Here we go

I'll admit, pacing has been my only complaint over the nearly three years I've been playing, but I don't see a way to make play-by-post significantly faster.  There are days I only manage to post once, and the same for other players, and I'm flat-out amazed by what you manage as GM -- yet three years of player time has been a month or so of character time for Ardenas.

On the other hand, I searched for years trying to find a local gaming group, and now I'm in two -- and trying to decide if I'll have to quit one because it's eating too much of what used to be my little bit of spare time.  This game, at least, I can manage in 10-30 minutes once or twice a day, to read and post.  And I do get plenty of opportunity for RP, which I like, yet I get to play some combat from time to time, which I also like.

I think the underlying problem is that people coming in don't really understand how PbP games run.  I was pretty sure it would be slow, so I wasn't disappointed when it was, but if I'd been expecting (or able) to post half a dozen moves a day, I might have been disappointed.

yeah, i ain't goin' no place. koolaid man is here to stay. OH YEAH!!

Agreed, lol. U guys r stuck with me, Sederic and aegis, lol. I love the setting and the gm is amazing. I understand he's got a shit ton on his plate between real life and managing 30+ PC's. I applaud u, good sir, and keep up the great work

It isn't the frequency of the posts, it is the content of the posts. Posting a sentence or two in response does not give us a lot to work with. With almost every post we have had to form a Facebook message trying to decipher what we are supposed to do next, or who even has a skill that might somehow be relevant. We followed your one prompt to try Carousing, Streetwise, or Research. Were we supposed to roll it each turn to try and get more clues?

It is hard to get into a story when you can only read a sentence every few days. I understand that it takes time to develop the story, but honestly it would be better to have even fewer posts if they were paragraphs in length. One liners are funny, but in PbP they do nothing but delay the progression of the whole story. All 5 of us have played multiple PbP games before in multiple genres on RPOL and other websites. Even when we had a mystery to solve, we at least had some prompting of what options we could take or how to make some progress to solve the mystery. It wasn't always a blatant OOC direction to make some roll, but the description was detailed enough that we could at least come up with an idea.

A large part of the problem is that we are using DF templates. They are not built for investigations. That isn't really the point of DF. If you compare the percentage of points spent on social investigation skills in DF to other GURPS series like Monster Hunters it is really obvious that DF is a hack-and-slash. Had we been informed going in that this was more Urban Investigation in a Fantasy setting, we would have built our characters in completely different ways. My character has a measly 2 points in Streetwise bringing him to skill 10, and just 1 point in Carousing for skill 13. That is not nearly enough to be proficient or helpful in any investigation. Almost all of his other skills would only be useful in a dungeon.

In reply to Espiri Skyblessed (msg # 5):

Yeah, I hear what you are saying, I think. There has been in many games a kind of tendency for combat orientated characters, and though GURPs is very good at building intrigue type campaigns, it is actually much harder to combine the two very different styles.

Combat focused games tend to have shorter more frequent posts that state only what you need to know to take the next swing, if that. Intrigue focused games tend to have entire paragraphs of information, more than the player need, though a lot of it is deliberately superfluous, forcing players to sift through the useless information for the vital clues. This seems to be the style you are used to.

But GURPs has another option...whereby players can pick a social skill and roll for gathering the information. Unlike many systems, there are actually a lot of social skills, and often several of them can be used to obtain what you want, depending on your strengths. This method requires more knowledge of the system by the players, and can take some getting used to, but can also work quite well.

The style used depends on the GM, but the Narrator, with about 9 or 10 active threads, would not be able to use the first verbose method for many threads, as it would be too time consuming for him. Hence he tends to the second variant.

Having said that, I bet Espiri could adopt a number of air spells to use in investigations. Such as Body of Air to slip in somewhere to eavesdrop, or stench to assist in intimidation. With more information into his spells, I bet I could come up with half a dozen other options, but they require using spells in unorthodox ways. Mages can be especially adaptable.

The issue is expectation. When you say DF, we expect DF. When you say Urban DF, we expect DF in an urban setting. According to DF, “investigation” is nothing more than (1) finding a quest and (2) getting useful info about the bad guys. There is nothing in DF describing a detailed investigation. We are not cops; we are adventurers.

Now, if you had told us up front that this was a Fantasy game using DF templates as a starting point, and that there would be a lot of urban investigation, our characters would look different, and we would be prepared for it. Less to complain about at that point.

And concerning story, trust me when I say I would forgo entire combats for the sake of a good story. I’ve done it several times. Giving a series of clues that lead to a perp is not what I would call “story.” There’s nothing about any of our characters that is personally invested in this quest. In fact, we had half a mind to find the perp and help him setup his contra-mate guild operation more effectively. Why would we care if someone wants to undercut the Mage Guild’s racketeering to drive up the price of Paut? Why not let free market reign?

So to say you’re trying to get us there with some story.... I’m gonna be honest and say it feels a lot more like meaningless filler.

Finally, when I had a concern, I came to you in PM, but you felt the need to rant about us to all your other players. Doesn’t really make any of us want to keep trying when you behave like that. You could have PMed our whole party, but instead you decide to throw us all under the bus. Not the best way to handle the situation.

In reply to Theadric Greenbottle (msg # 7):

It has been a while since I did the RTJ, but doesn't it state that it uses DF as the basis of the game? I don't know the details of your situation, and I am neither the GM nor about to drive a proverbial bus over you, but I was trying to point out the style the GM generally uses and why. With 9-10 threads, extended narratives such as I described above for each thread would be a lot to expect, yes?

I get the impression that you expected a much more narrative thread, whilst the Narrator posts more direct shorter posts. Did you guys read any of the existing threads before joining, that might have indicated his style?

I didn’t expect a more narrative thread. I expected Dungeon Fantasy. Short, snippy posts are fine if we are actually going on dungeon adventures. It was the GM who said he was trying to “get us there” via story. I was just pointing out that that is not what it looks like to any of us. If there had been an intriguing, engaging story handed to us, we would not mind at all being tossed into a more investigation-focused quest. We put together a joint backstory so the GM had some material to work with right, as far as pulling us all into the story right away, so we left that option open.

The fact that DF is stated as the basis for the game is the reason we expected a DF game. DF is in the name. DF is the basis. Yet this is really an urban fantasy game that happens to use DF templates, and basically little else. So I wouldn’t say DF-based. I’d say urban fantasy, with a lot of Actionesque investigation, and using DF-templates as a starting point.

I’m sure this game could be fun for people who know what to expect. But calling it DF is really confusing, and ultimately leads to failed expectations. If we had known this was not actual DF, we would have designed completely different characters, something actually useful for the setting. We are designed for dungeon delving, because that’s what following DF templates gets you, which has made us all feel useless and poorly built for the quest that got handed to us.

I understand how the social skills work, thank you. What I don't understand is using the default DF templates to make characters if there is a heavy emphasis on having to use social skills. As I said, my character has a total of 3 points in social skills. He is going to be useless in basically any social setting, and had I known that up front it would have been a much different build that largely ignores the template in terms of skill choices.

The second variant only works when the GM actually provides some type of idea as to which social skill would actually be useful to roll against.

I think you assumed my character is a Wizard. He isn't. He is a Swashbuckler built to the template in DF 1. Now he does have Magery 0 as a consequence of his racial template, but actually trying to learn and use spells would be a waste of time.

all my players are well rounded, with a good mix of social, investigative, & combat skills. but, i had to take a firm stance against templates, in order to achieve this, or my characters would suck, and i'd be ineffective, and unhappy like you sound.
This message was last edited by the player at 14:41, Wed 04 Apr 2018.

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 11):

That's nice but it's a waste of points in a game that is supposed to be primarily hack and slash, loot, upgrade, and repeat.

You're missing the point though. We're not opposed to well rounded characters it to stories that are light on combat and heavy on other elements like investigation. The game says DF so we optimized our characters and our backstory for a simple hack and slash. It's frustrating to have your expectations subverted like that; if we'd known we could've built things a lot different, a few of us probably would've played totally different characters to better fit the setting and play effectively.

There are two problems we have. The primary problem is expectation vs. reality. Because the game was described as an urban DF game we expected hack and slash without any 40 day journeys to the dungeon. Whether that means we use a dungeon directly under the city, or what isn't really relevant DF = hack n slash so we didn't put any or hardly any points in social skills as that is how DF templates are built. My character has 1 point in research and 0 in social skills.

The second problem we are running into is that we have 3 different people doing different things and we get back a 1 sentence response for one of those things. We don't expect a bunch of superfluous text and description, but enough in the text to know what our next step is and direction to go or skills to try. we are left scratching our heads after almost every post as we have no direction as to what we are supposed to do next with out hack n slash characters who are somehow now supposed to be ace investigators.

your guy's story about the paut isn't meaningless filler, though. the threads intertwine, and the outcomes of some, effect others. it takes some reading, but that's part of why i enjoy the  setting, too.

where's that haversack stromboli, fellow?
haven't seen him post in a month, it'll be tomorrow. probably lost him too.

