Okay, looks like we're ready to get going on keywords again -- for ease of use, I'm opening up a thread, and will copy some of the relevant posts from PM.

By the way, as far as the Alien question goes, I'd like to see it generalized a bit, especially if I'm (one of the ones) going to be doing keywords as portraits are submitted.

Alien (TV Series), Alien (movie) or something of the sort might be better, as I'm not likely to recognize some of the specifics, though we might handle that by asking for a volunteer to help with keywords every update cycle (but it would really need to be someone willing to stick with it through the long haul).

Another suggested addition to attire:

gown, bathing suit

Agreed regarding new Kingdom keywords.  And as for mineral, if you don't think there's any in the gallery then we should remove it.

One tweak for Kingdom I might suggest is change "Animal" to "Animal (non-sentient)", or something to indicate an animal that doesn't have a tick under "Race"?

Rename "Hair Length" to "Hair Length/Style".

Add "Facial and Head Adornments" (or some such spiffy wording):  piercings, cigar/cigarette, mustache, beard, tattoo, eye patch, hat/cap, hood, mask, glasses, scarf..

Add "Equipment and accompaniments":  sword, gun, bow, staff, weapon (other), wings, coat/cloak

Expression is an interesting one.  Maybe even "Expression/demeanour"?

(You may notice I've taken your suggestions and twisted them to my nefarious needs.)

Not sure if "anime" is a medium, but it doesn't seem to fit in elsewhere.

I don't think splitting Alien into TV or movie is a good idea, some have been on both.  Surely portrait submissions would request the relevant keywords to now accompany the file?


We could even go crazy and have "more than 2": eyes, ears, arms, legs.  Or "non-standard number of", then we could add heads, noses...

Request, yes.

That doesn't necessarily mean they'll be 1) provided or 2) correct. ;)

Regarding the "Mineral" keyword, there are a few Earth creatures in the galleries.  However, it might serve better if it was changed to "Elemental", as it would then cover a wider range of portraits.  For example:

http://rpol.creativelass.net/ncm090.jpg
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ncm192.jpg
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ncm225.jpg
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ncm240.jpg
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ncm258.jpg
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ncm404.jpg
http://rpolportraits.shannara-rose.com/mcm146.jpg

I would add a 'child' to the age to define it better, four age catagories should be enough I would think.

Put 'Drow' in race (so I can exclude them from all my searches)

Maybe put a 'middle east' in ethnicity?

In attire put 'leather armor' and 'metal armor' as different categories

You could also put space/sci-fi and 'superhero' in attire, and a few more.

I'm not sure how this would work, but for things like hair colour, why not use every possibility?  Would it be difficult to combine later if we find there are only a few under some?  What about dividing again if in future an odd colour suddenly becomes popular?

I suppose that if we have 'insect' we also should have 'arachnid'.

I agree on the hair.  We've got most of the spectrum in there -- might as well include the rest.  I'd also go consistent and make 'brunette' into brown/brunette and yellow/blond(e) -- or just leave out the brunette/blonde part altogether.

That would leave purple, orange, and what else?  Teal maybe ...*grumbles about anime)

You could always go with "Colors Not Found In Nature" to cover the exotic anime hues.  ;)

I think we need to discuss previously mentioned points, not just put forward our own, going the way we are I'll just be adding 101 things that make no sense.

If Alien's going to be a hassle (and I thought mostly correct information provided by the submitters would be enough) then I'd just remove any distinction between them and just have one Alien category.


Kingdom

• Animal (non-sentient), Plant, Mineral/Elemental, Robot/Cyborg, Inanimate, Bird, Insect, Amphibian, Arachnid

Gender

• Male, Female, Androgynous

Age

• Adult, Elderly, Young

Hair Colour

• Black, Blond(e), Brunette, Grey, White, Red, Blue, Green, Pink, Purple, Silver, Orange

Hair Length/Style

• Short, Medium/Bob, Long, Bald, Cropped, Spiked, Curls/Perm, Mohawk

Race

• Human, Elf/Half-Elf, Dwarf/Gnome, Hobbit/Halfling, Alien (Star-Trek), Alien (Star Wars), Alien (Babylon 5), Alien (Stargate), Alien (Other), Undead, Demonic, Monster

Ethnicity

• Caucasian, Asian/Oriental, American, Indian, Negroid, Aboriginal, Hispanic, blue (skin), green (skin), purple (skin), red (skin)

Attire

• Dress, Suit, Shirt, T-Shirt, Armour, None, Bikini, Costume, Gown, Bathing Suit

Medium

• Drawing, Painting, Photograph, CGI, Cartoon, Line, Art, Black & White

Additions/changes have been underlined, removals struck through.

gtg, work.  Haven't listed all suggestions as nobody else has commented on them.

I think age should include a 'child', young could mean late teens early 20's which is different than a child for a character portrait seeker.

There should be a headware or hat keyword, sometimes I look for a sam spade or indiana jones look for a character, or for a hood or turban.

Armor should be divided into leather and metal to differentiate between thiefly types and warrior types easily.

Also in Attire I believe sci-fi and superhero would help players locate suitable portraits quickly. As it is now if I want a guy in a spacesuit or a cape and tights what do I select?

I believe 'dark elf' should have it's own category as drow and elves are different in appearance enough to warrant it.

I think 'middle east' should be a separate ethnic category, it is a bit different than oriental, and would include (east)indian.

We might also want to include glasses or eyewear, and beard/mustache as these are physical traits you might want reflected in the portrait.

It might be interesting to try an attractiveness rating, although it would be rather subjective.

So how are the keyword tags going to interact with the current gallery system? I could actually see them replacing it entirely.

