ShadoPrism
 member, 1267 posts
 OCGD-Obsessive-Compulsive
 Gamer-Disorder
Sun 25 Aug 2019
at 03:08
Have you had a GM like this?
In reply to Aleph Null (msg # 1434):

Sounded like that GM was power tripping - kind of GM that it is just better to avoid as they are not mentally mature enough to run a game. Or much of anything else.
The massive back story request tends to come from such GMs in my experience - it's a huge red flag. So now you know better.
Brianna
 member, 2197 posts
Sun 25 Aug 2019
at 06:41
Have you had a GM like this?
In reply to Aleph Null (msg # 1434):

12 page backstory??  I would have been out of there!  !2 page history is what you get after you play the character for months!
Isida KepTukari
 member, 296 posts
 Elegant! Arrogant! Smart!
Sun 25 Aug 2019
at 07:13
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
Welp, at this point I've dropped plot breadcrumbs, plot pebbles, plot bricks, and plot anvils.  I debated applying a clue-by-four to the narrative but decided it wasn't worth it.  I couldn't make the plot-bait more tempting than if I covered it with glitter and sparkles.  If they want to wander off into Nowheresville, I will just have to make up a new adventure in Nowheresville...  *sigh*

This message was last edited by the user at 09:33, Sun 25 Aug.

tibiotarsus
 member, 63 posts
 Hopepunk with a shovel
Sun 25 Aug 2019
at 09:11
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
...have the key to the Nowhereville situation kidnapped by the forces of your original intended campaign? It sounds like you need to be subtle, because your players have a suspicion they can't explore once they get on well-marked highway Plot This Way...still, maybe do a bit of sounding out as to what they want, as they might not have been into the main plot anyway. Alternatively, just let 'em run off over there and let the consequences of whatever they ignored play out, it'll be great!

@Shannara - Aye, I know that all too well, but there was mention of giving the friend a budget in there, and if it's in the bank account it'll just evaporate like a puff of steam, was all I meant. Making money visible has a strong psychological effect - I've heard of a documentary where a family began pulling themselves out of chronic debt after being instructed to put what money they had (coins and whatever notes friends lent) into clear glass jars, and I've seen it work on two previous over-spenders with that binary all/none concept of money myself.
seraphmoon
 member, 98 posts
 "Plays well with others."
 Talks lots. Reads more.
Sun 25 Aug 2019
at 18:10
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
In reply to Isida KepTukari (msg # 1439):

Is the plot you've dropped hints for location-specific, or can you adapt it to taking place in Nowheresville? Or is it more of a "I need to hire a group to rescue the kidnapped prince! / We're not interested in rescuing kidnapped princes." sort of situation?
Isida KepTukari
 member, 297 posts
 Elegant! Arrogant! Smart!
Mon 26 Aug 2019
at 05:43
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
They've already got the first part of the plot well in hand, I was just trying to get them some answers to many of their questions in a timely fashion (play by post being what it is, too much time passes and people can forget why they were in an area in the first place). But if they don't want to check out where I was dropping clues (which would be the very logical place to search for answers), I'll just move maligned plot elsewhere in the world...

This message was last edited by the user at 05:44, Mon 26 Aug.

NowhereMan
 member, 329 posts
Thu 29 Aug 2019
at 10:07
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
In reply to Isida KepTukari (msg # 1442):

As the founder and primary resident of Nowheresville, I'd appreciate a bit of warning before you drop any wandering murderhobos into my neck of the woods, Isida.
ShadoPrism
 member, 1269 posts
 OCGD-Obsessive-Compulsive
 Gamer-Disorder
Fri 30 Aug 2019
at 03:49
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
In reply to NowhereMan (msg # 1443):

Your neck of the woods is roughtly the size of Russia, so you need not worry to much about the murder hobo's finding you.
NowhereMan
 member, 332 posts
Fri 30 Aug 2019
at 04:26
You can lead an adventuring group to the tavern...
Oh, like that's ever stopped a murderhobo. If it was deemed plot-important that it stay alive, they'd find and kill the one single living bacteria on Mars, and they'd do it within about twelve minutes.
Kessa
 member, 598 posts
 Dark Army:
 Out to Lunch
Mon 9 Sep 2019
at 21:45
Them good ole days....
I hate, hate, hate the way job applications are processed these days. Everything is snipped down into tiny pieces, shoved through a filter program, and then a few lucky apps get spat out to hiring managers if they happen to have a few random key words tensed just so.