Our complaints are less about whether there is actual story and more about how it comes across when we are set to expect DF because that is how the game is described but instead get urban fantasy investigation. I believe across 5 characters with 1250 points total we have less than 1% of our points in investigation skills. It is about expectation vs reality.

The complaint about story is that 1 sentence responses to multiple investigative skills does not feel like a story. Its like trying to have a conversation 1 sentence at a time but with days in between each sentence, the conversation goes no where. PbP needs more than single sentence responses to investigation roles, ESPECIALLY when the newly on-boarded players are expecting hack n slash with little to no investigation whatsoever.

Who told you guys this was a straight DF, no deviations from template, hack-n-slash game?

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 17):

The FAQ:

If you stick to the templates you're going to be ill equipped to deal with anything else. Unless you were playing a Bard and really loaded up on background skills, but otherwise the templates are lacking for anything else.
This message had punctuation tweaked by the player at 18:33, Wed 04 Apr 2018.

In reply to Theadric Greenbottle (msg # 9):

I'm going to differ with your view... The GM didn't rant to all his Players ... he vented his considerable frustration. I now see you have a bunch as well.  This is a GURPS Game using a lot of DF (saves having to do a lot of work if you use templates etc.).

It is most definitely NOT a D&D game where you go room to room fighting whatever uglies the GM could think up.... where no one ever asks "What the hell is this Ogre Mage/Dragon/name your monster doing down here in a dungeon that has been sealed up and lost for XXX Years" in every room.

Regardless... we are where we are... I like your character ... he sounds fun to play. Perhaps the GM can allow you to make some adjustments to your characters to adapt to the somewhat different setting you have discovered.  Were I the GM, I'd limit that significantly, but putting more points in street wise and ditching a weapon/spell/perk or reducing your weapon skill from 22 might solve much of your issue.

None of us want to see you leave and waste the time and effort spent so far.  As for a weak thread task ... take a moment to think how many differing tasks he's had to create. I'd find it very hard to make everyone novel and complicated. Since I do play a mage in another thread, Paut is a significant thing in these threads. Wether you work for the other side or the Guild, I think you'll find it entertaining.

I have enjoyed it, as have others and I also GM a couple of other games, so I know what's entailed.

Lastly, perhaps you'd write up a small paragraph to better explain how You see this game environment. I chose not to join it twice, before deciding to give it a chance ... and ended up with a very demanding dominant co-player who wanted to be all powerful and direct the threads development to his benefit. Wasn't the best start, but I stuck with it and found it worth my time despite some of what can go wrong.  It's been several years now ... the GM has helped me, I've helped the GM (by taking characters other deserted in mid-adventure) and it has worked out quite decently.  I hope you will find that too.
This message was last edited by the player at 19:04, Wed 04 Apr 2018.

The GM:


On-template builds, including combos of Henchmen, are all designed for a standard DF, which is mainly hack-and-slash. DF uses social skills for exactly five things: (1) Finding a Quest (Dungeons, p. 4), (2) Finding a Sponser (ibid.), (3) Negotiation (i.e., with monsters in the dungeon, as an alternative to fighting them, ibid., p. 10), (4) Taunt and Bluster (i.e. against the monsters, ibid., p. 12), and (5) Getting a Good Price (i.e. selling the spoils, ibid., p. 14).

As you can see, none of these things has anything to do with police-work type investigation. The closest thing is Research to find info about the monsters....monsters that you already know about. Whereas our quest has literally nothing comparable to any of these things.

As I said, that would all be fine with us if we had been made aware that this was in fact NOT a DF game but rather an Urban Fantasy with investigation focus. Which, again, following the templates as the GM requested will not give you a well-rounded character for investigation stuff.

Did you read the rest of that post?  Specifically where it begins to rapidly go into 'and all this other stuff that isn't in DF'?

This was a big tip off for me:  "I am using GURPS Basic Characters, Campaigns, Fantasy,Banestorm, Magic, Thaumatology, Lo-Tech, Martial Arts, Zombies, Horror, some assorted 3e, and all 18 DF books."

Since all of that is far, far outside the DF remit.  I mean I'm not saying you're wrong, but between the FAQ and houserules I got the impression that "we're using DF" was for the relative ease of making characters for newbs and wasn't a hard-fast rule.  And I read some posts in some adventure threads and further refined my impression...

So I then asked and was told "Go ahead and free hand your character if you know what you're doing".  Of the four characters I'm playing only one is strict to the template (Stenet) because I didn't make him (it's a solid build though, no real complaints).  Jareth is a blend of Agent and Sage with some other stuff (DF 14 Psi) at 125 points.  Jednesa is so off template it's not funny† (Ogre + Brute from DF 15 + like 100 exp to get her to 250 points).  Ulo is real close to Wizard (if you slide some points from stats into spells).


† In fact calling her a Barbarian is insulting to the intelligence and skills of Barbarians.

[EDIT]
Also this line from the "DFRPG adjustments?" thread (link to a message in this game), first post:

"New charactets that follow templates are to follow the new version."

Now again, I'm not saying you're completely wrong (maybe gwythaint said "Follow the templates strictly", I don't know), but I am saying that this has really never been a strict DF or DFRPG game by any stretch of the imagination.
[/EDIT]



So, did y'all ask any questions when you rolled in and starting making characters?

I'm not trying to sound like an ass (despite how it sounds)... hmmm.

Maybe this is the question I'm trying to ask:  Who invited you here and gave you the impression it was a strict DF game?  Did gwythaint invite you guys here?

Because if so, then yeah, valid complaint.



I don't disagree.  I'm just trying to drill down to who told you this was a pure DF game.

Granted... I think gwythaint may have decided to go more DFRPG when that came out, so he may have decided to hew more to "make characters by template".  I'll have to go reread a thread now...  link to a message in this game


It isn't.  Your thread may have some of that as it's start... and the 'deal with the juggers' quest was heavy on the social (despite the two guys who took it on being light on the social skills) and a few others with some social stuff (maybe the Silver Jade Palace guys?  I don't know, I'm not followin y'all other there, sorry Chye, Chou, Ales, Iksander, and Aeris!), and the thread with the Bard was heavy social (go figure)...  but the majority of threads are very social skills light (and more inline with standard DF tropeness).

A few aren't even taking place in town, so I have no idea where someone would get "and we don't even need to trek across the wilderness for our quests".  The Shevnia crew might have some choice words about that topic...  ;)

(Not to mention Stalking Balar‡, Caravan to Al Menir, the Abandoned Abbey, and others... my point is roughly half the quests have left town (or in Stalking's case are talking about leaving the tavern to get around to leaving town...))
This message was last edited by the player at 21:16, Wed 04 Apr 2018.

That's completely false.  Every Template has a Social Skill†.  Every Template.


They might not be great at them, they might even be hidden away in their Background skills, but they are there.  Also every Template has non-combat skills for dealing with non-combat things.

Now, I will grant you the genre is 'hack and slash', so I can see having built hack and slash characters and then feeling a bit off when asked to not immediately go about hacking and slashing and having to use skills that might even be defaults... but... this game has never been pure hack and slash.  A minimal perusal of the quest threads will show that.

At which point one would ask the GM "Um, what's up with this game?"
This message was last edited by the player at 21:13, Wed 04 Apr 2018.

Okay, hang on.  I've now read y'all's thread.

So, like, let me get this straight, you're complaining about having to make three social rolls by characters that had decent (13+) social/research skills at the start of the adventure?

Or is it that you all wanted 'action' (read combat focused) and it was begining to look like a talky/politics romp?

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 24):

Contacting the GM to discuss it was what started this whole OOC thread. We contacted trying to air our concerns with the direction the game was going vs what our expectations were as a DF based game, and he decided to take it into an OOC rather than respond to us directly in private. We aren't the ones who brought it into an OOC to make everyone fight about it, we tried to discuss it with him privately so that we could deal with it and continue on without causing any extra stress on everyone else playing or the GM.

We were looking for solutions and explanation as to whether our experiences thus far were what we should expect and if so we would need to probably rebuild our characters, if not build new ones.

Personally I feel the decision to not deal with the concerns in private was rather childish and petty. We bring up concerns in a private message so we can solve it and instead the GM goes and complains to everyone in an OOC that we have concerns.