Especially if this will largely replace the gallery, I think we need to tag pictures with historical time periods. The ones in the current gallery really need re-vamping, in any case. I'd suggest "Ancient" (to cover anything prior to the fall of the Western Roman Empire), "Medieval" (Byzantine, Medieval Europe), "Early Modern" (Renaissance, American Revolutionary War, French Revolution), "Victorian/Edwardian" (includes Civil War, Westerns) and "Historical 20th Century" (which includes anything after WWI that would look obviously dated to modern eyes). This doesn't work so well outside of Europe, though it might not be too bad in combination with the Races/Ethnicities.

For attire, maybe there should be a "None" category in the sense that there's no attire visible because the picture has been closely cropped. I'll often use this sort of "Modern" picture in a historical or fantasy game.

As several people have already pointed out, an "Accessories" category would be a boon. Being able to search for an image with a weapon when the character should be obviously armed, one with glasses, or one with something like an amulet would be very handy.

I believe the keywords system will be set up to work alongside the current categories, not as a replacement.

People will still have the option to browse the galleries, even if they don't have a set idea in mind - some people search for specific images to fit a character description, others browse the images, looking for one which inspires a description.

Well, for the ones that pick a portrait the base their description off that, maybe a random portrait selector could be put in. :)

Go to the beta site at http://beta.rpol.net and choose a portrait for a character, you'll see the new search option.  Feel free to make a game just to take a look if you need to.


+1 vote for child.

Comments on other's points:

I like Elemental, but think it might belong better in the Race category

I also like 'Drow' as a race, and agree that they're distinctive enough from Elves to warrant their own tag

Changing 'Young' to 'Child' does make it more definable, and easier to categorize -- of course, I've noticed that what constitutes both extremes changes dramatically as one ages. ;)

Middle Eastern is also a good suggestion, and we have quite a few portraits that clearly fit that distinction

Superhero wouldn't be a bad classification, though I might add Superhero/Supervillain so that you get both in one click

Allhaja's point about 'None' is also good, though I might suggest changing the description to 'None Visible' just so we don't cause anyone to have expectations. ;)

I'll take Astron's comment about beard/mustache/glasses/cloak/hood/turban to be support for my earlier suggestions, plus the addition of turban - which we also have several pictures including this.

Likewise, I also support leather armor / metal armor, sword, bow, dagger, staff, wand

I have no desire to include an attractiveness rating, especially since we have pictures of RPoL users in the gallery.  Not only is it completely subjective, it could also be potentially hurtful.

I'm also in favor (to some degree) of putting the historical periods in there, but I suggest that if we do, we do so in the format of the Recategorized Gallery -- simply because most people will not have the expertise to use narrow definitions.  'Ancient/Middle Ages', 'Early Modern', 'Late Modern', 'Old West'.  We put a lot of talk and discussion into that part of it when trying to come up with new categories.

BTW, here's a place where you can see the portraits laid out (more images at once).

Also, you can look at the 'recategorized gallery', which is the end result of all the discussion we had way back when.

http://www.revelcity.com/rpol_portrait_gallery.htm

The first links on that page are the way the portraits are currently categories, and the second links show the proposed new categories.

Kingdom

• Animal (non-sentient), Plant, Mineral/Elemental, Robot/Cyborg, Inanimate, Bird, Insect, Amphibian, Arachnid

Gender

• Male, Female, Androgynous

Age

• Adult, Elderly, Young, Child

Hair Colour

• Black, Blond(e), Brunette, Grey, White, Red, Blue, Green, Pink, Purple, Silver, Orange

Hair Length/Style

• Short, Medium/Bob, Long, Bald, Cropped, Spiked, Curls/Perm, Mohawk

Race

• Human, Elf/Half-Elf, Dark Elf, Dwarf/Gnome, Hobbit/Halfling, Alien (Star-Trek), Alien (Star Wars), Alien (Babylon 5), Alien (Stargate), Alien (Other), Undead, Demonic, Monster

Ethnicity

• Caucasian, Asian/Oriental, American, Indian, Negroid, Aboriginal, Hispanic, Middle Eastern, blue (skin), green (skin), purple (skin), red (skin)

Attire

• Dress, Suit, Shirt, T-Shirt, Armour, None Visibile, Bikini/Bathing Suit, Costume, Gown, Coat/Cloak, hat/cap, hood, turban, mask, scarf, leather armour, metallic armour

Phsyical Traits

• Piercings, mustache, beard, tattoo, eye patch, glasses, wings

Equipment and accompaniments

• Sword, gun, bow, staff, weapon (other), cigar/cigarettes

Medium

• Drawing, Painting, Photograph, CGI, Cartoon, Line, Art, Black & White

Era/Period

• Ancient/Middle Ages, Early Modern, Late Modern, Old West, Future

Note: Added "Drow" as "Dark Elf" so it's not system specific.  Added my headings as placeholders only, just so the keywords could be added in.

Lost and without a fixed home:  Elemental, Anime, Superhero/Supervillan.

What's happening with Alien?

Did I miss anything?  Comments?
This message was last edited by admin at 01:26, Thu 09 Apr 2009.

Add a 'future' to era/period?

Scars, possibly?

I'd just as soon say leave Star Wars & Star Trek but leave the others as 'Other', or make them all 'Other'.

BTW, do you think that people will search for portraits of 'Captain Kirk' or 'Luke Skywalker' using those categories?

I'm not sure we need both Young and Child.  Depends on one's definition of 'young' I guess, and Shannara is right, it changes with age; all of you look really young to me!

Anyone under 30 is still wet behind the ears...

I can see a teenager looking young, but not being a child -- likely, I'd categorize anyone who seemed 12 or younger as 'child', and teenage to 21 as 'young', adult up to maybe 60-ish appearing.

