In reply to Taras Vladimirovich Shevchenko (msg #33):

Belanger returned the look with a smile. "No, not all. Our priority is restoring communications for the city. So telecommunications is most important at the moment, and it's a big job. The radars and radios are higher up so they're not vulnerable."

"Taras, you mentioned something about having a plan for controlling or influencing the electromagnetic spectrum when it comes to the airport? Care to elaborate?

"Also, my friend wants to make contact tonight over the radio. We should be ready for that, too."

We have an Electronic Warfare capability that we must use to our advantage. We did that before and was a terrific force multiplier. Remember our little van.

The urban edifications in the downtown area gave us some trouble with proper triangulation and line of sight. For the airport it should be that difficult. The whole place is seating on a very flat island. It should not be difficult to listen to their frequencies since they use military equipment. I believe the prick/ series? In that matter we can reach your contact at the bridge.

Taras was losing faith about a full military operation to just recover communication equipment that could be there and in which shape or...not.

The contingency plan is sound but it involves a good deal of force and the ultimate goal is the entire control of the airport as an strategic asset and not only retrieving telephone stuff. In any case we can start setting up an ELINT station of that building under recce by the sniper team as early as tomorrow.

Taras turned to Kelsey. She was the real expert.

Kelsey. We need an inventory of the electronic equipment that we have available for the airport mission. I would like to have a briefing including capabilities, size and power requirements. With that information we can commit a technical and security element to man the station.

In reply to Taras Vladimirovich Shevchenko (msg #36):

"Aye, Taras. I'll do that right away. You'll know tonight. Anything else?"

Nah...That's just the first step. As usual, build up intel on the airport guys and be able to open a channel of communications with them if possible.

In reply to Taras Vladimirovich Shevchenko (msg #38):

"Fine, I'll get you that list. Plus, I'll be able to contact my friend tonight. Anything else you need?"

"Otherwise, briefing with you, me, Belanger and so on in a few hours.
This message was last edited by the GM at 07:35, Wed 10 Nov 2010.

Seth continued listening to the plans being outlined by Taras and developed in discussion with everyone.  He didn't have much to contribute - his only thought was that the plan sounded like it needed a significant number of troops and he wasn't really aware of how many troops they had available.  Not one to hold back he therefore decided to ask.

"Just so I know how many troops do we have available?  This op sounds like it's going to need quite a few."

Yes my friend, we are going to use a lot of troops. Look at the size of the objective. Not only that, is also defended so we need a good deal of mobility, firepower and also support to win this battle.

The Soviet Army doesn't have anything under a reinforced battalion for maneuver. Granted, there are Spetsnaz but they do not hold the ground. We will have to.

How many troops? Crew for the three armored vehicles around... Bulat provides a BMP with his men. Then there is the CF, ex US soldiers and RCMP to fill the ranks in the LAV and BTR and 2 technicals. The rest of RCMP and militia will provide the bulk of traffic regulators, follow-on troops and rear echelon. Capt. Bezhov and his men will be in charge of the artillery support.

A Command Post and Rear Area will be located in the Musqueam reservation. They will be asked to help with securing and helping with the site. The idea is to involve as much part of the local population to identify themselves with the current government and somehow take side with us. Is our limited numbers that need to rely on the citizens. Same as the partisans of the Great Patriotic War.

"Have we really got that many troops available?" replied Seth, his tone obviously surprised.  "Regardless it sounds like the operation you're proposing is going to involve a lot of casualties on both sides.  Your plan sounds good but could we be in danger of using a hammer to crack an egg?  Would we be better to send in a commando raid with the objective of killing or capturing the enemy leadership?  Cut off the head and then offer a diplomatic solution?  It's risky but you'd be putting maybe a dozen guys at risk rather than the much larger number the full plan involves.  My concern is that if the current plan gets screwed up that we'll take losses that we can't sustain and that the government's hold in Vancouver will be weakened.  Do you see my concern?"

I see that. And is a possibility. Will it work? Is a gamble. Moving in with a dozen people without support to a big airport and then hope for the best...That will really put in danger the position of the government.

On the other hand a demonstration of power will not only make the job easier and less likely to fail but also send a strong signal to the population. Including our enemies. In the end we will have to negotiate with everybody at some point. Is better to do that from a position of strength.

We already mobilized a lot of people while conducting the cordon and search operation after the Chinatown incident. But I agree, my plan is certainly too violent. We can try a demonstration of force and parade all our armor for them to see and wait for their response. We will always have the last word.

In reply to Taras Vladimirovich Shevchenko (msg #43):

It was now later on, and the various personnel were returned from their duties and free to discuss upcoming operations. Fox came by and joined in the discussion while Kelsey prepared her report. Rob and Andy were also back now and could join in if they desired, as could Keith.

In reply to Seth Joseph Delaney (msg #42):

"I think Seth's idea has merits. As a commando, I know special operations are not "magic" like most people think, and are best used in conjunction with some other overall effort. Eliminating the leadership to effect the surrender of the rest of the elements falls under that requirement, more-or-less."