I had no intentions of leaving unless the rest of my group wanted to, I merely wanted a better understanding of what to expect and to be able to rebuild my character a bit with a more social skill focus if that was what we should have expected but the manner in which this has been handled has turned me off and made me much more willing to just say its not worth the hassle if any private concerns we bring up are going to be handled so poorly. I play games and PbP adventures to relax and have fun with friends, not to deal with school yard drama.

Okay.  Can't say I've ever had these problems in the two-years I've been in gwythaint's games.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 26):

Congrats?

I honestly don't know why you responded. Our complaint is with the GM. Since he decided to post the complaint in the ooc I responded in the same venue. It would have been much better to resolve this via PM.

'Cause I'm nosy.

Yeah, All this seems to show a fair bit of misunderstanding and failure to communicate.

The GM has always been square to my knowledge, let's see if you all can start the dialogue over ... I think there has been enough information provided to give you a good idea of what this game offers. I expect you can adjust your characters fairly easily to be a better fit. There is combat, which can be ugly close to losing ... I haven't actually lost one yet, but I've seen the *Last Chance to pull us out* used twice now with some serious repercussions. Like the city block that was turned into a Crater.

Lets Everyone give everyone else a second chance.

In reply to Oly (msg # 29):

I am sorry this came out like I was trying to air private problems publicly; in part I was looking for solutions. I also had someone bail about two weeks ago after setting a plot, inventing a bounty to be hunted and having a custom character build; it was feeling like failing on multiple fronts. I have been hoping to get you guys into the public occ threads because all I have been getting is Theadric bringing me the concerns you have privately discussed. Yes, I could have made a private chat, but I would like you all to be part of our larger community as well.

I would also love to see you turn against the mageguild instead of taking their bounty. Mageguild members tend to have loot.
This message was last edited by the GM at 23:53, Wed 04 Apr 2018.

I think that it's a great setting, and is very obviously growing quickly in player count. I however think that a lot of these problems.could be avoided if a co-gm was allowed to enter the fray. Someone that is familiar with 4e and that can be in communication with the gm to keep the story moving along. The gm is doing great, but I feel like maybe he has too much on his plate at the moment, overseeing 25+ characters. Ultimately, tho, the co-gm, if allowed, would still have to defer to the actual gm because it is his intellectual property. I honestly think this would make for better pacing, and give both the players and the gm a bit of peace of mind.

yeah, sometimes this role is referred to as the "adversary" some GMs use it, some like to direct everything themselves. i have lots of free time. i'm pretty much semi-retired, but i'm not the most 4e saavy person. like, i'm not even fully aware of all the things 4e can benefit my own players, especially the new combat rules, with all it's options. i like options, though.

I'll second this -- I've got a character who's slower than built, and has a hint of a limp, because the GM came up with a way, IC, to get him a Restoration spell none of the characters could afford -- else he'd be permanently Lame, Move 2 and -2 skill on all non-missile combat.  Still most of two months before he'll really walk correctly, but in a couple years of player time, he'll be right as rain.

And still, at 125 points on a Henchman build, this is the deadliest character I have (one-shots are common with ordinary arrows).

lol mario is like a turret, right now.

Nah, I get around okay since the Restoration on my knee.  Tell you what, though, if I see any more of those doombrats, they're going down at the furthest distance possible -- underground, that's sight limited.  Outdoors, I can get good hits at 100 yards or more.

is that what put your knee out? the doom brats?

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 36):

You would love the monastery then...wights throwing doombrats at the moment! Occasionally Jednessa catches them and throws them back!

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 37):

Those little bastards are among my favorites to deploy.
I suppose my other faves are the maned rats, slorn and wights...

Let me stock up on some exorcism, then...

Yeah Mario used to be a mobile adventurer like you until he took a knife to the knee.


No joke, that 3d-2 cutting knife attack is rough.  Unless you're Jednesa... but she's probably the most heavily armored Character* in the game at DR 10/12 (Tough Skin/Tough Skin Crushing Only).

I need to get her some eye armor, that's her second† biggest weakness (armor wise) but honestly my biggest worry.




* Gorgath might have just been a touch higher.  At least he could pretty easily have been.

† Touch attacks are the biggest... but... she'll just have to suck those up.

Actually he's a point below that at a 9. But hey, cheap SM+1 armor is still expensive.  But makes up for it by killing things before they can hurt him.
This message was last edited by the player at 21:54, Thu 05 Apr 2018.

Yep, Jareth has the gist of it.  Looked around a door while we were hunting Saturnines near the street collapse site, and there was a doombrat behind the door.  Tried to punch it to keep it from exploding (had already taken shrapnel from one several yards away) -- but not much of a brawler and didn't (still don't) know they don't require a killing injury to blow.

Took one hit before anyone else could arrive, not life threatening, but crippled the leg, and it rolled up as "lasting injury."  That knife of theirs is just a large knife for anyone else, they've got some kind of special technique that does far more damage than their strength should give.

Probably "Lower Purpose:  Cripple Archers"...



Actually I forget exactly where I read it, but the build is Striking ST +10 (Knife Only, -20%) [40].

That sounds about right.  They're only a threat with the knife, and the knife is only special for them.  Like Chuckie filled with gunpowder.

In reply to Mario Crowfoot (msg # 44):

I wonder if they are born with them? No wonder succubi are demonic women if they are...that would be a horrible birth!

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 45):

It is a cheap knife that they find. It could be a created item that would fade with them, but that build makes sense for the nasty things.  They do have multiple origins  - Dungeon Fantastic's Felltower has them summoned by a statue of a monkey banging cymbals.

lol

In my game, the church has a bounty on the knives.  Otherworldly symbols of evil and all that.

I like that.  Just saw something the other day with the origin of the Wilhelm scream.  Yep, stuntman named Wilhelm...

the howie scream is the other iconic scream. you know the one.. it goes: "Jehrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!"

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 50):
I will be posting tomorrow, in the meantime get a gander at Sean Punch's Caverntown. Very relateable to Northport.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 51):

Got a hiccup posting for Malga'Mar... 6 repeats, undeletable.

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 61):

Malga'Mar swings at the wight, smashing through its ribcage and spine. It collapses in a steaming pile of bone.

broderick, broderick. wherefore art thou, broderick?

Hey GM, I think our last IC post is missing some info. It looks like something didn't get copied from the notes or something.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 52):

Lol, even beyond the powers of the GM to delete? How is that even possible?!

My Private Messages appears to be permanently highlighted in red.  No matter how many times I click on all of my messages, it keeps flaring up.

Do you play on multiple devices? I've had something like that happen where if I've got my private messages open in a tab on one device (my computer at home) it resets all my notifications (on my phone) even if there isn't a new message.

In reply to Valdnur Silverheart (msg # 55):

Thank you that got truncated, and is updated, needs a roll. Hidden lore magical writing, with a complimentary bonus from alchemy,iq-3 for an alchemist, or occultism-3 may do for details about that name...

Also, I will be back tomorrow.

I am assuming Dungeon Butcher is standard default of IQ-5? says its up to the GM since it is based on the Professional Skill listing...

Sigh, i'm travelling with a bunch of psychopaths :)

Not true ... although you do think sssstrangly yourssself.

On the contrary, a bunch is not all. I am sure I am not the only psychopath in the group, so that is likely to be quite true!

You for ssssure , but whom elssssee?

Berry seems to be an oddball as well.

Any word on Broderick? Idk where he's been but I haven't heard from him in days.

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 65):

Lazy... not psssssycho.

In reply to Sederic (msg # 66):
Holy week just ended, lots of people traveling etc.
Hopefully he didn't quit. That's quite the entourage...

In reply to Narrator (msg # 51):
http://www.warehouse23.com/products/SJG37-0343
Cavern town seems pretty interesting, indeed.

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 69):

Does anyone have any desire for a maritime adventure thread? Actually, I should ask the GM if he is interested first...

I actually have many maritime skills...

In reply to Iskander (msg # 71):

I had proposed a trip to Sahud about a year ago.

I remember!

Working out sentences in Dark One is an interesting exercise.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 72):

Is that offer of the trip still up? Do we have a boat, or would a new character with a boat be desirable?

All I really want to make is a pirate...
that's All i want to be.

If it were in the interests of our Daimyo, I would welcome the opportunity to visit my mother's homeland.  Perhaps, if I grow wealthy enough, I can take her there.  It might do her some good to see her home place again,  and her family, if they still live.

I wouldn't mind going home either. see what's new in the jianghu, and see if i can find my patriarchs, or sightings or clues at least.

New Captain en route :)

In reply to Haveron Stormwal (msg # 79):

Can do. I was thinking of Aoife, but if we need a boat, I can make up a Captain of a Square Rigged sailing boat or a sloop. Anything bigger requires a bit much wealth!
This message was last edited by the player at 12:29, Wed 11 Apr 2018.