*sighs*  We're going to get smacked by a user who has their portrait in the gallery yet. ;)

I demand that my portrait be categorised as "young", because the photo was taken when I was younger than I am now.  ;)

LOL@Ron  I think that is 'younger', not 'young'.

Astron, anyone under 40 is a child, 'young' covers up to 50 or so...  ;-)

But seriously, are there enough pics of children to need a category?  And babies aside, where do you draw the line?  I guess we need to look at a few, and see how it's working out.

Well I'm not a child then, but I'm still young for another year or so. ;P

There are a few child portraits I think, not many. But one day I might try starting an arena game, Kids with Hammers.

Ok, not.

I just think 'Young' is too broad a category although looking at the portraits many are indeterminate age, I think any will be both 'young' and 'adult'.
This message was last edited by the player at 00:12, Thu 09 Apr 2009.

Rename young to teenager then?  Otherwise that age bracket is going to unrepresented.

That works for me :)

Elemental - race
Anime - medium
superhero/supervillain - is this referring to the ones with costumes? If so, attire

I agree with Shan's idea of how to break up age. Child would be 12-under, Young (could be called "young adult" to clarify) would be 13-20ish. And yes, there are quite a few pictures of kids in there, Bri.

Insect and arachnid could be combined into "arthropod" if there aren't that many.

Did Alien (B5) and Alien (Stargate) get in there the first time around because there are a lot of them (comparable to the number of Star Wars/Star Trek)? If so, they should both stay.

Looking at the ethnicities, I see American, Indian, and Aboriginal. Do these refer to American Indian, India Indian, and Australian Aboriginal?

I like the suggestions for age clarification!  They're certainly appropriate, and "Young Adult" could actually be expanded to 21 (or even 25).

As for ethnicity, "East Indian" might cover the Asian country's population without sounding redundant.

Hi all!

As you may, or may not, be aware; the next version of RPoL is nearing completion.  Part of that includes the log awaited portrait keyword searching.

This can be seen by visiting http://beta.rpol.net, creating/joining a game and then selecting a portrait for a character.  At the top of the selection page is now a By keyword search. link.

This allows users to search for keywords to look for, as well as ones to exclude.  It also allows them to enter in free-text search criteria, which could be anything like the actor, the game it's from, or some trait that's fairly unique to that image (we could use "ASCII" and "Bunny" (well, maybe "Rabbit") for the image used by Nerwen!).

As those who had the most input into this (albiet a while ago), I thought I'd give you guys a direct heads-up here.

Also, as extra special people I've given all of you the ability to manipulate the tags for all portraits.  This can be seen at http://beta.rpol.net/help/edit.cgi?action=tagportrait.  If I've fogotten to add you to the allowed list of editors, let me know.

This isn't set in stone.  Renaming can be done very easily.  Appending to a list is also a simple case, however deleting/inserting (in the middle) an option is a little tricky, but still possible.

I'm not sure how many people are still visiting this forum. :)

But I'm here, and I can devote some time to tagging today.  Gives me a good excuse not to do other things.

Don't tell me the posse disbanded!  Are they hanging out in one of those filthy other portrait 'games'?  (c;

I'm here too. ^:)

I believe jase should have given / will be giving you access to do tagging.  Please let me know if you don't have it in a day or so and I'll nag remind him. :)

I do indeed seem to have access.

What's the best way to tag something with a phrase as opposed to a single word? Quotation marks? Or should it all go together in a string?

One phrase per line.

Not sure who's still here, but it's better than posting nowhere!  (c;

I've been doing some tagging off and on, and have found some areas that I think need improving;

Hair Length/Style

• Short | Medium/Bob | Long | Bald | Cropped | Spiked | Curls/Perm | Mohawk
• Add:  Bun/Tied Up | Plait (Single) | Plaits

Attire

• Dress | Suit | Shirt | T-Shirt | Armour | None Visible | Bikini/Bathing Suit | Costume | Gown | Coat/Cloak | Hat/Cap | Hood | Turban | Mask | Scarf | Leather Armour | Metallic Armour
• Add:  Headband | Helmet | Strapless Top | Necklace | Choker | Shield

Note:  Is there some way we can get rid of the plain "armour" option?  Maybe "Armour (Leather)", "Armour (Metallic)", "Armour (Other)"?


Phsyical Traits

• Piercings | Mustache | Beard | Tattoo | Eye Patch | Glasses | Wings
• Change:  Piercings -> Piercings (Other)
• Add:  Piercings (Earring(s))

Equipment and Accompaniments

• Sword | Gun | Bow | Staff | Weapon (Other) | Cigar/Cigarettes
• Add:  Mace | (Battle)Axe | Hammer | Crossbow | Dagger(s)/Shortsword(s) | Blade (Other) | Blunt (Other) | Ranged (Other)
• Remove:  Weapon (Other)

Thanks to those who are still tagging, a few points regarding keywords though:

Keywords are good, but only add in ones that people are going to search for.  Also note that sub-words are pointless, i.e. "axe" is not of use if you also have "battleaxe".  Lastly, ticking "Dark-Elf" is our term for Drow, so no need to add it into the keywords.
This message was last edited by the GM at 16:34, Fri 18 Jan 2013.

/help/edit.cgi?action=tagportrait

Thought I'd post the link here for tagging, as I'm not sure there is one here.

I like the additions.   *grin*  Though I'm not so sure about 'Dagger/Swordsword'.

I have been doing some 'sporadic' tagging.  When I do, I use the google images feature to search for similar pics, which sometimes helps me identify the portrait / artist.

My input, however, has been and will likely to continue to be sporadic at best.  I tried to rope my hubby into it, but he sticks with it even less than I do.
This message was last edited by the GM at 13:27, Fri 18 Jan 2013.

In reply to Shannara (msg # 45):

I have no idea what this strange blade you talk of is.  Is it from the middle east?