It wasn't surprising that Fox was sympathetic towards a commando strike, that being his training and experience.

"I also believe that fundamentally, the two options are similar in that they use force to compel a favourable outcome, and rely on gathering information about the Trolls' top echelon (in particular: Basil Wright, their leader) through various means and rely on a lightning operation. The key to success in both operations is effective intelligence, surprise and interdiction of enemy communications and surveillance; if we assume these factors are in effect for one, they will be in effect for the other so they even out between those options, if you follow."

"The pros of a commando strike are it uses an economy of force and only risks (say) a dozen lives. A small team has a better chance of remaining undetected and has at least a fair chance of avoiding detection and escaping considering the current overgrown nature of the airport (1-2 years, with long grass and small trees growing in the open areas). Andy and I are commandos, while Seth is Light Infantry and Chris (Mac) is a Ranger, Rob is a Marine sniper and Keith is a Marine, too. So we have a good cadre to start with regards to skills and training.

"The cons are that a smaller team has less firepower at its disposal and thus a far less chance of fighting their way out if they are cornered. If casualties are taken, it's important to realise they will all be by definition key personnel on the DRI team here at UBC (URAEL) and consequently more valuable on an individual level to regional operations.

"I think people elsewhere in the city will be relatively impressed if we pull a commando strike off and like the park, it will show a measure of restraint. Overall, I give the chances as at least moderate and the risks low. If there is a failure, it will not be catastrophic."

Fox paused, thinking of Taras' plan of an amphibious strike. He seemed to like that idea as well.

"For pros, a larger force has more firepower at its disposal; if our intelligence (say) is off then we at least have a chance of winning a conventional engagement against the Trolls. What we give up in stealth we make up in shock. Regarding the pool of expertise, we have 2 US Marines, a Soviet, sorry, former Soviet assault engineer and both Andy and I have experience as commandos in maritime and littoral operations.

"For cons, it's possible that casualties could be very high if we are intercepted mid-crossing or ambushed at the river bank. If we get across, I don't think casualties will be more than a dozen unless things go really wrong, and again with a bigger force we have more options and more firepower. While we do have people experienced in amphibious operations, but our expertise is going to be spread thin among a lot of other people, plus special equipment to prepare, and not a lot of time to do it, a week at most. It's a tight schedule and difficult to maintain operational security.

"The results will be spectacular, if successful. I think our job here would become significantly easier. Worst case could be very bad indeed, if we take high casualties."

As an ex Officer of the Soviet Army like Senior Lt. Shevchenko did have the oportunity to learn from combat and now from working shoulder to shoulder the efficiency of NATO training and military doctrine accentuating personal skills and decentralization of decision making. Short of theSpetsnaz, the almighty Soviet miliatry machine didn't have anything close to the level of the USMC and Canadian infantry. The NCO corps was the missing link that kept the whole machine well greased. Under the Red Banner everything was different. Planning of the military operations was painstakingly elaborated and worked out by officers to the point where no much thinking room was left for subordinaters. Sergeants in ground forces were nineteen or twenty years old kids with six months of training and maybe a couple of years overall max of experience. That distinctive concept of doctrine seemed to be out of thought in their Western counterparts. Detailed combat orders and massive use of firepower was the counterbalance to this handicap.

With all due respect, Mr. Fox: I believe you are not very familiar with the planning of a water obstacle routine! Ambush? A river crossing is preceded by engineer reconnaissance of the river banks for enemy presence and also to secure the right conditions for troops and vehicles. We already have designated a landing site to be secured and it appeared to be a discreet beach. If casualties are to be avoided that's why I am suggesting to give the troops the protection of Infantry fighting vehicles and artillery support for the assault!

I do appreciate your good soldiering but who's going to set a rescue if our elite troops get stranded in the island? This reminds me of that american ship kidnapped in Cambodia at the end of the war in Vietnam.*

Completely convinced of his own thoughts he added:

The CIA Army didn't do too well without ground support in Cuba or Iran.



* Taras is making reference here at the Mayaguez incident, the Bay of Pigs episode and Operation "Eagle Claw" . Most likely a propagandistic oportunity to be exploited back in the days in the Soviet Union.

In reply to Taras Vladimirovich Shevchenko (msg #46):

Fox smiled, wincing at the mention of the Magauyez and Bay of Pigs.

"Ohhh, touche. Those operations were not properly planned, more spur-of-the-moment affairs. Regardless, I'm speaking hypothetically. It's unlikely that we will be ambushed while making a crossing if we take elementary precautions, but I'm not discounting the possibility for the purpose of discussion. Maybe that's another con for the amphibious operation: there will be more of a preparation phase that could be detected."

He paused for a second, thinking it through. "Although I guess that will be difficult with the control tower in flames. Still, can't be ruled out."

"But I do see your point about the commando strike; if a small team gets isolated and stranded on the island, escape-and-evasion will be difficult and annihilation or capture almost a certainty. If it all goes bad, where will they go? Swim the river? Perhaps we can pre-arrange different pickup points, as we do have several small fast boats and so on."
This message was last edited by the GM at 09:20, Sun 14 Nov 2010.