If you wanna fight for captaincy then better watch out!

'ol haveron, always wanting to be the boss of other pc's. xD
the character might change, but the ambitions of the player remain the same!

I'm your huckleberry...

It's because the social aspect of the game - at least more than 'intra group dynamics' - is an often missed part of games.

I kinda like the idea of having wider influence and being able to pull things together that are greater than the reach of my sword.

I like combat too.  But definitely the best charascters are those that can have wider ranging influence on the world and other people.

Being the 'poorish travelling adventure putting things together for scraps of wealth with great ambition' has been done too often and i'd much prefe rleaning towards the 'starting super wealthy/noble/influential' and try to deal with the challenges that such a lifestyle brings - they're not better, just different, I suppose.

In reply to Haveron Stormwal (msg # 84):

If you want to create a wealthy character that owns his boat, go for it. If I create one, he will own the boat as signature gear, so it will be a case of accept the current owner or find your own. Unless the Narrator allows PvP, for such things, but still, in order to keep it, you will most likely have to spend serious points, or large items like that will be contested in court by living heirs...

how about creating a character with an ally group that consists of crew, and each of them are shareholders of the vessel as well? it can be moored in the harbor, and serve as a home base, too.
This message was last edited by the player at 21:22, Wed 11 Apr 2018.

In reply to Iskander (msg # 86):

While I won't be posting much today (work/therapy/family issues)
I am looking in to costing out ship ownership but there needs to be some thread consolidation or co dmibg, and I am unsure of how the tools for that work here, or if it would have to be a new game... a bigger problem for me to keep up with. Sadly 4e vehicles only has worjed examples in the form of Spaceships, which I own along with the wierd ones that amount to airship design,  but most of those are 3e.
So far (I will look closer at the pirate issue of pyramid) a residence or business that provides 1 person cost of living, and provides a 62pt hireling costs $10k. The juniors dropping Base points into their place amounts to it; the value of yhe deed they were awarded may amount to that. A ship may run into 30-50 points as an advantage; abn airship looks like it would be hundreds of points though.

I need to work this stuff out.  Be posting tomorrow.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 87):

The Brig or sloop, both TL4, from LT are good examples of that.

Other than that, the snekke from LT Companion 2, Warriors, p38 or the dhows or cogs from LT companion 3, Economics, p41 would all be good options. I

I can assist with co-gming if you like, but there might be some better qualified.

Edit: I notice considerable discrepancy in the Cogs price in Basic ($23k) and Low Tech Companion 3 ($140k). Which price is used here?
This message was last edited by the player at 11:46, Thu 12 Apr 2018.

Won't run on your tablet, but presuming you have a PC at home with Windows, Linux, or MacOS you could look into GURPS Character Sheet (GCS) for statting vehicles (and lots of other stuff -- create an NPC in 10 minutes?  Good to go!  Store templates?  Yep. and so forth).  Free software, actively (if a little slowly -- life gets in the way) maintained.  I think you still have to understand Vehicles to stat a vehicle that makes sense, but it does the math for you, and handles rules interactions pretty well.

it would also be a cool idea to have a martial arts tournament in sahud, that attracted fighters all over the land to compete in events of both armed (wooden), and unarmed combat.
it might even attract some of his relatives... :D

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 90):

I had overtime tonight, might not catch up

In reply to Narrator (msg # 91):

I may be scarce for a few days.

Do what you need to.  Life still comes first.  Nothing we've got going won't keep until next week.

I just want to make sure the pricing being offered for the demonskin vellum is taking into account Valdnur's wealth levels.

In reply to Arthur (msg # 94):

Indeed. I have Very Wealthy which means we should sell everything at the purchase price. I couldn't figure out from the treasure tables exactly what Demon Skin Vellum, but I just want to make sure we're getting the right price.

we need a good rules lawyer, and a good story teller. if this were gurps 3e, i have 26 years experience, but as i haven't put time into 4e, i wouldn't be effective in that regard, but i can story tell and i could help manage npcs and combats to help move those things along, in collaboration with a rules lawyer.
This message was last edited by the player at 18:55, Sat 14 Apr 2018.

We do NOT need a rules Lawyer... and the GM is the rules Judge.  Lets keep it simple and non argumentative, please.

right, and we need somebody who understands those rules, and abides by the GMs script, as a co-gm... who's arguing?

Right.... How bout them doombrats?

Oly, I believe this was intended to apply to the comment about needing a co-GM.  That's a job that would require strong rules knowledge, story telling ability, willingness to follow the GM's script, and plenty of free time.

I grant that Ardenas, but the term "Rules Lawyer" means something quite different to me.

Yeah, I'm already here, we don't need another one... oh wait...

with as slow as the threads move.. (which cannot be helped) you are doing yourself a disservice, by making any character less than 250 pts. unless you run with a group all composed of the same value. you'll be years into the game before you even even approach 250 from CPs you might have earned in play.

That's generally true, Chye, but Masugatan was original built to join the "Juniors" group -- Jareth, myself, Jocelyn, Mellarill, Nodwin Zideqick, and originally a goblin jugger quick whose name has escaped me.  The original player pulled a stunt that, though retconned away, put people off wanting to play with him, and wound up separated from the Juniors.  The replacement player came along some time later, after Masugatan had joined up with a group of 250 point characters.  He's since been floating between teams, but the Juniors are the only group currently active (that I know about) entirely composed of 125 point characters (plus earned CP, of course).

Honestly, I play three character, all my own builds -- the other two are 250 point, and I believe Mario would beat any of the three in a straight-out fight.  If hostilities commenced at a distance, he might beat both together.  An archer is not to be trifled with.

yeah, mario is deadly for his cost.

In reply to Valdnur Silverheart (msg # 95):

If Valdnur is selling, it goes for $100 per sheet as it is considered "fine" when sold to a demonologist. Faust was offering the average weakrh price, do Valdnur neslling getz you full- $500 for the lot.

In reply to Mario Crowfoot (msg # 104):

As it goes, Masugatan 's build as a Brute makes him much more effective than any other 125pt close combat type,and better than any non combatant 250 pt character. 25 pts would put him at a near even match for plenty of those. Brute is a very good build.


Incidentally work has again been ridiculous. I appreciate the Overtime, but I would prefer not to have it sprung on me by other people planning  poorly or being incompetent at their jobs.
This message was last edited by the GM at 22:04, Mon 16 Apr 2018.

Sounds good. Kind of figured that was the case but just wanted to make sure :)

i'm in a stymied thread!
may we invoke the house rule of two weeks absent without warning?
This message was last edited by the player at 00:15, Tue 17 Apr 2018.

In reply to Grimaldi (msg # 109):

I fear that we may have lost Broderick's player. He hasn't answered any pms and has been frustrated with some things assumed and never placed on a character sheet. I will start npcing him. The only issue with the expedition was that it had been based on the possibility of coercing information about another playersecret spell result... I  need something more concrete. Give me a few days to handle some adjustments.

Do I miss my guess or did he also once play Zarat?
This message was last edited by the player at 01:07, Tue 17 Apr 2018.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 111):

How did you know?

lol... he rrrrrrage quit....

In reply to Narrator (msg # 110):
No problemo!

Can I claim hiz wife? zhe wuz cude...

Some people's personality just really shine through into their characters.

For instance Azrael*, Grend, and Oren were all very, very, very similar personality wise, which made figuring out that they were played by the same person very, very, very simple.


Also Zarat had issues with not being the guy in charge and having a party that didn't just kowtow to him... and... well... Brody was clearly designed to solve that 'problem'.  (Also, when he came back you mentioned he was a returning Player.  They're weren't too many possibilities at the time and Hitomi's Player had just left...)


Inversely Mario, Ardenas, and Chou are dissimilar enough to be impossible to identify† as being the same person... but the Player sometimes posts as the wrong character, making that one pretty easy to figure out.  :P





* The new Player who has taken over Azrael is clearly different from the original Player.

† Most every one else too.  Wouldn't know whom all Blue Dwarf was playing for instance if we didn't have this thread over here: link to a message in this game

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 116):

Actually, that list is incomplete. I suspect there would be lethal combat if all my characters were put in a room together. Entertaining, but lethal...

But yeah, Melchizadeks warning about Broderick was also a thin warning about the player not just wanting but NEEDING to be in charge, in some cases even trying to tell the GM what was happening, but I suspect many may have missed that.