Not only does it take forever to reformat, or adjust a resume because the filter doesn't know how to handle tenses or synonyms, but even if you have them, if the search parameters aren't set up correctly, it might not even matter. Or, even better... the sites that do this PLUS ask you to retype the entire resume. Yes, cut and paste is a thing, but you still have to go back over it again to make sure it looks good and doesn't contain a bunch of '&&;' errors and it's usually not just a single cut/ paste, but a hundred individual boxes that, yes, I can probably retype faster than copy/ pasting anyway. And let's not forget software and webpage errors that are there to conveniently lock you out half-way through an application, or buttons that don't work like they're supposed to.

Yes, it's beautiful to see hundreds of resumes being submitted for a job in the internet, but a lot of the bad ones get shot through because of search terms and a lot of the good ones never even make it to being printed for an initial human glance. Not only does it significantly extend my time working on every individual resume, but I honestly believe it wastes hiring employees time and often provides sub-par applicants.

Why can't I just walk into a place, smile at someone, and hand them a piece of paper? I have literally never been turned down for a job I've applied to that way. </rant>
GreenTongue
 member, 879 posts
 Game Archaeologist
Tue 10 Sep 2019
at 10:39
Them good ole days....
In reply to Kessa (msg # 1446):

As there is usually far more people wanting a job than there are openings, the goal is to reduce the number of applicants that the hiring person has to look at.
These filter programs work well at doing that.

I'm not sure the qualification actually matter, as most new hires have to be trained anyway.
Kessa
 member, 599 posts
 Dark Army:
 Out to Lunch
Tue 10 Sep 2019
at 18:31
Re: Them good ole days....
Yes, the filters definitely do cut down the pool, the way they do so is where my frustrations lie. Often having to toss in key terms in the verbatim style of the listing makes resumes sound worse than they would normally and horribly repetitive. I don't have an issue with trying to implement a filtering system, but some of these are so bad I almost feel like they do more harm than good.

GreenTongue:
In reply to Kessa (msg # 1446):

I'm not sure the qualification actually matter, as most new hires have to be trained anyway.

I have to disagree here. If this is the case, why not just hire the first person who applies? Qualifications definitely matter. That's the whole point of taking multiple applicants, to find the one who is most qualified, or otherwise the best fit. I could theoretically have no experience with home appraisal, but toss in a an application because I like the salary being offered, figuring I'll figure out the basics later when other people have been doing it for years and don't need to take extra time to figure out anything.
GreenTongue
 member, 880 posts
 Game Archaeologist
Tue 10 Sep 2019
at 19:10
Re: Them good ole days....
In reply to Kessa (msg # 1448):

I guess I just have a sour taste because I once made the mistake of taking off on my lunch break to go to an interview for basically the job I was already doing that they were going to make permanent and better paid.
Because it was inter-company and I was on my lunch break I didn't take time to "Dress the part".

A total nub that I had to train got the job.

Found out that I didn't have the right image for the job because I was wearing my work clothes to the interview.

So, yeah, qualifications are not the deciding factor surprisingly often.
ShadoPrism
 member, 1270 posts
 OCGD-Obsessive-Compulsive
 Gamer-Disorder
Tue 10 Sep 2019
at 21:00
Re: Them good ole days....
In reply to Kessa (msg # 1448):

Years ago, before the internet stuff - I kept running in to the problem of 'need x amount of experience' for a job. One of my favorites on that for pure stupid was a company wanting 10 years experience in a field that had only been around 5 years. Litterally did not exist prior to that time cause the technology did not exist. I had at that time 3 years experience in that field - could not get the HR people to understand why they could not get someone with as much experience as they wanted.
Now days, most every job is apply online and hope someone see's it and has enough brains to actually check a resume - seen to many people with fake online resume's get jobs they are so not qualified for just cause they know how to work the system.
BFink
 member, 61 posts
Wed 11 Sep 2019
at 09:49
Re: Them good ole days....
In reply to ShadoPrism (msg # 1450):

Yup, these days knowing how to properly (and successfully) apply for jobs appears to be a separate qualification. At the same time almost everyone working in HR is so dumb that my mind cannot comprehend it.
Yaztromo
 supporter, 289 posts
Wed 11 Sep 2019
at 11:52
Re: Them good ole days....
There is also another issue creeping up majestically, i.e. the compulsive appliers that do apply to literally any job posting on internet (obviously without even reading the job requests), just because they don't have to pay for a stamp for each application. This is spamming massively the tools, that show often hundreds of applications from people that has nothing to do with that job opening.
Having to put a stamp on the envelope of each application used to be a good enough filter.
praguepride
 member, 1506 posts
 "Hugs for the Hugs God!"
 - Warhammer Fluffy-K
Fri 13 Sep 2019
at 22:32
Re: Them good ole days....
A buddy of mine quit is job to make a board game. I wanted to try and support him so I demoed it and came back with a ton of feedback. Now granted it is pre-alpha but I had some basic tips like increase the font size on the cards because currently his cards used tiny font and graphics so the majority of the card was blank. I then explained some parts of the rules that were either confusing or perhaps in the rulebook should be reordered.

