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Savaged Goin'

Posted by Judge MessalenFor group 0
Judge Messalen
GM, 4805 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Wed 21 Mar 2018
at 04:53
  • msg #1

Savaged Goin'

This forum is a sticky for Judge information about a Savage Worlds chapter (alternate reality).
This message was last edited by the GM at 05:09, Wed 21 Mar 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4806 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Wed 21 Mar 2018
at 04:56
  • msg #2

Savaged Goin'

In reply to Judge Messalen (msg # 1):

Setting rule:
GUTS remains a skill for which skill points are required. It is highly recommended for heroes to take -- at minimum -- d4 in Guts, unless the player has a specific desire to play the character that always runs and hides.

4/20/18 EDIT: the Judge fixed a mistake in this item. Apologies for any confusion. Highlighted.

The Guts skill represents a character's bravery under adverse conditions. In Savaged Goin', an example might be: the PCs are defending a small town from outlaws -- at the start of the battle, the scofflaws pull a tarp from a charrette, unveiling a Gatling Gun. Make a Guts test.

The following are a few actual encounters we have played in this game, wherein the Judge might have required a Spirit or Guts test: the charge of the Comanche lance riders; the attack of the boo how doy in Chinatown; the attack of the Cheyenne at the Red River.

9/29/18 EDIT: the Judge added a paraphrased rule for Guts and the situational examples; however, the Judge is considering NOT using Guts, and thereby using the SWD rules for using Spirit for fear tests. In the scenario above, the last sentence would have been "Make a Spirit test." IF the Judge decides to do this, it would mean players who have submitted designs would get to re-purpose those skill points (or advances). Visit the OOC for discussion.

10/1/18 EDIT: The Judge modified this. We are no longer using Guts skill as a setting rule.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:47, Mon 01 Oct 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4807 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Wed 21 Mar 2018
at 05:01
  • msg #3

Savaged Goin'

In reply to Judge Messalen (msg # 2):

Setting rule:
The supernatural (arcane) may be employed by any hero in character design/advancement, but it shall be of the nature that is typically concealed from the populace. Below the surface; on the fringe; insert your favorite metaphor here to indicate some form of subtlety or subtext.

Setting rule:
In general, the world is mundane. The supernatural is known only to a select few. For every Mr. Glass, there is Unbreakable, but they are on the extremes.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:16, Fri 20 Apr 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4808 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Wed 21 Mar 2018
at 05:08
  • msg #4

Savaged Goin'

Advancement rule:
All heroes are Veterans, with 10 advances. You have the advantage of designing 10 advances in a row, to craft a potent character. The hero should have some common traits with the heroes from the alternate slice of the multi-verse that we have been playing (e.g., Richardson is still a rifleman and Carson still a survivalist and . . . you get the idea). But tangents may be taken by the player, and are encouraged by the Judge.

Any legal advance (hindrance, edge, skill) is fair game here, except as it might relate to technology beyond, say, what existed in 1894 by our slice of the multi-verse standards.

Anything questionable can be negotiated between player and Judge.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:17, Fri 20 Apr 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4826 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Fri 13 Apr 2018
at 17:44
  • msg #5

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule:
All heroes are Humans. That means all heroes get one free Edge in character creation.

Setting Rule:
Common Knowledge vs. Specific Knowledge skills . . . in general, the Judge will apply the rules in SWD as per p23 and p25. Common Knowledge will be used for many mundane cases, without the need for a die roll. When a die roll (Smarts) is required by the Judge in order for the PC to draw on common knowledge, modifiers based on the character's background may apply. Specific Knowledge skills should be acquired for anything for which the character wants a definitive degree of expertise -- these will give a +2 bonus whenever a character tries to draw on that specific knowledge.