Well now that I've been reminded, I'll tag along... ^:D
I've been sporadic about it too.

Hello. I just joined the group and I'm reading through the old and newer topics. Eager to get started and help out.

Another new guy from the volunteer thread in FoRPoL. Looking forward to doing my bit for keyword research and tagging. I tentatively plot to go identify many many redheads.

You've both been given access to edit the portraits, accessible via the link Shan posted in message 45.

Thanks. I'm still reading through this forum. I'll likely finish after work. Ciao.

If it's OK, I wouldn't mind spradically tagging portraits either.  I need a brainless distraction from the crap going on with work right now, and I'm too wound up to work on my games so...  Gosh, don't I sound fun?

Tagified five or six portraits last night, off to work on a few more in a minute.

And in editing noticed another tag that we need: under accessories we ought to have a box for 'collar/bracelet'.
This message was last edited by the player at 16:35, Sun 27 Jan 2013.

Where should I start? Do we each have specific sections?

It's all a bit hit and miss, you can generally tell pretty quickly if an area's been looked at.

We should probably try to have a better idea of what has and hasn't been done, let me ponder that one!



I'm not sure bracelet would come up very often in a head shot.  Probably best of as a keyword, or not really mentioned at all, I don't think anyone's ever going to search for bracelet in a head/torso shot.

As for collar -- covered by shirt?

I might be playing the devils advocate there, but I think we need to think carefully about any expansions we going to add.  I'd expect people to treat my suggestions (above) the same.


Lastly - the more the merrier, c.

Thanks!

In reply to jase (msg # 55):

Well, OK, I have only seen one or two bracelets, but I have run across enough collars/chokers to weren't their own tag I think, and it was also among your suggestions...

Hi, another newbie here. I belong to a group on RPOL where we have identified a lot of the portraits with the actors names. It might save you time if you don't have to search out the ones we've already identified. Do you think the lists would be helpful? Would you like me to post a link to the other game, or copy and paste the lists in a thread over here? Whatever you think would be best. If not, I'd be happy to help you tag.
This message was last edited by the player at 03:07, Mon 25 Feb 2013.

Hi, I'm here and ready to do some tagging!

/help/edit.cgi?action=tagportrait

Here is the link for the tagging - jase will need to give you access (I think) before it works.  He may have already done that.

Have at it.  Sadly, there's no real rhyme or reason to what's tagged and what's not.  It's pretty easy to see what's done, so just find a section that needs doing and start.  Separate the tags on separate lines.

Lately, I've been working on the FMB section.

OK, I don't have access yet, but when I do, I'll get started.  =)

Nightowl,

Feel free to link to the other game if you like.  I probably won't use it myself as it's just as easy for me copy the url of the pic to Google images and work off that as it would be to find it somewhere else but that's not to say that the other people tagging won't use it.

Hello all!

Just another newbie eagerly awaiting access so that we can get this tagging party started! lol

Newest members (welcome & thanks) have been given portrait tagging rights.

Please keep in mind the proposed changes above (msg #44).  Not set in stone at this stage, they're just things I thought of when doing a bunch of portrait tagging.  Would really appreciate feedback on that.

Female \ Creature \ Monster (and others, see below) really doesn't need the attention at this stage.  The number of tags in a category are as follows:

Category | Portraits | Tags | Tags per Portrait
---------+-----------+------+------------------
fh19     |        69 |    0 |  0.0
fh20     |        69 |    0 |  0.0
fsa      |       109 |    0 |  0.0
fsc      |        18 |    0 |  0.0
fsr      |         9 |    0 |  0.0
mh19     |       208 |    0 |  0.0
mmc      |       769 |    0 |  0.0
mmr      |       645 |    0 |  0.0
mms      |       213 |    0 |  0.0
msa      |       219 |    0 |  0.0
msc      |        57 |    0 |  0.0
msr      |        38 |    0 |  0.0
ncp      |       118 |    0 |  0.0
nfd      |        82 |    0 |  0.0
nfr      |        15 |    0 |  0.0
nfw      |        15 |    0 |  0.0
nmg      |         2 |    0 |  0.0
nmr      |         8 |    0 |  0.0
nms      |        24 |    0 |  0.0
nsa      |       182 |    0 |  0.0
msh      |       606 |    5 |  0.0
nsr      |       125 |    5 |  0.0
mmb      |       444 |   21 |  0.0
fmr      |       249 |   17 |  0.1
ncm      |       510 |  101 |  0.2
mcp      |        40 |    9 |  0.2
mcm      |       293 |   67 |  0.2
fsh      |       310 |  109 |  0.4
nsc      |        10 |    4 |  0.4
fmc      |       932 |  416 |  0.4
mh17     |       114 |   53 |  0.5
nsh      |        19 |    9 |  0.5
mmg      |       291 |  143 |  0.5
mfr      |       397 |  296 |  0.7
mfs      |       275 |  218 |  0.8
ffr      |       185 |  172 |  0.9
fms      |        40 |   39 |  1.0
mfw      |       450 |  509 |  1.1
mcl      |        11 |   13 |  1.2
fmg      |       238 |  294 |  1.2
ffs      |       457 |  609 |  1.3
nss      |        27 |   41 |  1.5
nmb      |        43 |   87 |  2.0
mh20     |       164 |  348 |  2.1
ncw      |        30 |   64 |  2.1
ncl      |       244 |  553 |  2.3
nh17     |        41 |  104 |  2.5
nmc      |        37 |  105 |  2.8
nca      |        58 |  193 |  3.3
mfd      |       503 | 2347 |  4.7
ffd      |       452 | 2206 |  4.9
nfs      |        17 |   90 |  5.3
ffw      |       161 |  869 |  5.4
fmb      |       604 | 3931 |  6.5
fh17     |        51 |  332 |  6.5
fcl      |         1 |    7 |  7.0
fcp      |        34 |  289 |  8.5
fcm      |       128 | 1117 |  8.7

Please concentrate on a the categories at the top of the table, thanks.  If you want to nominate a section for yourself then just say so.  The abbreviations above might not mean anything by looking at them, but once you go into the portrait area they'll hopefully make sense.  First letter is female/male/neutral, second letter is creatures/fantasy/historical/modern/sci-fi, last is the actual sections within.