Anyway I wrote him paragraphs of in depth feedback.

His response was basically a bullet-by-bullet response basically saying that it's not wrong. Now not in a constructive way like "The reason X is here is because I tried it over here and it made things worse so this is the result of other feedback" but instead it was like "Well its pre-alpha so it doesn't matter" or "Well other people didn't mind it that way"

Like you do you dood but that's the last bit of feedback I'm giving you.
katrionea
 member, 8 posts
Tue 17 Sep 2019
at 15:18
Re: Them good ole days....
In reply to praguepride (msg # 1453):

That's too bad. In my experience, it's not every day that a friend is willing to provide in-depth feedback instead of just offering vague praise.

I don't have the right mindset for game dev, but as an artist, I can safely say that constructive criticism is always more valuable than praise. Pinning my picture to the metaphorical fridge and telling me its the bestest ever doesn't help me; telling me that I chose an awkward color palette that makes everything look washed out, or something like that, does help me, since I can re-examine my work with that comment in mind.
V_V
 member, 851 posts
 Remember me as V, just V
 My journey is near an end
Tue 17 Sep 2019
at 17:50
Re: Them good ole days....
In reply to praguepride (msg # 1453):

I can completely sympathize. You want your buddy to succeed, do what he enjoys for a profit, and help them overcome potential pitfalls. Then...they just want to be told they're doing everything right, or want to find criticism with your critiques.

My one time buddy did this once (only he didn't quit his job/s).


Spoiler for what happened to me: (Highlight or hover over the text to view)
It was my birthday, and I invited him over to celebrate by playing a board game. He brought over what he and, apparently, his OTHER buddy were creating. I played it, and it seemed to have steep learning curve, but a lot like Legendary. It's big draw he kept pushing was "The enemy starts with everything they need, and if you don't stop them they WILL win" which meant it was more of memorizing the deck and playing through a precise sequence of motions, rather than making strategy based on a purely random environment. Essentially, the enemy would get sequential bumps to their power, but you KNEW that no matter what you were going to face the same modifier by like turn 15. So I told him I didn't like the game very much, because it felt like many of the turns were spent just letting the villain buff himself, while the players were struggling to just move, even if doing nothing else, to confront the enemy. That it was superfluous what the players did, because if they rushed on, it would take minimum six turns, and they would be severely under-equipped, whereas if they spent some time equipping and some moving, they would likewise be under-equipped, because it would take longer to move, and therefore the enemy would have longer to just equip himself. The only sensible thing to do, was just equip, and ignore the fires going on in the city, wherein you could beat the villain despite the city in shambles, because the villain would come to you.

Well, he didn't like this. Saying "Well my hero has a special card that lets him move"  Okay, well why don't you just make ALL heroes do that, and give some other level strategy. "Well, this is an example of choosing the right hero" So after about half an hour of criticizing it, I gave up and asked if we could play something else. To which he said "C'mon, it needs to be playtested. Besides, we only played like five times, you'll do better next time. We haven't even played on the hard mode!" So I had to coolly tell him it was my birthday and we had already played the game five times, and maybe trying something else would be a breath of fresh air. So he just said "okay, I'll just playtest it myself" which meant him playing solo...at my birthday, and we had to tell him we needed to serve the food on the table.



So my experience was far more due to circumstance and who I was dealing with, but nonetheless, it felt like a waste of my time, and was very much unappreciated. So I know how that is. Mike asked how expensive is was to print, and I told him, to which he said "Ookay, I guess I'll just print them out of my bubble printer" and when I told him that would lower the entire bid anyone would pay, he said "No it won't!" to which I just shrugged.

Some people just want to be told they're doing it right, and only have confirmation bias.

Needless to say, because of the exasperation of Mike's attitude, and other things he did that were impolite, Mike and I are no longer buddies.

