LunarKitty
 member, 388 posts
Sat 11 May 2019
at 04:45
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Speaking of. I've been thinking about getting Solo on Blu-Ray. The thing is, I haven't actually watched it. -Star Wars movies are supposed to last at least a month in theaters **** it!! By the time I had time to go the only function I could find was 25 miles away at midnight!! This Kitty can't drive!!-. Should I or shouldn't I? (If it helps I'm a child of the prequels and I loved Rogue one, but mostly watched the sequels as it is a chance to have my brother take me to the movies. I like them but don't love them -I'll decide whether to get them or not after December-. Naturally I also love the original trilogy.)
DaCuseFrog
 member, 52 posts
 SW Florida
Sat 11 May 2019
at 05:50
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
As a huge fan of all things Star Wars, I may be a little biased.  But I personally plan to own it, if for no other reason than it will complete my collection.  There are a few interesting twists in the movie, including one that resonates throughout the whole SW universe.  One thing I might suggest is, if you're on the fence about it, borrow it from the library.  That's how my family watches a lot of our movies.
evileeyore
 member, 183 posts
 GURPS GM and Player
Sat 11 May 2019
at 11:29
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
LunarKitty:
Speaking of. I've been thinking about getting Solo on Blu-Ray.

Solo isn't bad.  That said it wasn't great either.


It depends on what you want from the movie, if you want a good Han Solo movie, this ain't it (until literally the end).  If you want an adequate Star Wars movie, this'll do.

If you love Lando Calrissian, Danny Glover knocked it out of the park!  The actor who played Chewie did a great job too.  And Woody Harrelson was excellent.
praguepride
 member, 1390 posts
 "Hugs for the Hugs God!"
 - Warhammer Fluffy-K
Sat 11 May 2019
at 19:54
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
<warning, rant ahead>
Solo, while being a perfectly mediocre movie, has been the best Star Wars movie to come out in recent times.

Allow me to explain as I look at the movies as a whole, not on an individual basis. On an individual basis, Rogue One or Force Awakens were better movies in and of themselves but as part of the fabric of Star Wars as a setting Solo has been the only good movie to be added recently.

So let's start by talking about the prequels. The prequels are a mess. There are huge flaws in the directing, script, acting and editing. The final battle in Episode 1 is a thematic nonsense. Episode 2 is mostly just wasting everyone's time with a pointless attempt at a detective story that didn't matter and Episode 3 was clearly written with a bullet point of things that had to happen with no idea how to get from one to the next.

THAT BEING SAID all three of those movies expanded the lore and setting of Star Wars considerably. Episode 1 gave us such iconic ideas like Podracing and Darth Maul. Episode 2 gave us clones vs. droid warfare. Episode 3...actually didn't add that much, actually.

Now look at the new movies. Force Awakens adds nothing to the star wars universe. It actually just unwinds everything that was done before to give us Episode IV all over again. Episode V is terrible for not only not really adding anything to the Star Wars mythos but using hyperspace as a weapon recontextualizes the entire series. Rogue One is mostly fanservice in that it doesn't add anything new but again the end battle, while fun to watch, undermines the original trilogy.

UNDERMINING IS THE SIN
If it wasn't for the completely unnecessary cameo of Tantive IV in the final battle, Rogue One would have been decent for the fabric of Star Wars but because Tantive IV was at the epic Rebel vs. Empire battle, it recontextualizes the interaction between Leia and Vader in IV. As a reviewer put it, originally it put Leia as a strong-willed senator pushing back on a the fascist regime but now it's more like the drunk driver stumbling out of a car with a pile of beer cans saying "Naaaah man....I wasn't drinking...."

As for TLJ, using hyperspace as a weapon makes everything that came before it completely dumb. Why did the rebels do a trench run when they could have had a couple of un-manned X-Wings just rip through the Death Star at hyperspace. Why did anyone bother to fight anywhere when they could just have unmanned ships rip each other apart using hyperspeed. Heck even within the context of TLJ itself why did they bother with those bombers in the beginning? Just have one of the support ships ram the Dreadnaughts and fleet.