Thanks again and happy tagging!

I'll get started on mh19 (although anyone else is certainly welcome to join me (= ).

What about portraits that seem to be in the wrong category?  There are a few that are supposedly 19th century that are more early 20th, like George O'Brien:

http://rpolportraits.shannara-rose.com/mh19008.jpg

Should we put the person's name in the tags if we find it?

Also, should "facepaint" be included somewhere?  Physical Traits, maybe?  Or should that just be under key words?

For attire, how about Vest, Headdress, and Tie?

Under Physical Traits, Sideburns?
This message was last edited by the player at 07:04, Thu 28 Feb 2013.

This message was deleted by the player at 06:47, Thu 28 Feb 2013.

I am somewhat loathe to suggest adding anything more to the tick boxes, because I very much doubt I am going back through the portraits that have already been tagged just to see if they should be checked.

If someone else wants to, by all means ... :)

We've got the place to type in keywords - my suggestion would be to put it there.

I've been putting in the person's name, artist name, movie name, character name -- pretty much whatever I identify that seems relevant.

Other than that, I only put what I think someone else might remember / search for (at least when I remember to be consistent.)

Portraits are put where they 'appear' to fit, and that decision is made solely by the portrait editor at the time.  Portraits are going to stay in the category they're in unless jase wants to do a massive reorganization at some point in the future.  Unless you think someone is going to do a keyword search by date, I wouldn't worry about category correcting in the above situation.

There've already been quite a few 'Huh, THAT's a man???' type moments for me in tagging the FMB selection.  They won't be moved to a different category but I am, however, clicking the Male & Androgynous checkboxes in those situations.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:51, Thu 28 Feb 2013.

I think we have to ask ourselves when adding new traits--how often would a user be searching for that specific trait?

Hairstyles: I like Bun/Tied Up. I would add Braids to Plaits, since I know people that wouldn't know what you mean by Plaits. I don't think we need both a single and a plural version. I would put them all under Plait(s)/Braid(s). As much as I hate to add new categories, what about ponytails/pigtails?

Attire: Helmet would probably be a good one to add. I'm not sure people would search specifically for Headband, Strapless Top, Necklace, and Choker often enough to make it worth it to add those. I feel the same way about Earrings. If you wanted to include something along those lines, I would suggest a general Jewelry tag. That way those who don't want any jewelry could click it to exclude all jewelry--but I'm not convinced that we need to add jewelry at all.

Armour: Since you have Leather Armour and Metallic Armour, changing the plain Armour to Armour (Other) is probably a good idea.

Should we add pipe to the Cigar/Cigarettes, making it Cigar/Cigarettes/Pipe?

I liked the expanded weapon categories, instead of Weapon (Other).

Mad Mick,
I think tie is already covered by the Suit category. I don't think people would search for tie separate from suit often enough to be worth its own category. Same with Vest and Sideburns, I don't think they'd come up often enough to be worth it.

I think Facepaint and Headdress are worth consideration, but I understand we don't want to keep adding categories and we can't include every detail.

I am with Nightowl on all points. I have used 'Facepaint' as a write in tag several times, but would make that 'faicepaint/makeup' slightly less precise, but it would add those few extra pictures to make it more worth it as a tag, and the two are essentially the same thing until you chose how to apply them.

99.9 % of the female modern/business, casual and gangster categories would have the tag of makeup/facepaint

Yeah, not too many of the mh19 do, but there are some real puzzlers in the first five or so portraits.  Heavy warpaint and impressive headdresses.  I'll just use a "facepaint" label for them.

I agree with most of what has recently been stated, and for the record I have no problem scanning back over my tags to add stuff if we edit the existing tags. I was going to spend the better part of my day tagging so I'm aware if changes are made I'll have to go back lol.

I could definitely see use of the "facepaint" though I wouldn't add makeup onto that, as Shannara stated just about all the women would start qualifying for having regular makeup on. I think "jewelry" could be good and "helmet" is a good idea but I must admit I'm less familiar with the less modern looking pictures so I'm not sure how much "headdress" would come up or not.

I still don't seem to have access.

I would define Face Paint as things like Mel Gibson in Braveheart or Heath Ledger in The Dark Knight. Some superheroes and villains use face paint instead of masks. Several of the Native American pictures have face paint, and we have soldiers in the gallery with camouflage paint. I'm not saying we have to add it, just that I think it's worth considering. I would find it useful when searching to be able to exclude the pictures with Face Paint.

Regarding hairstyles, what if we made it Braids/Ponytails/Pigtails? I think they're all similar enough, but maybe that's just me.

Headdress could be applied to several of the Native American portraits, as well as some of the fantasy ones. It could include crowns, tiaras, and headbands. A few examples:
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ffd390.jpg
http://rpol.creativelass.net/ffs026.jpg
http://rpolportraits.shannara-rose.com/mfw249.jpg

Tagging is fun!

Here's some guys with facepaint and headdresses.  I just put extra labels in the box at the bottom.

http://rpolportraits.shannara-rose.com/mh19002.jpg
http://rpolportraits.shannara-rose.com/mh19003.jpg
http://rpolportraits.shannara-rose.com/mh19004.jpg

Yeah, I understand what you mean about the facepaint, though I could see it going either way as whether or not we need a specific tag or if we'll just type it in freetext, I guess it'll just be up to Jase if he wants to add it or not lol

I could totally see putting in Braids/Ponytails/Pigtails though I know not all ponytails would be braided or vice versa, I think it gives the user a good enough idea. I think one way or another we need something to denote having their hair up in some fashion, sometimes it is hard to just limit it to length when all you can see is that it's obviously tied back.