Taras understood that Fox was moving in circles. There was no after thought about a possible rescue operation for the raid and mounting it would be the equivalent of Taras mobilization plan.

Anyone else has an idea?Added in a nonchalant manner.

In reply to Taras Vladimirovich Shevchenko (msg #48):

Fox laughed in amusement. "Just a damn second, Taras! What kind of casualties would we be looking at for an operation this size? Do you know?"

"If it is acceptable to our leadership," Seth interjected rather formally, "would it be ok for several of us to put together a plan for a commando style raid with the objective of taking out the enemy leadership at the airport?"

In reply to Seth Joseph Delaney (msg #50):

Belanger sipped his tea.

"Certainly, you can draw up plans and I encourage you to do so. In fact, all we have decided at the moment is diplomacy alone may not solve this impasse in a timely manner. If you can present alternatives then that would be appreciated, Angela and I will go over them tonight or as soon as possible."

He poured himself another cup, and offered the pot around.

"Also, the adoption of any plan shouldn't be seen as a rejection. I hope that whichever way we choose, you all will still continue to contribute as the plan evolves. For example, if we choose a commando operation, then Taras' expertise will still be required in effecting a crossing and possible demolitions of objectives. If we are to attempt a riverine crossing, then it's likely some kind of special operations should be planned in conjunction to disrupt land-line communications and leadership."

"If it's all right with you, I would think that the commando raid might be a little bit more practical.  As much as I've been trained in amphibious assaults, if we get caught out there, we stand to not only lose personnel but also the vehicles transporting those troops.  I'm just saying," Keith says when the floor opens up for suggestions.

In reply to Keith Michael Tremblay (msg #52):

"It'a good point about an ambush, and it has already been brought up.

"The key to avoiding any ambush is reconnaissance. It's also the first thing you do in any amphibious operation, which you are no doubt aware as a Marine! I think there are even special Marine units for this."

"We currently have the landing sites under direct observation (from the top of the Airport Square) and we don't believe there's anyone there now. We can land a team (any volunteers?) to perform a recce (recon) of the area beforehand."

"Still, as a former commando myself, I can't say I wouldn't like to see some kind of special operation. But what happens if this team gets into trouble? You'll be isolated on an island, fighting at maybe 8-1 odds. If rescue is needed, we might well still have to rely on, well... an amphibious operation. Or force the bridges."
This message was last edited by the player at 23:01, Mon 15 Nov 2010.

"I'd be up for a recce," volunteered Seth simply.

I'd love to have some tea Mr. Belanger. Will you pass the pot s'il vous plait?

Taras helped himself to a hot stream of fragant, freshly brewed tea.

For those defending the idea of a raid I'd suggest to take a look at the map. The terminal is a big place, actually there are three of them*. Never been there myself, of course, but you can imagine its size. Not only that, the terminal is located in the middle of the island and any approach from the shore will take at least a couple kilometers of very flat land with little room for cover. But I would like to hear details about that raid.



Domestic, International and the original South terminal that still in use.

"Count me in," Keith says to everyone present.

The ukrainian took a folder out of his leather satchel and produced a sheet of paper. It seems that it was an aerial picture of the Airport. It had some marker and notes written over. It was crude but somehow effective.

I cut out this picture from one old magazine in the library. The lines indicate the march approach for my plan. The main target is the control tower at the heart of the international terminal. Take a look!

Taras put the picture on the table, He was more keen to show the size of the objective rather than going into detail but that was the only good picture that he could find and already had worked upon.

img src=http://img703.imageshack.us/i/yvrw.jpg
This message was last edited by the player at 06:31, Wed 17 Nov 2010.

As they talked, Kelsey came back in.

"We have a fair amount of equipment available, most of which we brought with us. The University has radios for communications but they are tied up and won't be allocated for our use."

She put up the list she'd made:

---

Audio Recorder, Advanced	                 x1	
Audio Recording Cartridge	                 x50(Unlimited)
Broadcast Monitoring Equipment	                 x1	
Bugs, stage II, VOX	                         x3
Bug Detector Kit	                         x1	
Bug Monitor	                                 x1
Hidden Microphone	                         x3
Laser Microphone	                         x1
Motion Detector	                                 x2	
Parabolic Booster	                         x3	Kelsey
PRD-303/SV Surveillance System (sensor)	         x2	
PRD-303/SV Surveillance System (receiver)	 x2	
Radio Direction Finder	                         x1	Kelsey
Sound Amplifier	                                 x2	
Special Vision Adapter	                         x10	
VHS Video Cameras (small)                        x2	
VHS Cassettes             	                 x10	(Unlimited)
VHS VCR                                          x1
Wire-Tapping Tools (phones, static comm-lines)   x2
Electronics Repair Kit                         	 x1

---

"Does that help the situation? We have enough to keep track of the Trolls, even tape them. If we can get onto the island, we can wire tap their phone lines."