Solo at least actually expands the lore of Star Wars by adding criminal organizations and the Kessel black holes and precursor rebel organizations. It was not entirely reliant on just showing us Stormtroopers and Tie Fighters and lightsabers over and over again. It wasn't a great movie but it didn't have horrible flaws like TLJ or Ep3 nor did it undermine the entire Star Wars universe like TLJ or Rogue. Finally it was an "original" movie, at least for Star Wars unlike FA.


tl:dr: Solo was a decent movie that wasn't a copy of stuff already done before in Star Wars nor did it undermine or recontextualize the other movies in the Star Wars library. Every other new wave Star Wars  has either been a soft reboot (Force Awakens) or undermines the narrative of the original trilogy movies (Rogue One, The Last Jedi)

This message was last edited by the user at 19:57, Sat 11 May 2019.

Yaztromo
 supporter, 350 posts
Mon 4 May 2020
at 01:45
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
This celebration falls at really complicate times, this year...
DaCuseFrog
 member, 93 posts
 SW Florida
Mon 4 May 2020
at 04:50
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Yes, sadly it does.  My family usually looks forward to attending local events in costume, at restaurants and/or the library.  This year what I have to look forward to is the end of the Clone Wars and a chance to see if Rise of Skywalker disappoints me with the next viewing.
Heath
 member, 2936 posts
 If my opinion changes,
 The answer is still 42.
Mon 4 May 2020
at 05:12
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I remember as a 7 year old, my aunt said we were going to watch this new, very popular movie. The theater was packed and we couldn't find seats together, so I sat in the aisle while some people watched (standing room only) at the back of the theater. The movie was "Star Wars," and the way Lucas changed cinematics and the science fiction universe was lifechanging in some ways. It opened my eyes to science fiction and creativity, prepping me for 1st Edition AD&D and similar games--that we could visualize how it might be cinematically.

Those who grew up in the aftermath can't quite catch what a phenomenon it was, and how we waited with bated breath for "The Empire Strikes Back," and finally, despite its flaws, "Return of the Jedi." We were not judging the story or flaws as much back then; we were just absorbing its majesty. There was nothing like it.

So I wear my Star Wars T-shirt today with a great deal of nostalgia and gratitude.
phoenix9lives
 member, 998 posts
 GENE POLICE!  YOU!
 GET OUTTA THE POOL!
Mon 4 May 2020
at 06:21
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
And also with you.
Manywydhan
 member, 2 posts
Mon 4 May 2020
at 08:46
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Heath
quote:
Those who grew up in the aftermath can't quite catch what a phenomenon it was, and how we waited with bated breath for "The Empire Strikes Back," and finally, despite its flaws, "Return of the Jedi."


With you all the way.
evileeyore
 member, 317 posts
 GURPS GM and Player
Mon 4 May 2020
at 10:31
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Heath:
We were not judging the story or flaws as much back then; we were just absorbing its majesty. There was nothing like it.

Ah, some of us were.  However we judged the story worthy.  Note the many, many other movies that fell by the wayside where Star Wars (the original three) stood the test of time.
ShadoPrism
 member, 1309 posts
 OCGD-Obsessive-Compulsive
 Gamer-Disorder
Mon 4 May 2020
at 12:49
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I remember how many people got in to sort of a contest of how many times they got to see Star Wars after it came out in theaters. I had 7, and was at the bottom of my class in that area. Still I think that one movie was better than anything else in the franchise by far.
facemaker329
 member, 7200 posts
 Gaming for over 30
 years, and counting!
Mon 4 May 2020
at 13:55
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I started writing something to put in here...and about the time it got to be the length of a LONG blog post, I realized I should really get off my soap box, because that's not what this thread was about in the first place.  Considering that I have to be at work in two hours, and was only able to sleep for about two hours last night, in all likelihood I will celebrate Star Wars day by coming home from work, putting Star Wars in my dvd player, and promptly falling asleep before the droids get to Tatooine (and hope my bipolar neighbor doesn't ring my doorbell to share her latest rant about how she doesn't trust anyone else in the neighborhood).  In the event that doesn't happen, I'll do some work on my OG X-Wing pilot costume.
soulsight
 member, 304 posts
 Reality is 10% perception
 and 90% interpretation.
Tue 5 May 2020
at 02:05
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
One of my first actual dates (having just got my license) was taking a girl I was interested in to the movies. I drove to the theater, we waited in line for fifteen minutes.1
After the obligatory popcorn and soda (which costs less than the tickets), we sat down talking amicably. The movie began, and it was suddenly two hours later and we're walking to my car. "This was the worst date I've ever been on," she said. "You didn't pay any attention to me at all," she said. Actually, that may be paraphrased, I don't remember.
My response, however, I will never forget. "Didn't you SEE that?"
"Oh, yeah. I saw it on Wednesday. It's just a movie."
I literally (and I MEAN literally), have never said another word to this person.