For now, I am just doing the same thing as Mad Mick :)

(P.S. I went ahead and tackled all of fh19 :D)

In reply to Nightowl (msg # 73):

Oops, fixed!  (c;


May I suggest a slight change to facepaint, and that's to make it war/facepaint?

Out of time, will read more and reply later!

Yes, I like War/Facepaint

FYI, I finished fh20, fsc, and fsr

Hey everyone, I just wanted to say that if anyone wants to pick up where I left off at FMS:26 that would be nice. I came down with a stomach bug today and haven't been able to make any progress.

EDIT: Never mind, I started feeling better after I ate a banana and finished off the section. FMS: done. (Recheck potentially needed, especially one photo, you will know when you find it, but the basic tagging job is done.)
This message was last edited by the player at 00:29, Sat 02 Mar 2013.

Cranking through, thanks.

This might not be the right thread for this, but i was wondering. Tags are enabled for pictures, but they are almost not filled. I would gladly volunteer to add tags to the female portraits. What needs to be done so that I can do that?

Jase would need to give you access to the tagging feature.

Posted the below in 2013.  Seeming there's hopefully going to be some activity going on I think it'd be worth proposing these changes a second time (as they never were done).

---

I've been doing some tagging off and on, and have found some areas that I think need improving;

Hair Length/Style

• Currently:  Short | Medium/Bob | Long | Bald | Cropped | Spiked | Curls/Perm | Mohawk
• Add:  Bun/Tied Up | Plait/Braid (Single) | Plaits/Braids

Attire

• Currently:  Dress | Suit | Shirt | T-Shirt | Armour | None Visible | Bikini/Bathing Suit | Costume | Gown | Coat/Cloak | Hat/Cap | Hood | Turban | Mask | Scarf | Leather Armour | Metallic Armour
• Add:  Headband | Helmet | Strapless Top | Necklace | Choker | Shield

Note:  Is there some way we can get rid of the plain "armour" option?  Maybe "Armour (Leather)", "Armour (Metallic)", "Armour (Other)"?


Phsyical Traits

• Currently:  Piercings | Mustache | Beard | Tattoo | Eye Patch | Glasses | Wings
• Change:  Piercings -> Piercings (Other)
• Add:  Piercings (Earring(s))

Equipment and Accompaniments

• Currently:  Sword | Gun | Bow | Staff | Weapon (Other) | Cigar/Cigarettes
• Add:  Mace | (Battle)Axe | Hammer | Crossbow | Dagger(s)/Shortsword(s) | Blade (Other) | Blunt (Other) | Ranged (Other)
• Remove:  Weapon (Other)

This message was last edited by the GM at 04:15, Sun 08 Jan 2017.

My quick thoughts on additions and/or tweaks:

Plaits:  Not sure how common the term is in other countries, but in the US it's generally braids instead of plaits.  Plaits might confuse some people.

Add:
Corset (I like bustier, too, but it's less common

Head scarf: the general scarf tends to call up visions of something tied around the neck.  This would cover the more common pirate or hippie type of scarf.

Veil: definitely different than a mask

Shield: some of the pics show one

In reply to Evil Empryss (msg # 83):

Edited my post.

Added braid.  Wondering now if we really need to distinguish if there's one or multiple.

On a similar vein, should we also have "ponytail" and "pigtails"?

Corset -- can't see why this can't be added.  "Corset/Bustier"?

Scarf.. almost added Scarf (Head) and Scarf (Neck), but do we really need two options just for scarves?  Seems a bit excessive.  Can we just have both covered by the one option?  Or is a scarf around the head just a headband, which I've already suggested?

Veil -- Good suggestion.  So we make it "Mask/Veil", or are they worthy of their own options?  Pretty different so I'm leaning toward two options.

Shield is there under attire, though a case could certainly be made for having it under equipment.

I like having only one Plaits/Braids selection -- no need for single or multiple.  I think pigtails generally fall under braids and shouldn't need its own section.

I like your 'Corset/Bustier' combo.

I think for brevity's sake Mask/Veil is acceptable and makes it easy to tag (rather than having to fuss over exactly which it is if it's something covering the lower half of the face).

Damn, missed the shield because I was looking in equipment.  I recommend placing it there instead of in Attire, since you don't exactly wear a shield as such.  My litmus test for clothing is whether or not you'd go to bed in it.  Armor may be uncomfortable, but you technically could sleep in it.

Headbands are a distinctly different item from a headscarf (or head scarf, depending on how you write it).  Headbands (like ffr #165) go over the head from ear to ear to hold hair back.  Head scarves are generally tied around the forehead (ffr #184) or cover the top of the head completely (ffr #005).  Actually, headbands are common in a lot of anime, so a tag for those might be useful.

And how about adding Crown/Circlet and Helm (or helmet)?  Someone looking for royalty pics would find those tags helpful.

I looked at the State of Keywords thread. Started off in the Female Modern section. This is something I've wondered for awhile, pardon if it's been asked in another thread: What is the distinction between FMB, FMC, FMG and FMR? Or what was the original intent? There seems to be a lot of crossover.