Thank you, Jareth.  That's well nigh the highest compliment you can pay to someone who cares about his role playing.  :)

i'd be interested to have a gander at Broderick's sheet!
he spent so much on his huge entourage, that he himself must have been relatively useless, save some administrative skills and fencing at a sub-par level, like barely enough to justify the rapier, as more than a dress piece...it seemed like a cheat tactic to have so many characters in your thrall, you could pretty much usurp the whole thread,through bias... lol

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 117):

The new boy in the neighborhood
Lives upstairs and it’s understood
He’s there just to take good care of me
Like he’s one of the family
Broderick in charge
Of our days and our nights
Broderick in charge
Of our wrongs and our rights
And I see I want
I want Broderick in charge of me
Broderick in charge
Of our days and our nights
Broderick in charge
Of our wrongs and our rights
And I see I want Broderick in charge of me
Broderick in charge
Mmm!
This message was last edited by the player at 12:14, Tue 17 Apr 2018.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 116):
oh yeah, i am wary of other players who seek to try and be the boss of other PCs. i will avoid dealings with those i deem have this issue. good luck trying trying to impose your will on individuals! if that's what you want, create yourself a lacky npc. haha
This message was lightly edited by the player at 12:09, Tue 17 Apr 2018.

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 120):

lol, Hmmm, Not much to add to that!

I didn't miss it.  A lot like Grend, or Jin as originally played, only more polite and less prone to simply outclassing everyone around.

Well I play 7 different characters ... hopefully all different from the others, although at times I think it is obvious that they are all managed by one player ... Many of these I took over when someone dumped them ...  only Oly and Adept Yisslitheniss are of my design.
I took over Azrael, Brodak, Jocelyn, Mellarill, Syvanus and Urrun. I gave Johan Stark back to the GM after a while, he was very unidimensional although his troll wife might provide some variation.
Brodak, Jocelyn and Mellarill were all once in Johan's 'team' that a player dumped. He developed and ran them all as a single group it seems. There were a couple of others too IIRC, but having a whole team for one player  to run isn't my idea of fun.
Mellarill's dog was my add, with GM aid... that group seems to have enough differences to work OK.
Azrael is pretty useless as designed. He would make a good self heating, self propelled, thermal E-Type silhouette.

Aha!  Thanks, I've been trying to figure out who was running Mel and Brodak, so I could tell if our Narrator had posted something or not (I kept thinking they were NPCs but also thought they weren't)... and when to try to push the thread along or if I needed to keep waiting.


I think Az is meant to be an information gathering character.


Pretty sure everyone would make a good E-Type silhouette.

Except Jednesa and Aoife... one is too big and one is too small.

Hogan's alley
This message was last edited by the player at 08:32, Wed 18 Apr 2018.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 125):

Aoife could take the form of something that size...

But Chris would not...he is made of clay!

Nah, most are more useful for various reasons ... Az is essentially useless except in a very specific context. A very limited character the GM wasn't able to talk the Player out of ... and then when it became boring, he dropped out.

There are some days when I feel pretty useless, too.  I'm not nearly the martial artist I intended to be, and my magic is so limited it hardly seems worth the points I pulled back out of my core skills and stats.

Then again, there are the times when I stun the slorn with the first kick or one-shot the walking dead left over from another group's adventure.  But with Power Blow being used correctly (long concentration required to offset a huge skill penalty), unarmed attacks are pretty limited (and I don't own a copy of Martial Arts, even 3rd ed., never mind current).

i'm well satisfied with Chye, in his toughness, deadliness, and his mix of skills, makes him able to cover a decent amount of angles. very fun character.

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 130):

I am still learning new things I can do with mages, and I have only really started with non-magic (or clerical magic) users recently with Horgath, who has not seen too much combat. At least, not that challenged him...

I have some pretty cool ideas in store for Grimaldi, he'll be deadly up close, and from a distance, as well as being able to do all sorts of other useful things.

Back on tomorrow

Unless our Narrator pipes in with "No really, go drum up some help..."  ;)

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 134):

Heh.
Took a day off to spend with the wife;I  should be back tomorrow unless I get time later.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 135):

Who was that last post near the bone gate again? :D

Mario's getting his personalities mixed up again...

In reply to Narrator (msg # 135):

Work was a mess, spending time with family, hopefully back tomorrow;
Also further delays on any plans of piracy; lulu sent me an Italian fencing manual  instead of Pyramid 3/64...
This message was last edited by the GM at 20:18, Sat 21 Apr 2018.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 138):

Once again weekend work was shit. I will catch up tomorrow.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 139):

On early tomorrow if not later today. Work has been unreal.

I feel you.

The past couple of months for me have been such a pain in the ass. Just go at your leisure, we'll all still be around to cause mayhem. :)

In reply to Haveron Stormwal (msg # 141):

I don't know what is up at my job, but this has been ridiculous.  I should be on tomorrow,  but I will be in a workshop for the next two days trying to fix the patient transport system in the hospitality I work in. Wish me luck.

good luck with it.. have fun:)

I see that I have the ability to post for Khoza, I just want to clarify if I am controlling him all the time, only in combat or only outside of combat.

I am fine with whatever just want to make sure I am doing it how you intended :)

In reply to Khozapukt (msg # 144):

That works whenever he is present by summoning. I may throw in a thread of what he is doing when not with you, much tbe same as Var...

Sounds good. I don't think he will be able to go against my commands very well anyways since I did pay for the Magical Lawyer perk.

In reply to Arthur (msg # 146):

True, but demons that are not everpresent have other jobs...

I should be on tomorrow,  everyone called out sick at work and I got put to tbe grind.

Yeah, I wasn't as concerned about that for posting purposes as I am about when he is with me.

In reply to Arthur (msg # 148):

This has been a shit week for posting.
Work has been insane (that whole fix patient escort thing crashed and burned due to half the shift calling out),my downtime there has been nil, I  am chasing after commissions and running to a family event.  Stress has been getting to me, and I have been punching equipment at work again (touch screens that are either unresponsive or touching themselves, bad code that interrupts other programs and needs a shutdown to get out of, third party tracking software that takes minutes to refresh a screen, or arbitrarily deletes entered data). I need a vacation and the one I applied for was denied.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZUQ59UjCR0 *Chipmunk voice* "everything's gonna be alriiiiight!"

enjoy your weekend, we'll still be here

In reply to Iskander (msg # 151):

Not going to be on today, dealing with some stuff.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 152):

Be back tomorrow

Sorry, I have been sick all week and haven't been on here.

In reply to Nodwin Zideqick (msg # 154):

Feel better.  I have barely been able to get on myself.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 155):

Escorting a Goddess to make sure she makes no new converts? Sounds like a custom made job for our resident crazy, or Clarence and his pet spider!

Yep, it does.  Sadly, Jareth and crew are already busy escorting a being far stranger (if less powerful) than a death goddess.  Mancini's already on the scene, the question may be who he can recruit.

In reply to Gareth (msg # 156):

Not quite a goddess... the grandaughter of one perhaps

I think just might have started a brawl at the noodle joint... xD

Chye's a fight-starter. lol though last time, was on purpose. Maybe I can stop him?

In reply to Iskander (msg # 160):

Not really. And the phrase is "from the wedding gig"

i remember that, that was chyes intro and he gained no hassles and met the guildmaster, sean connery

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 162):

As benign as the Ymid is, sooner or later someone will badly fail a fright check...

No doubt.  Roll enough times...

...and yet, if we're rude to him (by his standards, of course, which might have little similarity to our own) he could quickly become less benign.  No easy way out...

In reply to Rochecko (msg # 161):
Yoi!

In reply to Mario Crowfoot (msg # 164):

True, but we did just save him...

Eh, pretty easy by my standards.  That eye of his ...  even I'd have a hard time missing it.  ;)

Did he lose the energy shield he had when we first met?  Dropped when the spiders took him down?

In reply to Mario Crowfoot (msg # 168):

While poisoned he let a lot of maintained spells lapse.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 169):

just realized a matter of concern for the Hadereum got kicked to the next page...

I am not going to be back on I have been spending the day fighting with financial aid. My household now has 5 school loans floating Whoopee!
This message was last edited by the GM at 20:06, Tue 08 May 2018.

O started a new job, so until my schedule settles, I'm gonna be a bit slow on posting. Not bailing guys, just busy AF lately. I also play aegis and Tanaka, so if any of u guys r with me, i apologize for the delay.

*tim curry impression*
"we all FLOAT down here!"

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 172):

Be on tomorrow

I can see it now... in an upcoming battle Mel moves over to make use Mario's Conrucopia Quiver... She stands so close he can feel the heat from her body, smell the tantalizing tang of her sweat... they both reach for the quiver at the same moment, their fingers entwine accidentally... Mario looks into her eyes, his breath catches in his throat, his heart flutters rapidly...  then Mel curses him out for being a stupid fool, spits in his eye, head butts him unconscious, and proceeds to put his never-ending single arrow to good use for the rest of the fight...
This message was last edited by the player at 06:09, Thu 10 May 2018.

