22:49, Wed 05 Apr 2023.

In my HB world, I tend to have multiple human and nonhuman languages, usually I have a single predominant language, think Latin in the Irod a Middle ages.  While many of the people tend to know it, not everyone does. What I do have is a Trade language, which is a mixture of various languages that have morphed into a language centered around Trade. Almost everyone speaks that, but it doesn't cover every situation.

I find this makes for some interesting encounters, and encourages people to seek out new languages. I do recommend that all the party members speak at least one common language. Interparty communications are key and while a small amount of confusion can be fun, constant communication issues are disruptive.

Having a non common language helps make exotic locations more memorable and interesting. It makes them stand out. But ALWAYS have at least one NPC that can speak to the party. Sometimes it's fun to have tis NPC take up scamming the pcs, as this encourages them to learn the language, if only to discover this.

In reply to LissaAzules (msg # 282):

You do realize you don't have to only run games on rpol right? This channel offers universal advice.

I think the biggest issue would just be it's one of those ideas that seems immersive or world build at first but after you have to play through dealing with it for a few sessions it just drags the game down or becomes hand waved away so there was no point in the first place.

An alternative I might suggest is rather than having completely different languages you have different dialects. This has always been a thing in the real world and, I think, largely unutilised. This way everyone can 'understand' each other without really 'getting' each other. If you want real world examples think of some of the different meanings words in the UK and USA have. The same sentence can mean two very different things in each place, or a sentence can have a meaning in one place and be gibberish in the other. This way you can have simple conversations easily enough but you can also throw odd stuff like this in to add flavour and perhaps cause confusion.

Can confirm, happens in Ars Magica all the time. PC's routinely have to resort to magic or go betweens for simple conversations with NPC's

I'm reminded of a story from my father. When he was newly married, my mother spoke with a deep south Mississippi accent. His uncle was from Boston. When they met he would have to sit between them and "translate" due to their accents.

My father grew up in Missouri where they have a more neutral midwestern accent. It's the one most often called no accent.

Having nothing to do with the language conversation...  I am considering a new game and could use some advice...

The concept is that the PCs get trapped in a castle and cannot escape without something that is not to be found in the castle.

When they enter the library they discover that some of the books are actually portals to short campaigns. Each book will be the equivalent of a one (or two) shot at tabletop. Each book can take the players to a different time period, dimension, plane, world, etc. (For example, one book might take them to the Death House from Strahd, another might find them in the underdark, and so on)

Solving the campaign for each book will get them one step closer to escaping the castle. What I need the most atm is an idea for the "something" they need to escape...  I've considered that each campaign could award a piece of a key or part of a riddle that needs assembled in the right order to open the magic lock, etc.

Basically, I have too many ideas to choose..  lol  Additionally, I'll take any suggestions you have on short/one-shot campaigns that can be utilized...

First thing that popped into my head that's pretty traditional and splits up nicely is the classic rod of seven parts.

Nice...  that didn't cross my mind... although, I don't know how many parts it will be yet...  that will be decided in conjunction with my players...
This message was last edited by the player at 20:26, Sun 09 Apr 2023.

I was thinking of making one of the books lead to our world...  possibly ancient Egypt, Rome or Greece... maybe Nazi Germany like Barbara Hambly's Sun Cross series...

Moorcock’s Eternal Champion has a lotof inter-planar travel, might provide some insight.

I think I’d pick my favorite books, movies, TV shows, etc. and visit one or two sites of each.  Maybe going thru the ruins of Angband or Moria, slog thru the swamps of Dagobah or sneak into Jabba’s Tower, the ruined city of Quo or a nest of the Dark, Castle Volkiher or Blackreach, exploring the warrens under Mount Thunder or slog thru Sarengrave Flat, etc.

Those are all good ideas Blue. I especially like the Darwath suggestions...  I always wanted to run a campaign based on that setting...

Very much sounds like the first MYST game. May want to check if that's something your players want. That game isn't for everyone.
This message was last edited by the GM at 00:49, Mon 10 Apr 2023.

Reminds me of the kids' book series "Magic Tree House," cause they'd read books and go to a bunch of time periods, usually bringing something back that would help solve their current problem.
The nostalgia...

Thinking of how you trap them in the castle might help you think of things needed to escape it.
Might not strictly be a castle.

Possible idea:
Castle is on a remote island at sea (probably magical). Anything removed from the castle that belongs there fades back into the castle.
They have to gather pieces to assembly a seaworthy boat. The body, the sails, the sextant/compass (navigation), oars, food/drink, shelter, searchlight, etc.
Perhaps some necessary pieces were already acquired by a previous group who failed, getting the players going in the right direction. (But, spoiler! Some are actually just still working on the mini-quests, possibly trapped, to be encountered by the players.)

Or maybe some other kind of vehicle, like a balloon or hang glider. Maybe they have to repair something rather than build it from scratch.
Perhaps items inside the castle can be brought along into the mini-quests, just not out of the castle.
Maybe they have to retrieve famous items from history, real or mythical.

Surprisingly the castle idea reminds me of the Doctor Who episode: Heaven Sent.

Should use it for inspiration and use some of the ideas. They will help with the claustrophobia feel you need to make it work.

I had forgotten about that episode as Capaldi was one of my least favorite Doctors but it is a great idea.


I'm not sure I follow your meaning here... Maybe because I never played MYST but also because the players would know the concept (i.e. - trapped and have to jump into books to escape) before they signed up... What am I missing?


Never heard of that series before... Will have to look it up...


This actually jogged a memory of the Staff of Jericho obelisk device they built in R.I.P.D.

Taking inspiration from The Riftwar Saga, you could have them have to shift from section to section of the castle by passing though a portal, crossing whatever one-off adventure setting, to get to a different part of the castle, rinse and repeat until they get to the castle exit.

That has interesting possibilities...  Thanks Blue!

Actually going off what Blue said what about keeping the theme of the castle in everything so that each section is an adventure in part of a castle in a different setting. So you could have a section that's right out of Strahd's castle, another that's a creepy dungeon, another that's maybe an undead infested garden, a library with a cult or angry librarian - and then you make each one thematic based on the period you want to do it in.

MYST is a game where you are trapped on an island and have to use magic books to travel to other worlds. But to find those worlds you solve puzzles. And all of the other worlds also contain puzzles. It's fun if you enjoy puzzles, which I do, but not everyone likes the game.

That's interesting. Sort of a castle that intersects in many dimensions at the same time. Your quest to find the parts of the "key" spirals inwards and upwards as you progress through the castle and it's many faces?