Just on first glance of the first page of FMB, some are obviously in scrubs, suits or a uniform. Others, I think I'd have to be familiar with that particular character/image or the uniform. For instance, the very first image is of Jennifer Aniston in Office Space. I recognize the actress and the kitchsy sort of waitress uniform. What if instead of Business, the entire category was changed to Profession or Carreer? Then the tags could be related to the real-world professions gleaned from the image. Keywords would relate to the profession/career path in addition to appearance: Medical/Science, Nun, Corporate (to round up all those ladies in power suits), Dancer. Telemarketer. I haven't gone through it all, but these are the ones that jump out. Then we could sort out Commander Ivanova, Sir Integra Wingates Hellsing, Emma Frost. Creating new categories would find home for these ladies whose career paths are not quite yet attainable.

FMS seems to be well sorted (perhaps a couple outliers). Those images could join Female Modern Profession (if they are of modern military images).

Thoughts?
This message was last edited by the player at 09:10, Sun 08 Jan 2017.

Plaits/Braids - Check.  Plait(s)/Braid(s)?  Getting too complex?

Pigtails - I disagree they're braids, or are normally braided.  Can be, but not necessarily.  http://rpol.creativelass.net/fcm107.jpg, http://rpol.creativelass.net/fmb349.jpg and http://rpol.creativelass.net/fmb543.jpg.  http://rpol.creativelass.net/fh19001.jpg would be pigtails and braided.  They're from searching for "pigtails".  So 75% not braided.

Ponytail - ?

Corset/Bustier - Check.

Mask/Veil - Either combo or separate, but will be added in one way or another (will wait on more feedback before deciding).

Shield - Add to equipment.

Handband - To be added.  Maybe as "Head Band/Scarf"?

Helm - Have suggested Helmet under attire, one and the same really?  "Helm(et)"?

Crown/Circlet - Could add that as well.  Have we encountered enough to make it worthwhile?

That's something I should mentioned, my suggestions in message 82 were after doing a few hundred portraits.  I kept on encountering a practical need for my suggestions.  I'd rather we add in keywords that we have a demonstrated need for, not a theoretical nice to have.  No point, for example, having shield as an option if we've only got 2 portraits with a shield.

Happy to theorise a few extra keywords that are obvious, but otherwise I'd rather we look at keywords you've encountered a practical need for rather than more stuff we dream up with our own personal bias.

Eggy, as for FMB, FMC, FMG and FMR etc, that's just the categories whoever was putting them in at the time thought they should go.  Really has zero bearing over the keywords, though most of those should end up being female, and fairly modern!  Could think of it as batch1, batch2, batch3 etc.

As for the original intent, it was so long ago those particular stone tablets have crumbled to dust, but it obviously seemed a fairly logical division at the time.  Whatever the reason that's what we've inherited now, and with the gallery now being so huge we really need to rely on keyword searches, rather than some loose group, to find our portraits.  That's where you all come in!

If your asking which section a modern portrait should be put in then (A) wrong thread, this is about keywords and (B) just ask yourself, is this business attire?  Then FMB.  Casual?  FMC.  Etc.  Judgement call really and as long as it's not blatantly incorrect then nothing to worry about.

Thanks! I'll be back with suggestions for the group.

I've only been suggesting keywords for things I've seen a lot of in my time digging thru the gallery for character pics. Granted, I tend to focus primarily upon female portraits, but I've seen plenty of my suggestions to make the tags worthwhile.

Ponytail: oops, forgot to respond on that one. I like it and have seen plenty.

Pigtails: you have convinced me, sir.

Culturally-inclusive question: should Hijab be included with Headscarf and Niqab with Veil?  There are at least three portraits I encountered yesterday in the ffr gallery alone that fit the standards for them.

Headband/Headscarf/Hijab?  That would pretty much cover everything fabric-y that goes on someone's head.

Mask/Veil/Niqab would do the same for face coverings.

I agree with Hijab going with scarves and headbands as well as Niqab going along with veil and mask. A portrait I saw (found it! fmb685) could be a Chador, but since it was a close up of a face, it was hard to tell. That could go under Niqab/Veil/Mask, too.

One thing I don't agree with is the options being soley under Female > Fantasy. The portraits I saw were under Female > Modern.
This message was last edited by the player at 13:34, Sun 08 Jan 2017.

I think that headscarf/hijab functionally covers the chador as there are so many different styles for it (just over the head with some hair showing, all hair covered but no throat covering, or even all hair and all skin to the shoulders covered).  That, and unless it is more than just a face view it would be hard for most to tell the difference between a hijab and a chador. Actually, it could be argued that a chador might fit better with the cloak section, since it is predominately a body covering that happens to be draped over the head as well. The women I know that wear them always have a hijab under the chador to cover their hair.

And I wasn't saying that the options were only or should be only under fantasy, just that fantasy rogues  was the gallery I happened to be looking in last night when I saw them.

I've found this portrait under Female > Fantasy > Rogue.

I agree with Chadors going along with Cloaks if they are fully visible. This why I asked about the categories. Is everyone in a cloak going under Rogue?

I think you're confusing tags with categories.  Any pic in any category can get a cloak tag if the pic warrants it.  Or do you mean to say that cloaks should be in attire?

Oh!  Are you asking if every pic with a cloak should be categorized as a fantasy rogue when we sort them to different galleries?  Heck no!  There are plenty of styles of cloaks that would fit other categories. It is the general feel of the pic as a whole that should determine which category it fits into.

But like jase said, we're talking keywords/tags in this thread, not categories. :-)

In reply to Evil Empryss (msg # 94):

Oh thank you! I'd missed that part of Jase's post. I'll stick to the topic from here on out. There's a thread on Categories. It's pretty old, but I'll bump it up so I can keep from contaminating this thread.

Keywords apply to every portrait, there's no distinction.  You have to forget categories when thinking about keywords.