You don't seem to have extenuating problems, and yeah, probably best not to waste time trying to give criticism if he's more interested in someone else's opinion, evidenced by some of the quotes you shared.
V_V
 member, 868 posts
 Remember me as V, just V
 My journey is near an end
Fri 18 Oct 2019
at 18:38
Re: Them good ole days....
I found myself in a familiar place last night. Having been away from my abusive family for going on ten years, I learned to forgive, rather than hold onto poisonous hatred.

It was my brother's birthday, and I invited him over. I asked him what music he wanted to listen to, and he asked to turn on an artist from our youth, Pink, that's having a resurgence currently. Well, after the get together, it made me sad.

 Today, I was reminded of what few people I have in my life, and the fact I resorted to trying to befriend someone who was one of my worst aggressors. I got back onto my computer, and the very next song by Pink, Happy, was paused. I never listened to her before. This song just hit me, and I don't know if it was a crushing blow to level my resolve, or just to build level foundation.

It makes me sad. Makes me want to cry. Makes me want to get angry, just to stop being sad. Makes me want to give up on trying to make friends, because I've burned so many bridges.
tibiotarsus
 member, 78 posts
 Hopepunk with a shovel
Fri 18 Oct 2019
at 19:15
Re: Them good ole days....
Cry for a bit if you need to: it's what tears are for, biologically speaking, a means for excess emotional chemistry to leave the system. Angry gets dangerous unless it's productively channelled, and yes I'm a hypocrite on all the above, but I'm trying not to be.

There's no shame in being tricked by someone specialising in deception, either - you treated them as a good person would, reacted as normal to what they showed you, and were attacked. If a viper doesn't rattle and resembles a vine, not your fault for grabbing it. As for making friends...volunteer, if you can, or make some kind of art that will put you in touch with a community of makers. The more interest-sharing potential friends around, the less chance of siezing on one interest-sharing person who's a bad 'un, at least not without others noticing.
V_V
 member, 870 posts
 Remember me as V, just V
 My journey is near an end
Fri 18 Oct 2019
at 23:07
Re: Them good ole days....
In reply to tibiotarsus (msg # 1457):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bs63f-uFIc0
tibiotarsus
 member, 79 posts
 Hopepunk with a shovel
Sat 19 Oct 2019
at 08:34
Re: Them good ole days....
I can't watch at present, but as for the title, heh, me too. When I was 11 I tried to make friends with a girl on the way to school by offering her half-cooked bread my mother had given me (she was trying to find something as cheap as supermarket bread or better and was just that bad at making it. I often got sent to school with crackers for lunch)...when she understandably ran away from the weird potato child offering her dough I spent the rest of secondary school going in an hour early so I wouldn't meet her on the road. I have a vow not to end up in an abusive relationship like my parents', because that's all that could overcome my kind of loyalty.

It came into play last year when someone I thought was a friend for nearly half my life got a new BFF with politics incompatible with my existence (literally, dude said it was "not okay" that people like me exist...how he planned to have society make us not exist wasn't clear but it was probably something like electrocution or gas, these people aren't super imaginative) and, well, ADD lack of self-awareness and tendency to take on the social colour of their surroundings...as soon as defending me was against "friend"'s self-interest (he had a game going with similar politics as background) it was frankly quite terrifying how fast I got turned on. I wished "friend" a good life and broke clean. Tore a hole in my heart to be sure, had to take a route to work that didn't pass the easy jump in the deep water under the W____ ferry for a while, but you know what? Alive people get to make more friends, and I found someone - through making, in this case GMing - who was like me in many several ways but had had a good life. It's possible, it is evidently possible, so long as you're an alive person.

So, I work in a vocational profession (archaeology pays less than bricklaying) which is like volunteering but getting paid, and I still have friends from an early 2000s writing site, so that's where the advice is coming from. I know that feel, my dude. Also, though? Make friends with your local crows. Just a little bit of breakfast crusts or whatever, not enough to cause fights or dependencies, same place same time, and bow to the couple whose territory it is. Don't look back after putting food down until you're well out of grabbing range, at least for a while. You will know when you've made it to crow-friend when they are happy to come close and give you a name.

I'm Bread Hands (or possibly Bread Grab or Bread Ungrasp, the first bit is definitely bread, the other call I think to do with wariness of how humans use hands, I've heard it as a caution when moving through a murder picking things off the ground) and my crow friends make a point, once every year, of bringing their babies to my window so I can see them. It's a joy.
V_V
 member, 871 posts
 Script like razors
 Absence like wire
Sat 19 Oct 2019
at 19:31
Re: Them good ole days....
I can empathize with all that, especially having read your Rmail before this. I will note, I DO have Aspegers, it wasn't just a "I feel like that" but I feel exactly like that. The severity and state of doing a million rights things, and then falling off the wagon to do a million little wrong things, is what lost my friendships. If you watch the video it'll make more sense.