Here's an example that could well apply in our game:
  • Common Knowledge (Navigation): No die roll needed to find one's way around a town, or to determine north in the wilderness.
  • Common Knowledge (Navigation): Smarts die roll needed to navigate from point A to point B in the wilderness (or a big city, or a maze). Depending on circumstances, a man with a background as a scout in the army might get +2. A Woodsman (edge) might get +2 while in the woods. A man with a map (or other reasonable aid) would probably get a +2.
  • Knowledge (Navigation): Expertise in the subject of navigation, which provides a further bonus for required Smarts die rolls, such as: identifying the fastest route from A to B, identifying possible obstacles based on terrain; estimating time and distance, etc.

Setting Rule / Advancement Rule:
Knowledge (Languages) . . . the rules on page 25 will apply, with clarification. A character who knows more than one language must spend at least one skill die (d4) for that specific language. Characters may apply multiple skill dice to a single language for improved level of expertise. E.g., a character that speaks Spanish fluently, and comprehends Mandarin competently (in addition to native English) would have to spend a total of five skill points -- 3 skill points for the Knowledge (Spanish Language) d8 and 2 points for the Knowledge (Mandarin Language) d6. Note there will be a difference between learning a specific language and being a Linguist (with its associated language benefits). The Judge is NOT using the alternative setting rule "Multiple Languages" as described on p94.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:19, Fri 20 Apr 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4829 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Fri 20 Apr 2018
at 12:20
  • msg #6

Savaged Goin'

The Judge updated formatting in the above posts -- no content changed this morning, but bumped them all to new for emphasis.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4859 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Sat 26 May 2018
at 13:05
  • msg #7

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule:
Blood & Guts - as per SWD, p94, heroes can spend Bennies on damage rolls.

Setting Rule:
Gritty Damage - as per SWD, p94, heroes taking wounds also suffer temporary (vs. permanent) results from the Injury Table.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4867 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Mon 4 Jun 2018
at 17:30
  • msg #8

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule:
Weapon Fluff and Crunch:
Players may choose weapons not listed as official SW gear, as long as the stats from existing, similar weapons are used. This rule is intended to add spice to game, without affecting statistical game-play.

For example, all western era revolvers have 2d6+1 damage, 12/24/48 range and ROF 1. If Trampus Monday wants to keep his signature Starr Revolvers instead of switching to a Colt or S&W, he can do that -- it will have the same combat stats as the most similar weapon on the SWD Gear list.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4871 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Tue 5 Jun 2018
at 13:58
  • msg #9

Savaged Goin'

In reply to Judge Messalen (msg # 4):

Advancement Rule clarification:
This is clarification to msg #4. While players have 10 advances to apply, becoming Veteran rank, the character build must adhere to the SW Advancement protocols ... in other words, the build must be done with Character Creation first, and then applying one advance at a time, with any requirements met for each advance at the time of that advance.

For example, my hero is Novice rank after creation. I would want to take the Marksman edge, but I will have to wait until achieving Seasoned rank to take that edge, because it requires "Seasoned" rank. So Ithe earliest I could take that edge would be my fourth advance, because:

Stage = Rank, Experience Points
Creation = Novice, 0 ep
Advance 1 = Novice, 5 ep
Advance 2 = Novice, 10 ep
Advance 3 = Novice, 15 ep
Advance 4 = Seasoned, 20 ep
Advance 5 = Seasoned, 25 ep
Advance 6 = Seasoned, 30 ep
Advance 7 = Seasoned, 35 ep
Advance 8 = Veteran, 40 ep
Advance 9 = Veteran, 45 ep
Advance 10 = Veteran, 50 ep

Additionally, please note the Rank Table bullets, especially the * for increasing attribute die type. With our 10 advancement rule, a total of 3 attribute die type increases can be done (one while Novice, one while Seasoned, one while Veteran).