So (I think) we now have;

Hair Length/Style

• Currently:  Short | Medium/Bob | Long | Bald | Cropped | Spiked | Curls/Perm | Mohawk
• Add:  Bun/Tied Up | Plait/Braid | Pigtails | Ponytail |

Attire

• Currently:  Dress | Suit | Shirt | T-Shirt | Armour | None Visible | Bikini/Bathing Suit | Costume | Gown | Coat/Cloak | Hat/Cap | Hood | Turban | Mask | Scarf | Leather Armour | Metallic Armour
• Change:  Mask -> Mask/Veil/Niqab
• Add:  Headband/Headscarf/Hijab | Helmet | Strapless Top | Necklace | Choker | Corset/Bustier

Note:  Is there some way we can get rid of the plain "armour" option?  Maybe "Armour (Leather)", "Armour (Metallic)", "Armour (Other)"?


Phsyical Traits

• Currently:  Piercings | Mustache | Beard | Tattoo | Eye Patch | Glasses | Wings
• Change:  Piercings -> Piercings (Other)
• Add:  Piercings (Earring(s))

Equipment and Accompaniments

• Currently:  Sword | Gun | Bow | Staff | Weapon (Other) | Cigar/Cigarettes | Shield
• Add:  Mace | (Battle)Axe | Hammer | Crossbow | Dagger(s)/Shortsword(s) | Blade (Other) | Blunt (Other) | Ranged (Other)
• Remove:  Weapon (Other)

One thing I'm not sure on is "Mask/Veil/Niqab" and "Headband/Headscarf/Hijab".  While I don't want to be culturally insensitive these are getting a little long and is it adding further clarification by having them?  There's possibly more variations (of mask, veil and headscarf) that we haven't even touched on yet, if we really want to be culturally inclusive we would have a very long list.

Slippery slope.  Does my Armour (Metallic) now become "Armour (Metallic)/Tankō/Keikō"?  Wouldn't want to leave out our Oriental cousins!

I know I can seem a naysayer, but I put my own suggestions through the same wringer.  We need to make sure what we're adding in actually adds in value.  You could easily reply with "Well a hijab covers the head and shoulders, so would it be headscarf or scarf, or both?  I think it's sufficiently unique to require it's own mention".  I want to discuss, not exert my will!

Btw, remember we have the free text entry.

Personally ... quite agree, we're not really trying to go all thesaurus here and find every variation on a theme.  So for my 5.5 cents, stick with Mask/Veil and Headscarf (I wouldn't even bother with headband - given the medium, it'd probably be more useful to specify Hat, pointy for all the wizards out there ! <grins> ).

Armour ... again, yes, I do like the idea of Armour | Leather Armour | Metallic Armour becoming Armour (leather), Armour (metal) and Armour (other) ... though I still think of armour as equipment and the rest of the attire as clothing (ok, it's becoming a fine line with scarf etc).  My definition would be "can you buy it in a clothing store", now I think on it, which would keep Veil in but move Mask to equipment.

I do believe that you can get earrings that clip on ... so I'd prefer to see Piercings and Earrings as separate tags.

Oh, I probably am a naysayer.  Just forewarnin' you ... ;>

We should add "Uniform" to the list. Most of the soldiers and 19th / 17th century portraits wear uniforms.

While this is being updated, can you change "Phsyical Traits" to "Physical Traits"?  =)

Agreed, but I dare you to tell from any of our portraits.  (c;

Just seems cleaner having Piercings (Earring) and Piercings (Other) as it's two distinct (and mutually exclusive) options.  Otherwise are pierced earrings supposed to tick both earring and piercings?



No objections from me!  Do we need more granularity?


In reply to Mad Mick (msg # 99):

Wow, nobody's picked that up until now.  Tisk tisk!  (c;

<grins> good point.  :>

I guess that while earrings are piercings, there's a whole world of difference between an ear piercing and any other kind - I'd regard the first is a fashion statement, the second as a lifestyle choice.   I see the word piercing and I think metal studs, I see the word earring and I think accessory.  Ear piercings to me says additional studs though the ear, but not earring.

So I'd figure it'd be clear enough to just tick earring if the picture shows earrings, without regard to whether they're piercings or not.

But having neither earrings nor piercings myself, there's a chance I don't know what I'm talking about. <grins>

Uniform is definitely a good idea.  I guess the question jase is asking is whether that should be maybe Uniform (Military), Uniform (Police/Fire), Uniform (Other) ?

What about a "scar" or "scar/eyepatch" keyword? I know there are some portraits that feature that, but I don't know for certain whether there are enough to warrant it. I just know I've hunted deliberately, once or twice, to find portraits for, like, one-eyed characters and similar. Does anyone think that would be helpful?

I guess I am!  Now that I see it listed out like that I think "Uniform" would be enough.


Eye patch is already under physical traits, so that's definitely a good idea!

Not sure about scars, are there that many?  If not then just put "scar" in the text entry.

That's what I meant: Since I'm not sure how many there are, if there are a relatively small number it might be better to just make the category "scar/eyepatch" rather than adding "scar." I know there are some, I just don't know about the proportion relative to the total number of portraits. I'll have to browse for an estimate.

"Scar" I'd imagine would be pretty rare.  What I'd suggest is this; just put it in as part of the free-text entry.  We can search for that later and if there's a lot of hits we can make it a defined (checkbox) option.  If it's few we can leave it as-is.

We need to add wrestles to the catagories. We have a BUNCH of them.

How do the categories look right now as far as tags go?  Which categories need tagging?

The problem with adding new TAGS is we would want to re-organize the old images ... so take WRESTLERS as a new tag.

There are two dozen old wrestlers in the old SI-FI HUMAN tag. Moving them to WRESTLERS HUMAN would make those images in peoples games disappear.

So hold off on tagging for now?

I never did much tagging, but I was going through the Male Historical 19th century once upon a time.

Jace is probably right. Tag everything now and they will search easier but leave the old files as we really can't do anything with them as it would disrupt old games and images.