As for feeding birds. I'm actually not much of bird person, but I do like other animals, and have bonded with quite a few. A bit of ornithoology advice though, try seeds. Seeds, unlike grains beaten to flour, will not wreak havoc on their digestion. I know you mean well, but bread is large and fluffy, even in small bits. It has them feel sated, without a great deal of caloric content. Just like fish, and farm mammals, bread isn't very good for them.

there's a place I LOVE to go in spring to Autmon, called Diana Rose. It's farmstead in Johnson County, and they have rescued birds, goats, horses (though you can only look at the horses) and ducks and geese. Sometimes, every now ands then, they'll have an artificial pong with koi of frogs in them. Mostly though I love to feed to ducks and especially the goats. They have feed vending machines, and I always spend about $5 while there, and make sure to leave clumps out of reach so kids that's parents won't "waste" the money have the chance to find the feed and have the same wonderful experience. It's another kind of experience to put down neat little piles of feed, and see a child "find" the pile and make the link that it's some "spilled" feed. It gives me such a smile. Sadly, until my health improves, I shouldn't be going out for long periods. Diana Rose has tendency to have me overdo myself.
tibiotarsus
 member, 80 posts
 Hopepunk with a shovel
Sun 20 Oct 2019
at 16:34
Re: Them good ole days....
So do I (sorry if that wasn't clear, I know it's annoying when neurotypical folk break in with stuff like 'I totally understand why you had to flee the library or break down hyperventilating and crying when they moved some shelves without telling you, creating critical True/Not True conflict against the mental map of 'library' in your brain  - if I see books askew I have to straighten them! [smiley]' - empaths, right? They're trying to help but...uh, no).

Watching the video...I do get where he's coming from, have been there in some respects, and I think that's either adult diagnosis there (i.e. learning to camoflage to stop getting beaten up in the wild and developing that urge to 'pass'), or maybe that he's not part of another minority that is always naturally aware that different people have different needs, because they're the only ones that'll see to them. If he'd been able to present as a weird person then he'd probably meet other weird peeps who would definitely be there for him.

I hope he's a freak for something like re-enactment or model trains, one of those making hobbies that a) attract peculiar folk and b) will get his work appreciated properly and not taken for granted. Losing shame at one's existence takes work and can be really hard, especially if it's an early or religious narrative embedded deep in there, but it leads to a better life so long as you're not hurting anyone.


As for bread, as someone who grew up around birds, part-raised a baby crow, and as a specialist in very dead birds* who needs to know about things like chronic malnutrition for paleopathology...crows aren't ducks (who need a lot more green and protein than carbohydrate, and would suffer from a diet proportion of daily bread) or songbirds (who would fill up dangerously on bread or porridge) and I'm not feeding unseeded white/shop bread; my friends with the cast-iron stomachs are in no danger from a small snack a day, and are doubtless getting far worse from the burger van down by the roundabout. Props for thinking things through, though! I'd never want to encourage playing silly buggers with wildlife health, and it's good to call it out if you think someone might be doing that. I suppose given my qualification above - this being a public forum - that I should add that it's bad to kidnap fallen baby birds unless they're in imminent danger of death from injuries sustained in falling and/or a present predator (as that one was) and you can't put them back in the nest. Don't do it, hypothetical passing reader who doesn't know!

I'm glad you know somewhere to go, but sad it's relatively high-cost in time, energy and cash. Could you volunteer there? If you had a definite few hours a week there out of hours you might be less tempted to stay a long time when it's full of humans.

If not...depending on your health problems maybe consider something like knitting or chainmail fabrication: something that's cheap to at least get into, is useful, engages your hands and brain just enough not to be thinking on all the bad things you've ever done, how you're just bad at being alive etc.etc. (what my brain does, anyway), and has a visible and desirable (saleable, even, once everyone you know has been gifted one) result. I like to make pretty mobiles, wooden spoons and horrible monsters, and modifying old/charity shop clothes into things that make me feel pleased to wear.

Lastly! Please know these are suggestions based on what's worked for me, not me thinking "this will definitely fix all the things and V_V should do them". So. Sorry for all the words, I hope some are of use there.


*my username is from what I was holding at the time I was coming up with a handle for RPoL - bit cooler than 'desk' or 'digitalcalipers', also to hand