1I grew up in that small, midwestern town John Cougar keeps singin about. The nearest movie theater was ten miles away.
DBCowboy
 member, 45 posts
 Played rpgs since about
 '81 (D&D Basic ed)
Tue 5 May 2020
at 02:17
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Never got to see the original Star Wars in theaters.  I was almost 7 and every time I tried to get my mom to take me to the little 1 screen theater in town something would happen.  Made it all the way out to the car once before my dad called her back into the house.  I can still remember my heart sinking as I realized it wasn't going to happen.  Finally got to see the remastered version in theaters years later.
Zag24
 supporter, 625 posts
Tue 5 May 2020
at 02:26
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I was in tenth grade when the original Star Wars was released in theaters.  (Yeah, I'm old.)

I had heard about it, but was only mildly interested when it came up in my English class.  My teacher, a wildly pompous idiot who felt that Shakespear and Byron were the only authors worth reading, told us that he had seen it and considered it the worst movie he had ever seen.  That was enough endorsement for me!  My friends and I went to see it the following Saturday and, of course, loved it.
facemaker329
 member, 7201 posts
 Gaming for over 30
 years, and counting!
Tue 5 May 2020
at 03:49
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
In reply to DBCowboy (msg # 22):

I almost didn't get to see it in theaters, for similar reasons.  My parents were concerned that it might be too violent (ironically, my dad had taken me to see Patton a couple of years earlier...and they had no problem with us sitting down as a family to watch Jaws a couple of years later.)

But one of the kids in my school class had a birthday party, and wanted a slumber party, and I got to go.  And, as part of the party festivities, we went and saw Star Wars...and I was hooked.  I had already been introduced to fantasy as a literary genre, in the form of a series of kids books featuring anthropomorphic animals with names like Paddy the Beaver, Billy Mink, etc...but this was consciousness-expanding for me.  Between seeing it in the theater, on video, a few times on TV, and reading the novelization, I had probably been through that story five hundred times by the time I was twenty, and I still default to it as my favorite movie, even though I've learned enough to recognize oh-so-many shortcomings in it.  I don't care...I acknowledge they're there, and I still love it.
Yaztromo
 supporter, 351 posts
Tue 5 May 2020
at 03:56
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
The problem is that you get so hooked to the strong emotions that the first and second movies (episodes IV and V) gave you, that everything else that follows feels mild (at best).
facemaker329
 member, 7203 posts
 Gaming for over 30
 years, and counting!
Tue 5 May 2020
at 04:24
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I don't think anyone who hasn't seen sci-fi movies from the pre-Star-Wars era can really truly appreciate the experience.  I mean, Star Wars redefined movie-making.  Visual effects were forever changed, sci-fi suddenly had an acceptable 'lived in' aesthetic, sci-fi directors stopped relying on cheesy-sounding synthesizers for their scores and got into full orchestral productions again.  The closest things I can think of to capturing that experience were Terminator 2 with the T-1000,  and The Matrix with the Bullet-Time camera trick...and those were just little slices of those movies.  Star Wars was one new horizon opened after another.

So, yeah...nothing has ever felt like that, since then...because nothing else has ever managed to completely alter the way I look at movies.  At the time, I didn't even realize how ground-breaking it was.  It wasn't until I got older and got some experience with older sci-fi cinema that I really grasped just how much Star Wars managed to say, "Yeah, fine, everyone does it that way...but that's basically the same way they've been doing it since the 1910s.   There MUST be a better way."  In terms of the story, Lucas really didn't come up with much of anything new...just repackaged some really familiar archetypes and sent them on a very typical journey for mythological heroes.