The Judge suggests that each player document each phase of Advancement. Create the character and save the stats at time of creation. Then apply each advance, noting what stats were updated for each advance. This will help the player to manage the build and adhere to requirements, changing things along the way without having to start over. It will also help the Judge to validate the build.
This message was last edited by the GM at 14:02, Tue 05 June 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4890 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Tue 19 Jun 2018
at 20:59
  • msg #10

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule Clarifications for Savaged Newbs (General):
The core concepts for most dice rolls in Savage Worlds are well-organized and logical. Memorize (okay, pay special attention to) 'Trait Tests' and its sub-sections on pages 62 and 63 of SWD. Also important: Bennies.

However, some of the combat rules lack clarity. They have evolved over time in SW rule books. At present, some are still not fully explained (or open interpretation for various edge cases), at least not in the core rule book. The Judge will use the header in this message for clarifying comments about how we will handle specific elements of combat, with the specific topic in the parens.
This message was last edited by the GM at 21:12, Tue 19 June 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4893 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Wed 20 Jun 2018
at 13:07
  • msg #11

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule Clarifications for Savaged Newbs (Initiative):
Initiative in SW is governed by a deck of standard playing cards. Characters act in order on high card. There are Edges to help with getting a better card, and Jokers are used to add a random element — Joker may act at any time desired during the round.

Point of Clarification: A new draw is done from the deck each combat round. The deck is reshuffled after any round when a Joker is dealt. Until a Joker is dealt, the same deck, with cards drawn in previous round discarded, continues to be used.

Setting Rule: Initiative
The Judge is considering how to handle this in an RPoL game. The Judge had adapted the d20 Initiative process to work better in this forum — at least, I thought my process worked sufficiently here. Not sure whether it can work for a Savaged West game.

The Initiative deck design has proponents and opponents, although the regular SW players that the Judge knows have embraced the initiative deck. It would seem to work well at the gaming table. Not sure how it would work in RPoL — especially if PCs don’t log in regularly. If it becomes your turn in the order and you don’t log in for 3 days, you just made the combat take 3 RL days longer. The nature of play-by-post is likely to affect the SW “fast and furious” concept, inherently, which is why the Judge adapted to the “everyone post what they are doing and the Judge will sort out the order and adjudicate results.” Some thought and testing is needed to find a good balance.

More on this later — this post will be updated at some time. If anyone has thoughts, please feel free to share.

EDITS:
Another thought is that the Joker would be further unpredictable if used by the book. Continuing the example above, a player character could draw the Joker but the player fails to log in for 3 days (perhaps not even knowing the Joker was selected). By the fourth day, it's possible that everyone else has acted and the Joker ends up going last.

The SW rules suggest the possibility of doing initiative in groups for time-sensitive game. That could work here, similar to the way that the Judge has adapted the Recoiled rules for doing initiative in RPoL. If we ended waiting for players in the group to post their actions, that would be the same as it is now -- with some sort of agreement to act by proxy after an agreed-upon amount of time. Current thinking is that this would involve the same random initiative every round, with actions performed by each group before the next group goes. The PCs would be one group (including Extras). The Judge may have more than one NPC group. It seems like a viable option, although it will definitely lose some of the furious feel . . . such as a scenario when a hero finds himself Shaken at the end of a round, almost out of bennies and not sure when he will get to act again.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:06, Thu 05 July 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 4915 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Thu 5 Jul 2018
at 12:23
  • msg #12

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule Clarifications for Savaged Newbs (Combat Sequence Summary):
Here is a summary of the combat sequence as the Judge would play it at the tabletop (with the “group” option in mind as an RPoL alternative). As noted in msg # 11, the Judge wants to test this for use in RPoL before deciding what to use if we move forward with an SW game.
  1. Initiative is dealt.
  2. Each character (group) performs actions as desired, in order, from Ace to Deuce (ties resolved according to rule).
  3. At the beginning of each character’s action (all characters in a group), assess the current status: Shaken, Not Shaken, Wounded. Status affects the hero’s ability to act. A Spirit roll is required if the character is Shaken.
  4. Character states actions. Results of those actions are adjudicated, including damage effects and such, before the next character’s action (or next group’s actions; also characters within a group would act together, but their actions could occur in a particular order within the group). Actions, free or not free, may include:
    • Trait test(s) (skills, attacks, tricks, disarms, full defense, etc.)
    • Spending bennies to re-roll Trait tests
    • Speech
    • Movement
    • Damage from any attacks
    • Soak Roll(s) (by opponents taking damage)