You're a silly person, Jareth.  That's what the practice is for, so we alternate drawing arrows from the quiver.  Save that other stuff for out of combat...  ;)

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 174):

Silly indeed ... she might appreciate his gentlemanliness ... she's not Gay, just abused and unwilling to take anymore ... oh and she learned Aralese in a seaman's bar ... so she is suspect of all sailors.

I can understand that.  I've been over to Dockside a couple times, but never been on a ship, myself.

In reply to Mario Crowfoot (msg # 177):

:)

Back on tomorrow

I haven't been able to get any downtime at work lately, and I have been touring the school my wife is starting in next month for her pending career change,; this os why I have been messing with financial aid lately. Tomorrow evening I will be able to catch up; meanwhile I have been getting  behind on commissions for Solar Blades and Cosmic Spells  and for issue 2 of Echoes from Formalhaut.
Generally all of my gaming purchases come out of that money, and lately, groceries, so I need to keep up.

it's all good, in the 'hood

As always, keep the home front together first.  No home front, no game.

Not a bad thing to keep us posted, but given that, keep your priorities straight.

In reply to Ardenas Barehand (msg # 181):

Part of the reason I haven't been able to keep my shit straight lately is that my moodswing has gotten worse; I  may be seeing about an increase in medication this week.
I have been on my current dose for a few years now and have been a generally regular person, but every now and again I realize that I have a mental disadvantage that is more than quirk level.
This message was last edited by the GM at 18:18, Sun 13 May 2018.

punching x-ray equipment might increase brawling skill, though!

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 183):

It does damage to the hand like unarmed attacks on armor and adds a negative modifier to your job roll. Having a bloated form of bad temper downgrades relationships with management.

I don't think I will be able to get anthing done today, please bear with me.
This message was last edited by the GM at 20:03, Mon 14 May 2018.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 184):

All hood here. When you are ready. I will have an extended absence of about a month starting mid July as well. Work related.

As always, take care of life first.  And believe me, I know what Bad Temper can do to employment; I have a situational case often exacerbated by my boss (-2 on control rolls when he's involved).

Try some meditation.  (I hear it adds +2 to self control rolls.)

There are days when I think I need medication more than meditation.  It's only at work, though, so no doc is going to prescribe anything -- and I can't get them to write me out of work for my mental health (and couldn't pay my bills if they did).

Sad, but true.

In reply to Ales Konstantin (msg # 189):

I will catch up with all in the morning

In reply to Narrator (msg # 190):

Why such resistance to a quest?

In reply to Plutocrat Remulos (msg # 191):

I know, right?

In reply to Kalima (msg # 192):

Not resistance to the quest, just seeking clarification as to what the quest REALLY is!

In reply to Aoife (msg # 193):

I was not sure Christine would be aware that the magical boulder would injure wights, and wanted to avoid metagaming!

My resistance is mainly against the idea of getting involved with things that feet and fists can't harm.

Wow, those guys in "Back Table" are deadly.  And trigger-happy.  O.o

heads roll and eyes get punji'd, at a steady rate

In reply to Mario Crowfoot (msg # 196):

DF characters are supposed to be good at killing things. The trigger-happy is just a happy coincidence. :D

In reply to Espiri Skyblessed (msg # 198):

It was anticipated!

I expect the welcome party to be expendable people without valuable intel, whoever is in charge should ought to be intimidated by how easily we murdered his goons I hope.

In reply to Valdnur Silverheart (msg # 200):

More likely encouraged to send more capable goons next time...

In reply to anaconda (msg # 201):

I think we are looking forward to a challenge.

Just so long as the GM doesn't mix up your challenge with our whatever.  My group probably can't take down three guards in two seconds.  If we decided to kill them, it'd take us at least five seconds, possibly as much as ten.

In reply to Ardenas Barehand (msg # 203):

Did you not use a DF template to build your characters? Or are you all casters of some kind?

template schmemplate!

In reply to Iskander (msg # 205):

See now when we joined we were told to stick to the templates, combine race, class, or henchmen templates as desired, but to stick to them nonetheless. So I'm not sure what your attitude about the templates is for, they were written by the same people who wrote the system we're using and I'd think they know what they're talking about when they write up a template.

they do, they do.. but they're like riding your bike with training wheels and about 100 feet of chain attached to it, so all you can do is ride back and forth in front of your house.
This message was last edited by the player at 17:03, Thu 17 May 2018.

In reply to Iskander (msg # 207):

Not really a good analogy at all. The templates are highly optimized DF adventurers. So to make your analogy accurate the templates are like the standard Tour de France bike. They are amazing for what they are built for, minor tweaks are still possible to fit the individual, and major modifications tend to give a lackluster result.

his analogy might work if you were trying to put a DF template into a standard fantasy game though.

following a template is like building a bike from scratch with using the instructions, in the end you get what was advertised.

sure you can build something else with the parts if you want but then you aren't getting a bike and won't be able to enter the bike race.

In this analogy Iskander is using parts from a few different boxes to build his bike... and he still is allowed to enter the race, which is for him an off-road triathlon.


You guys all built tour de france bikes and will need to desperately avoid any triathlon events, sticking purely to tour de courses.


No judgements.  I suspect it was that way for you guys because gwythaint's schedule is a lot tighter now than it was 2 years ago when I joined (and Iskander and the Silver Jade crew were right after me).  It's just easier to approve characters and design adventures when they are made according to template.


Of my characters?  Jareth would straight up die on one of your adventures, 125 point Sage/Agent?  Not for the high combat lifestyle.  Jednesa would rock out on one of your adventures, she's even more highly optimized to do what y'all do.  But she has some glaring flaws, which I felt were necessary to bring her back down to "DF" starting character levels.  Ulo was very close to being a pure Troll Wizard, so very close... so she'd have been fine on one of your missions, but honestly was built to be "city compatible", so she'd be a little underweight for pure Dungeon Bashes (but does okay in Dungeon Diplomacy events).  I didn't build Stenet, he's a straight up Holy Warrior.
This message was last edited by the player at 19:31, Thu 17 May 2018.

yeah, i'm grandfathered in. xD

Oh yeah? well, I'm the only true youxia, in this wuxia thread, boy-o.

Yes, okay.  I was built with templates, but the Elder Spawn template is 70 points, and being a wizard soaks up most of the rest -- and leaves a lot of options for what you optimize for.  I did take down two dragon men with lightning (one bolt each) recently (including surviving one's breath weapon without dropping my lightning).

I cast in all four elements (weak in Water, though), Movement, and a little Light/Darkness; I'm not bulletproof (though arrows don't hurt me the way they do you), but I do okay for a caster.  And I'm not sure about Chye's definition of youxia excluding me...

Mario is only 125 points, strongly optimized as an archer.  Draw from quiver, nock, draw, and fire all in one round, with the bow's Acc, so one non-wild shot per second, good enough to shoot vitals with great confidence at reasonable underground ranges.  Can also hold his own with a quarterstaff, and pick a lock when needed.

Ardenas is a Martial Artist, but built down to take a Wizard lens.  Movement College only, not really much of a caster, but when you really, really need to move quietly, Levitation is the trick.  Lockmaster comes handy from time to time, too, and then there's Wallwalker.  Power Blow is a disappointment, however, didn't read it carefully enough when building (10 rounds of concentration to use it without penalty?!).  Walking without leaving tracks is cool, but not very useful in DF so far.  Same for Immovable Stance (knockback resistance), on both counts.

Humans aren't built with templates, and this game was just GURPS before DF. It did have a DF like slant though; none of my characters was built from a template ( some I inherited from those being left behind by game droppers were), although some ideas and tweaks were copied from them. I find the fun to play, even with their foibles, which is the goal, No?

Most of the Templates provide a cookie cutter feel and aren't so much fun to play IMHO.
This message was last edited by the player at 22:05, Thu 17 May 2018.

in the occupational and classical sense. lol

Power Blow (before getting it up around skill 23+) is primarily of use in bashing doors/chests and lifting heavy things (stuck gates).

That's all Jednesa has it for.  The first door we can't open easily is taking a ST 60 hit from her Axe/Mace...

In reply to Jednesa (msg # 216):

ST 60...how will the axe take it?

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 217):

Plutocrat Romulus was not referring to what is possibly the most useless piece of Hograths kit, perchance?

Balanced Silver coated brass knuckles, $70, 0.25 lbs

Ironwood haft?

And yes, Hograth, he might well have been.  For me (martial artist), it's a fairly easy way to be able to harm things that require silver or magic to harm.

On the head.  :P



Actually, hadn't given any thought to whether or not the big iron wedge can take that hit or not...   hmmm...

In reply to Ardenas Barehand (msg # 219):

Logically, whacking something with an effective ST of 60 should require some pretty special materials...but not sure if Nessa thought that far ahead! It is not her strong point...