But he found a way to do it SO MUCH BETTER than anyone else that we're still commonly using variations on techniques and technologies that were created just for Star Wars.
evileeyore
 member, 319 posts
 GURPS GM and Player
Tue 5 May 2020
at 04:27
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
ShadoPrism:
I remember how many people got in to sort of a contest of how many times they got to see Star Wars after it came out in theaters.

I 'saw' Star Wars 16 times in the theatre... but I was 3 so I'm not sure how much that counts.  I've never seen it in the theatre since (granted).

I saw Empire Strikes Back like 7 or 8 times in the theatre, and Return of the Jedi 3 times.  Each Prequel movie twice.  Force Awakens and Last Jedi once.

I caught Rogue One twice and skipped Han Solo, though having seen it since I almost regret missing the spectacular of the big screen.

Outside of the theatres though?  I've watched the Original Trilogy more times than I can count, the prequels perhaps a dozen times, Rogue One and Solo 2 to 3 times each.  Force Awakens and Last Jedi 3-4 times (Last Jedi has actually grown on me in ways).

I've even watched the Christmas Special over a dozen times, it never gets any better.
Harley Quinn
 member, 17 posts
Sat 6 Jun 2020
at 03:36
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I grew up on the trilogy. I loved the trilogy. I like the prequelogy. I want to murder the sequelogy. Literally the only thing I liked about the sequelogy was Rey’s Lightsaber at the end of IX had the switch that spun instead of pressed.

I can forgive the sequelogy for existing because of The Clone Wars final season (not counting the horrible eps with those Jedi hating sisters), The Mandalorian, & Rebels.

This message was last edited by the user at 03:37, Sat 06 June.

praguepride
 member, 1620 posts
 "Hugs for the Hugs God!"
 - Warhammer Fluffy-K
Sat 6 Jun 2020
at 05:53
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Honestly of all the latest movies...sigh...Solo was the best.

Bear with me.

Rogue One is just fan service. The actual storyline is a mess, it doesn't really add anything to the story that we didn't already know and it actively undermines Episode IV by putting Leia  right in the middle of the big rebel fight and letting Darth Vader physically see her ship.

Force Awakens is decent but is almost a shot-for-shot remake of Episode IV. Ep IV was good and fun so Force Awakens is good and fun but it's not anything new.

Last Jedi would be an...okay stand alone film but its not It's supposed to be the 8th movie in a series and spends so much run time jerking the rug out from under the audience it does nothing to support the trilogy or the larger movie series. What is the point of Last Jedi in the grand sceme of Star Wars.

Rise of Skywalker or whatever is just a mess. They try to undo Last Jedi, redo film 8th and shoe horn in an old villain we've seen defeated twice before with magic powers never seen before because they have no room to build up a proper arc villain.

And again...what is the point of these movies in regards to the prequels or original trilogy? What did it add? What story did it advance.

Solo...with its many flaws...actually did some new things. It showed a character arc for Han Solo and laid in the experiences that later become the motivations for his character. You didn't really wonder why he was a rogue with a heart of gold before. Tough exterior but he came back to save Luke and sacrificed himself for Leia. Well now you know. Again, flawed in a lot of ways but it actually adds depth to Solo's character without stomping on any of the original movies.

Plus using Star Wars as a criminal heist film was nice. It showed Star Wars in a new light without being completely enslaved to references to the original movie. Even the Millenium Falcon had a bit of an arc which evolved it beyond just simple fan service.

As for the Clone Wars it was very inconsistent. There were some really amazingly good episodes but for every good one you had "Robot Squad" or "Planet of the Gods" which were bad ideas stretched out way, way too long.

Rebels has some glimpses of greatness but it is completely marred by whoever in charge being unwilling to put the characters in any sort of peril. Once again the Empire is completely undermined by being portrayed as incompetent baffoons. That's fine for a kids show but don't act like it's doing anything for the star wars universe. Plus...being able to fly by turning your light saber into a helicopter? Come on. Have some respect for your audience.