  5. Next character’s status assessment, actions, resolution.

More on this later — this post, and others about Initiative and combat process, will be updated at some time.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5020 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Sat 6 Oct 2018
at 14:03
  • msg #13

Savaged Goin'

In reply to Judge Messalen (msg # 11):

Setting Rule: Initiative
Regarding Initiative . . . to start, we will use the regular rulebook process, each player getting an Initiative draw. We'll see how it goes and adapt as necessary.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5021 posts
The Hangin' Judge
D:20 G:100 MDT:18 A:0
Sat 6 Oct 2018
at 14:09
  • msg #14

Savaged Goin'

Game Rule: Character Names
Returning players designing a Savaged version of their previous character will get a new character name for the game. The name must be at least one character different than the current.

For examples, see:
Jacob Richardsen (aka Jake Richardson)
Earnest Nicholas Samuel Ringgenberg (aka E.N.S. Ringgenberg)
Judge Messalen
GM, 5038 posts
The Hangin' Judge
P:6 T:10 W:0 F:0 B:2
Tue 16 Oct 2018
at 20:16
  • msg #15

Savaged Goin'

In reply to Judge Messalen (msg # 14):

Additional:
For the new Savaged characters (returning players with new Cast member character name or new players with new Cast member), please choose a portrait and create a written description so other players can see these in The Cast. The description can be as long or short as desired, but it is required in order for The Cast links to be activated.

As always, use the Bio #1 for a short character tag (optional).

Use Bio #2 for Savage Worlds stats (not mandatory, but requested by the Judge), including:
P:x T:y W:z F:a B:b

where
  • 'P:' = Parry and 'x' = derived stat value
  • 'T:' = Toughness and 'y' = derived stat value
  • 'W:' = Current woulds and 'z' = the number of wounds currently taken (default is '0' but continuing characters may have a wound from SF adventure to start)
  • 'F:' = Fatigue and 'a' = the number of current fatigue levels take (default is '0' but continuing characters will have '1' level of fatigue from SF adventure to start)
  • 'B:' = current bennies and 'b' = the number of bennies currently available (which should be updated during game play as Bennies are either used or awarded during game-play by the Judge -- start with your normal Bennies count for your character).

See Judge Messalen's bio #2 for example.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5139 posts
The Hangin' Judge
P:6 T:10 W:0 F:0 B:2
Fri 7 Dec 2018
at 14:02
  • msg #16

Savaged Goin'

Setting Rule: Initiative Benny
A character may spend a benny to draw a new initiative card during combat.
This message was last edited by the GM at 14:02, Fri 07 Dec 2018.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5685 posts
The Hangin' Judge
P:6 T:10 W:0 F:0 B:0+WC
Thu 12 Dec 2019
at 13:42
  • msg #17

Savaged Goin'

Update in preparation for Adventure Edition:
It has been interesting applying the action card draw for initiative in SW to this game. I thought it ended up working out fairly well -- things like the Joker were still fun and interesting elements, although some aspects such as #msg 16 didn't really come into play. Unlike sitting around the table where that happens in real-time, spending a benny to change initiative cards in this RPOL environment didn't seem viable during our various combats. The Judge isn't sure if the PCs forgot this was allowed, or if, like the Judge, this just didn't seem applicable in way we adapted the SW action card draw to RPOL.