We can see when we retrieve her maul...from deep inside the vat!

gwythaint, I know you like to allow in everything including the kitchen sink... but I have to advise you just say no to Artillery Spells.

http://www.warehouse23.com/products/SJG37-0154

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 222):

To players or bad guys?

Oh players of course.  I'd never recommend limiting his villainy.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 224):

Just bought it, waiting on print. I will decide, but if it is in use, expect long ranfpge attacks before anyone learns them.

Sorry.  I've been ill the last few weeks... as such my post rate has suffered*.  Hopefully (as I'm [now] shedding this sinus infection) it should pick back up.



* For instance I've completely forgotten I'm running Stenet.
This message was last edited by the player at 23:35, Mon 21 May 2018.

Oh, and the story Jareth is referencing, Morag the Immortal:  https://www.oglaf.com/morag/

Warning, while that particular page is Work Safe, most of Oglaf is not.

(There are more stories containing Morag on Oglaf... I can point those out if you wish, or you can just read them yourself, but they are more difficult to track down (Oglaf is a bit of a grab bag with short stories))

By my calculations a cask 2.5 yards wide by 6 yards high has a volume of 90,026,334.527616
cm3.  This should place it's weight at (roughly) 198,058 lbs (if it were pure water which is close enough to wine to satisfy me).

So... it's beyond being able to be pushed over...  (unless my math is wrong, which there is a very good chance it is)

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 227):

Be on tomorrow.  Am fond of Oglaf.

The vats are not meant to be moved, and while no loger full of wine, they have a sludge of concentrated vinegar that is about a foot and a half deep by 4 yards in diameter.

So... much lighter than my napkin math... might have to heave one out the door at some point...

Assuming the sludge is the same density as the wine, which I am guessing it is probably heavier, that would make the liquid contained within the cask weigh 16505lbs or there about on top of the weight of the cask itself, still not readily moveable.

In reply to Arthur (msg # 231):

it would take roughly two to three of Jednesa to heave a vat up and out the door. the vats themselves weigh nearly a tun empty.

Give her a few* seconds and she can at least shove one over...  which isn't something she's allowed to do while Berserk†.



* Specifically 10 seconds and a 'not crappy' Power Blow roll (13 or lower)...  give her 5 minutes of stamping her feet and getting upset at it and another 'not crappy' Power Blow and she could snatch it up and heave it a few yards (if your number is correct, it's exactly 4.5 yards of distance on that throw)...

† At least not without (a) gwythaint agreeing her Power Blow is based on anger so allowed during a Berserk rampage, and (b) requires a roll of a 3 or 4.   So... not exactly reliable.

In reply to Jednesa (msg # 233):

I must, based on personal quirks, agree that one can become enraged at objects. As to whether that is RaW, I care not.


Be back on in the morning. It has been a day.

i got some stats on some boats that might be useful
fishing junk and trade junk

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 235):

please don't show us your junk.

NO! For sure if you have to reach in your pants... otherwise maybe, assuming you aren't a nudist.

lol we ran a whole adventure based off a dick joke.

Sinus Infection Update:  It's worse.  Egads it's worse.  The antibiotics have teamed up with the infection to really whup my ass.


Still keep forgetting.  I'll try to remember this this time.

In reply to Iskander (msg # 238):

Yes, I remember... and feel better, Jareth/Stenet

Probably not a bad contact to know, in the cosmos.

In reply to Iskander (msg # 241):

"as per Monster Hunters 2, the Enemy, demons deliberately leave easy summoning instructions, lists of demonic names, and all of the how to's prospective demologists might need where they can be easily found. Demons want to be summoned, and make it as easy as possible"

To bad she's going to be residing in that tea set with the Lighter of Incense for the next few centuries.

龍脫粒機
Lóng TuōLì jī *Dragon Thresher* (+9 CF) iron nunchaku, with silver-plated embellishing, and dragon-motif etching. [ornate+1 (etching) ,silver coating, fine, balanced +1 to skill, solid metal(DR6), +1 damage] Min ST 8, $600, 4 lbs (signature gear) *weight is increased by 2 lbs for all metal construction, increasing min st by 1*

Chye's signature nunchaku have evolved into an expensive weapon, from the lowly wooden nunchaku for the $20 they started out as. these are bad ass though. when i get an odd number of CPs again, i'll make them as my naginata is, with the 2 perks i just added...
This message was last edited by the player at 08:21, Mon 28 May 2018.

the soldier skill is very useful...

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 244):

And they will be ready next week!

Also, welcome back to Broderick! Your engine of destruction may have issues with ladders, but he is so good at what he does!

The way I read it, Fit is useful for regaining fatigue from physical activity (running, fighting, etc.), while Recover Energy recovers fatigue spent on casting or maintaining spells.  They don't stack, they do the same thing for different kinds of fatigue.

Also, slorn are Hard to Kill.
This message was last edited by the player at 23:00, Tue 29 May 2018.

True enough.  Fit is meant to recover FP lost to non-supernatural, non-long term effects* and activities.

Fit will recover FP spent marching, fighting, Extra Effort, etc.

* Starvation, dehydration, lack of sleep, etc.


Recover Energy simply speeds up recovery of FP during a rest.  Which means all FP lost which is recoverable via rest (so everything but long-term FP).


That's... that's debatable.  I've allowed them to stack in games I've run, after all, it's usually not that much extra FP being recovered.

And there is nothing that states they don't stack.

they should stack, cos if your fatigue reaches 0 from any event, you need ht rolls to avoid passing out. plus, it's advantageous for mages who rely on their own bodies to power their spells, if you are fit and in good physical shape, you will regain your energy, second-wind, whatever you wanna call it, faster.
This message was last edited by the player at 10:01, Wed 30 May 2018.

Fit will help recovery of non magical/psi FP expenditure.

Recover energy increases the recovery rate for all FP.

Energy reserve recovers without rest and is affected by recover energy.

Best setup is spending half from ER and half from FP as they each recover desperately.

Yes, exactly.



Indeed they do.  ;)


(Autocorrect for the win?)

Umm.... Yeah.  That's it.  Autocorrect.

I converse on another message board with a guy who does contract negotiation for the State Department... his autocorrect really does some weird stuff sometimes (he's put a lot of acronyms into it as 'correct' words).

And he almost never bothers to spellcheck his posts to see what madness his autocorrect has been up to.

Oooohhh, that could make for some interesting contracts ... either unenforceable or un-performable.

Sounds like an interesting plot for a game. Can the PCs figure out the secret message that's been horribly autocorrected?

cryptanalysis rolls +3

Derp.

I've been reading posts here that are IC as being OOC the last few days (maybe the last week?)... so if I've sounded especially stupid, well... I have been.  The antibiotics and congestion meds have made me especially thick headed.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 257):

I will try to be back tomorrow.  Next week I am traveling with my wife, but should be updating most evenings.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 258):

Sorry, not able to post today. Slim chance tomorrow morning, otherwise monday eve.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 259):

Well we just lost the whole back table in the guild group.

that is unfortunate. that's alot of invested time and effort wasted, but it is what it is, i guess.

Oh well, it wasn't because we didn't try ...

Some people only want Orc & Pie, unfortunately gwythaint is serving up a whole heaping city and mega-dungeon and world.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 263):

Yeah, there is more than simply hack and slash...consequence are there too. But there are also different styles, and that might have come into play as well. Sounded like an interesting group of characters though. Would not mind seeing some of their character sheets to get some ideas!

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 264):

There were some really effective builds, but I was trying to set them up with something that needed discovery, otherwise  the organization hiring them wouldn't have needed their help.  Once it got goung they fought a couple of fodder types and then gave up when I responded simply to a request "I tell the demon to smash the pipes and stuff cloth from the dead into them to cause the smoke to back up...meanwhile there are six door with alarm systems to investigate... and the bbeg and his elite minions and theur minions to fight or negotiate with... and I was fully anticipating a switch of allegiance and an attack on their patrons...

Since I'm only running one PC right now, do you need a group to pick back up that plot thread?

"'to protect our cultural institutions' from someone hiring troublemakers not of our kind..."

I take exception to this -- I've probably got as much Sahudese heritage as Akira Kumo No.  Oh, wait, he's referring to Ales and Iskander, I guess.

In reply to Gorgath (msg # 266):

I would need five players. Halfling Alchemist, Halfling Assassin, Leprechaun Demonologist, air infused elven swashbuckler, dwarven musketeer using crossbows (no black powder here)
All are combat optimized.

I think Gorgath meant for another group to form and pick up the pieces where they dropped them.