The Mandalorian...is great. No question about it. It explores new aspects of the star wars universe, treats the audience with respect and focuses on characters instead of spectacle. There are flaws, of course, but it would be a great tv show no matter the IP or setting. It's a real testament that you can lift the basic ideas of the show and put it in any setting and it would still shine. It doesn't need the Star Wars IP to be successful, unlike Rebels or Clone Wars or the sequelogy movies, but it is enhanced by it.
Skald
 moderator, 900 posts
 Whatever it is,
 I'm against it
Sat 6 Jun 2020
at 14:28
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
In my book ... Star Wars (Last Hope, Episode IV, the original) best by a country mile, followed by Rogue One, Solo, Empire, Return, Force Awakens, the other sequels and leaving the prequels languishing a long way back.

The original was a rollicking good tale, lots of action, and a self contained movie - could have easily stood on its own without anything following on after.  And having seen it when it first came out and before Lucas started messing with it, I know Han shot first and I don't care that Jabba went from man to alien by the next movie.  ;>

Rogue One started slowly, but I thought paid off big time by the end.  I don't share the view that it undermines Episode 4 - to my mind those Rebels right at the end of Rogue One managed to hold the Imperial forces off just long enough to get the plans onto Leia's ship, seconds ahead of the opening of Episode 4 with Vader in pursuit on the Imperial Star Destroyer, ultimately boarding and capturing Leia while R2 makes it off to Tatooine with the plans.  But it has admittedly been a while, so I may be confusing some/all of the details.  If so, I like my version better.  :P

Solo hangs together better as a movie than most of the rest, and I think it's better than it's given credit for.  Force Awakens had good effects, even if the Millenium Falcon is the star of the show.  Particularly because it is.  <grins>

After that ... h'mmm.  At least the latest ones had good CGI.

I'm not necessarily looking for a movie to advance the storyline for a fictional setting.  But I do want it to be entertaining in its own right and I certainly want to care about the characters on their journey.
evileeyore
 member, 339 posts
 GURPS GM and Player
Sat 6 Jun 2020
at 14:44
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
Skald:
I don't share the view that it undermines Episode 4 -

The "undermining" is only in Leia claiming to be on a diplomatic mission...  like, okay, sure.  It undermines her position.  But the brass balls to say that knowing that Vader knows that she knows that Vader knows she's lying?

CLANG!  Leia was always the bravest of the bunch, but those brass ones just got shinier.  And bigger.
phoenix9lives
 member, 1001 posts
 GENE POLICE!  YOU!
 GET OUTTA THE POOL!
Sat 6 Jun 2020
at 18:25
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
I have seen all the movies in the theater, some only once, most multiple times (especially with re-releases), and I have loved them.  Despite hokey dialogue, special effects issues (the originals), or things I thought could have been done differently.  It was not my story to tell, and I think Disney handled the transition well enough.  It is an epic tale, with a epic ending.  And I have enjoyed being along for the ride.
facemaker329
 member, 7208 posts
 Gaming for over 30
 years, and counting!
Sat 6 Jun 2020
at 19:23
Re: May the Fourth Be With You!
The only ones out of the series that I found disappointing were the prequels, and that was just because George Lucas got way too self-indulgent with the CGI effects and got sloppy with the storytelling.  The base story, itself, I liked...he just got lazy...like, rather than working the humor naturally into the story like he did with the banter in the original trilogy, he had scenes and moments that existed pretty much ONLY for comic relief, and as a result, made the associated characters weaker and less enjoyable than they could have been.

That set the precedent for similar scenes in the sequels, and I'm sure that, if the prequels hadn't done it, the sequels would have done it a lot less, if they did it at all.

In spite of that opinion, I don't think the prequels killed the series, or undermined it.  I have plenty of issues with the sequels, and even a few moments in the original trilogy make me shake my head...

But I love the series, overall, and I wouldn't get rid of any of them (although there are plenty of details I would re-write if given the chance.)  But I laugh a little any time I hear someone refer to any of them as 'fan service'... the very concept of a sequel is, in itself, fan service, so why should the sequel not deliver a little more?

This message was last edited by the user at 19:27, Sun 07 June.