The Judge will update this thread over the coming fortnight for our transition to the new ruleset.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5698 posts
The Hangin' Judge
P:6 T:10 W:0 F:0 B:0+WC
Fri 27 Dec 2019
at 21:11
  • msg #18

Savaged Goin'

Adventure Edition Setting Rules:
In this edition of the ruleset, some optional setting rules are now standard. This post summarizes what we will use or not use as we transition to the new ruleset.

All Heroes are Humans
That means all heroes get one free Edge in character creation.

Anything Arcane is a Secret
The supernatural (arcane) may be employed by any hero in character design/advancement, but it shall be of the nature that is typically concealed from the populace. Below the surface; on the fringe; insert your favorite metaphor here to indicate some form of subtlety or subtext. Since the setting is mundane, and the supernatural is known only to a select few, any hero that dabbles in the Arcane (taking Arcane Background Edge) must take the Secret Hindrance (with Major or Minor by agreement between the player and the Judge).

Critical Failures
Critical Failures is now a standard rule, clarified. A Critical Failure will occur when a Wild Card rolls a 1 on both the skill die and Wild Die of a Trait roll. A Critical Failure, whether occurring on an original trait roll or a benny re-roll, ends the attempt and must be accepted.

Blood & Guts
This setting rule, used previously in this game, is now standard. Heroes can spend Bennies on damage rolls.

Gritty Damage
Taking wounds is no laughing matter. Heroes that suffer a wound will also suffer a temporary (vs. permanent) injury, as rolled on the Injury table. (FYI, this is still an optional setting rule and we are still using in this game.)

Joker's Wild
This previously optional setting rule is now standard and clarified. If a PC draws a Joker, all PCs get a benny (this includes hero party NPCs that are Wild Cards, e.g. Red Shirt).  If the enemies draw a Joker, the Judge adds one benny to the Judge's general benny pool, and gives one benny to each enemy Wild Card.

Languages
The standard language rules are exactly the same as our previous setting rule. Language is a specific skill (Smarts) and characters must spend skill points to acquire any additional language beyond their native tongue, with the number of skill points spent per language indicating the die type of proficiency in that language. The Linguist Edge functions by the book.

Weapon Fluff and Crunch
Players may choose weapons not listed as official SW gear, as long as the stats from existing, similar weapons are used. This rule is intended to add spice to game, without necessarily affecting statistical game-play. For example, all western era revolvers would have 2d6+1 damage, 12/24/48 range and ROF 1. (FYI, the Judge is considering using the Adventure Edition "Comprehensive Modifiers" concept to allow modifications for specific weapons; players should feel free to make suggestions in this regard; we can discuss and test as desired. This rule note will be updated as appropriate).

Initiative Is What It Is
Although the new ruleset allows bennies to be spent to draw a new Action Card, that usage will not be allowed in this game, because of the nature of our experience with RPOL game flow. Otherwise, Initiative will function per the ruleset.
This message was last edited by the GM at 21:17, Fri 27 Dec 2019.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5714 posts
The Hangin' Judge
P:6 T:10 W:0 F:0 B:0+WC
Tue 28 Jan 2020
at 14:33
  • msg #19

Savaged Goin'

Adventure Edition Changes:

Readying Weapons
Instead of requiring an action to ready a weapon, characters can now "ready" two per turn, using a free action. Technically, it's two items per turn (e.g., field glasses and longarm). As a result, the Quick Draw Edge no longer exists. None of the existing players had taken quick draw, so no issues there, but since readying weapons has come up a few times in our SWD adventure, it seemed worth pointing this out.

The Judge may update this message with additional noteworthy changes as we go.
Judge Messalen
GM, 5778 posts
The Hangin' Judge
P:6 T:10 W:0 F:0 B:4+WC
Fri 28 Feb 2020
at 14:34
  • msg #20

Savaged Goin'

Hold action (round to round)
In a combat situation, if a PC is on Hold when a new round begins, the character won't be dealt any Action Card(s). Instead, that character begins the round on Hold and can act at any time in the new round.
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