He did.

they should all like, die.... get found, and word gets back to their merchant employer, so he can void their contracts, and write new ones. sucks they couldn't appreciate the game

If u can find four others I would take another character to play. If I get to choose, if like to be the  halfling rogue or the dwarven musketeer

I've already made and played a dwarven crossbowman (knight) and I'm sure mine was a bit more lethal. I'd be up for a leprechaun wizard or I could play the demonologist.

looks like guild offices has fallen apart (again), too. *sigh*

Considering Broderick just posted... and no one else has yet quit it... that's not yet occurred.
This message was last edited by the player at 08:58, Sun 10 June 2018.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 275):

Let us see if we can bypass our difficulties and profit by further exploration.

Just sharing some nightmare fuel with our GM for the next time Spoders attack!


A mother wolf spider... and her hundreds of young.
http://cdn.historydaily.org/co...fd29cbd964b24404.jpg
This message was last edited by the player at 23:59, Mon 11 June 2018.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 277):

Nice! Be back on Tomorrow, had to finish a bunch of commissions

In reply to Narrator (msg # 278):

was waiting for that orc leader to roll a good reaction roll!

In reply to Narrator (msg # 279):

Lol, sometimes the dice just don't play ball...

In reply to Kirpich Rockson (msg # 280):
and how!

Honesty, sense of duty and code of honor go a long way away from banditry, but in a worse case scenario, they would have impounded your loot and delivered it to the regional governor,  who may or may have not given the orcs any.

In reply to Orc Leader (msg # 282):

But from our perspective, the distinction is very hard to make! We cannot predict what they would do, and we are not particularly trusting at the moment. They would have had to defeat us first before they impounded anything...

In reply to Kirpich Rockson (msg # 283):

This is true.

I am unhappy with the revised rules for unkillable, in 3e "kill it with fire" was always a built in vulnerability,  and they  eliminated that in 4e and allowed only one achilles heel to be specified. (They have 2)

As it stands, they can be b3aten to nothing (I had thought I had unkillable 2 on them before) but that takes a beating of -10ht...three good hits by Jednesa might do it, but they really need HT damage i  sunlight or silver to go. At least they are skeletal, which lets cr damage do double.

That's because Unkillable in 3e came from Werewolf and Vampire, where fire is always 'aggravated damage' which always overcomes 'cannot be killed'.

But really, they're NPCs, don't worry about it, just make it work the way you want it to work.

In reply to Jareth Mooncalled (msg # 285):

I shoulda.

Also, more spoders:
 https://melvynyeo.deviantart.c...pider-nest-749989479

In reply to Narrator (msg # 286):

Yeah, that looks like Clarences friend, only his is 3 ft across!

In reply to Clarence Montague (msg # 287):

Happy Father's Day! See you all tomorrow.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 288):

Oh? In Australia Fathers day is September 2nd...

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 289):

Be back Monday

In reply to Narrator (msg # 290):

I cant believe I just noticed something new (for me) in LT, P98, after all these years.



I guess I should ask what such Basic footwear is, for those such as Gareth and Christine who are concerned about encumbrance. It would seem, given that an ordinary outfit weighs 2 lbs and the most basic footwear weigh at least 1 lb, though shoes, which could be considered basic footwear in most places, weigh 2 lbs on their own, that the weight of the outfits is the worn weight or the equivalent encumbrance they would cause rather the the weight if they were put on the scales, and this factors in the fact that almost all humans are used to wearing them all the time. Would this be a fair assumption?

That's the way I've always read it -- the basic clothes you're wearing don't count against encumbrance, because you're used to wearing those all the time.  That might not be the case for certain versions of barbarians, however, or some non-humans.

On the original question, "basic footwear" in medieval times was more like bedroom slippers than what we'd call shoes today -- in fact, it's a known fact that the way people walked changed pretty abruptly when hard soled shoes became common (17th-18th century).  The common gait shifted from putting the ball of the foot down first, to landing on the heel, once shoes had protection for the heel (indeed, even a built-up heel).

In reply to Gareth (msg # 291):

Well those Maille Bikini's are rather light when made of aluminum ... Faux Fur is light as well.
Same goes for Maille Breech clouts... although they can be cold in the winter.

In reply to Brodak (msg # 293):

The basic footwear is considered DR1 shoes, made of the same thin leather as a leather jacket. I have been researching armor, and DR5 brigandine was massively more common than plate, ( plate is early TL4, brigandine late TL3) and cloth armor in the form of Gambesons was almost universally used, al least as torso and often arm armor. Cuir boli was used by the romans and not much after them.

I may not get much more posting in tonight, was cooking for my kids and claiming pay for commissions for Solar Blades & Cosmic Spells, and tricking lulu into printing a copy of a collaborative game I contributed to...
http://drivethrurpg.com/produc...ungeon-For-Blueholme

is rice a local crop in aral?

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 295):

Rice is grown in southern Valdassya, and imprted from there along with coffee.

Did i misunderstand?

ARethe 'enemy' on the hill or is Gareth raining down fire from upon high?

In reply to Haveron Stormwal (msg # 297):

Gareth is 3/4 the way up the hill on the right (there is a cliff ascending on the left) and he is casting further up and to the northwest at some bandits there. A cloud of gas is descending.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 298):

Is it below or above Gareth? I assumed below...

There's a fairly severe formatting problem in Guild Office Take 2 -- affecting the last two messages, likely a carry over from the one before (Broderick's inquiry about Smasher's damage).  Seems likely to an unclosed formatting tag.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 296):
I see. thanks!

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 301):

I will resolve that tomorrow

https://www.tofugu.com/japan/ashigaru/
some of Sahud's finest

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 303):

Sorry I haven't been posting, work has been quite insane. I should be able to catch up sunday if not sooner.

We do what we must.  Play is important, but keeping the bills paid is more so.

we're your all star cast. we ain't goin' no wheres.

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 306):

Approaching twilight zone myself, so I can't say anything, but will post as we can manage it!

In reply to Christine Bjorn (msg # 307):

Be back tomorrow

Ymid: "Fascinating!" xD

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 309):

Curiosity at -15 as racial trait

it's gettin' "Conananian" in the alley thread. xD

Well, it's that or everyone piles in and we try to subdue him with the weight of our bodies.  As you can see (by the way he's flailing me about like a child), Jareth is an 'ideas' guy, not a wrestler.

Hey, we need to hire a strong competent wrestler, like Grend or Jednesa or Ardenas.  They'd make short work of this fight.

Or actually any 250 point fighter type probably...  ;)

everybody dogpile on the guy bristling with weapons! xD

You leave me out of this.  You got yourselves into that fix...  ;)

In reply to Ardenas Barehand (msg # 314):

Yeah, I think you might be underestimating the effect of all those sharp things sticking out of him...

In reply to Clarence Montague (msg # 315):

Sorry about my reply rate; spent yesterday at the dentist, and today I have a Union action and overtime.


Why y'all trying to hug the porcupine?

Because we don't think killing him A) would work or 2) be the morally appropriate method of dealing with him.

We're going for "Subdue*, remove weapons, and heal".  And then he'll probably get irate that we stripped him of his awesome.


* Without using spells because we ain't got them spells.

i wonder about the quality sword's origin he had, almost as much as the wounded man

You and me both, Chye.  I was astonished how easy he was to disarm -- I thought there would be major resistance.  Seemingly any weapon but his sticks to him.  I'm still pretty much buying Jareth's original theory that it looks like a wish gone wrong.

yeah, he probably wished for great personal "magnetism"... n'yuck n'yuck

In reply to Chye Isuel (msg # 320):

Sorry I haven't  been on. Really shitty day.

If Brodak can hold him against the wall  it should be easy pickings.

Less resistance to disarm because can only all out attack?

In reply to Narrator (msg # 321):

This weekens may be a little sparse for me, as work is odd and I have out of town relatives in. I will post where I can.

Life seems to have become unsettled for us all... no problems.

Aye, it gets the better of all of us but take your time and we'll be around :)

Hope everything gets better! :)

In reply to Haveron Stormwal (msg # 324):

A few more replies to winecellars and I will start a new thread. Be onboarding some fighter types later this week, perhaps if Grimaldi and Sederic are looking for company...

we need a healer and a rouge, to be a well balanced group.

In reply to Grimaldi (msg # 326):

This I know. Those may have to be NPCs, the character onboarding is a knight, with a similar ally. I will build a few, and see where we are at when he is done.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 327):

A warm welcome to Percival and Lord James,
A pair of knights in need of loot.

In reply to Narrator (msg # 328):

Hey there, I'm Percival, aka Percy

deliberately holding up the game, makes me mad..

Ah Lood... we all needz zum...  good da zee zum new markz.

In reply to Oly (msg # 331):

Been a rough couple of days, may onot be able to post today