Guys -  I have just invited WhiskyLogic to join us.

I look forward to meeting him - as I sit sipping a wee dram of Drambuie.  :o)

Greetings and salutations ! :>

Now, what lies has my brother been telling you ?

Hello hello.

Also looking forward to what this guy has to say, though I tend towards a nice bourbon while we wait.

And, no lies from your brother that i know of. . . though he said he might be late to the discussion because he's accepting that nobel prize for bareknuckle boxing. But he said he's taking his helicopter so he'll only be like a day, tops.

I thin Berta  meant me -  well at least the character Wyn who belongs to me.  nd as for the bare knuckle champion -  that would be Berta herself :)

---

As I mentioned in the  last RMail -  we have built a set of characters (you can see the family overview in the Notice thread).  We even got to play them for a while before our GM fell away.  While we would quite like to run those characters  (A lot of thought went into them) we can build something less intense if you want.  The chance to play together, is more important than using Wyn, Berta and Ged.

Even with those characters - the backgrounds (etc) were primarily written to help or RP, rather than to build a setting for a campaign.  We all like rollicking good adventures and I think we were all expecting to be 'away from home' and making or way in the wider world.

We are also happy to have other people in the game -  there is no requirement to have a three player game.  I often find that games with 6-7 players build more interaction opportunities - and give everyone something to think about.

Having said that - if you are GMing - things like that are your call.

Yeah - as JohnB said, we've played in each other's games for many, many, many years (even predating RPoL, which is going back a long way), but never had the opportunity to adventure side by side, but equally happy to play almost anything, and other players more than welcome, but entirely up to you.  :>

I've had E6/E8 explained to me now <grins> and yes, I think we all favour the lower level campaigns, though online gaming is perforce slower paced so takes a lot longer to level - as both player and GM I find it harder going to keep the challenge up at higher levels.

And mine's a rum and coke. %>

I can't actually claim to know these guys before RPoL but we have been in each others' games here since 2002, that I know of.

I heard about E6 back in 2008 and liked the idea very much but I have never had an opportunity to play an E6 (or E8) game yet. I'm looking forward to it, or whatever else we all decide on.  :o)

Hah !  You're right ... August 2002 from my notes !  Met John on PBW (he was there before me) a couple of years earlier than that.  Doesn't time fly ... lucky I took that potion of longevity ! :>

Lol - I was a member of PBW before it became a public site.  I answered an advert from Jim that must have been back in 98 or 99.  I know I was running Galinia at the end of 99, because Jim withdrew the game-background hosting facility in early 2000 and I had to learn how to make a website PDQ.  :)  I think I talked Kevin into playing a crow in that game!

That said - We all play in other games, and have had lots of other people playing in games we have run.

We are flexible and find ways to work with people or else we wouldn't still be here playing :)

Well most of my online predates RPOL, used to do pbem back when that was the thing - since the dice rollers sent the rolls to emails. One of the forums is still up, though not active - went inactive when friends got deployed and stationed out of country simultaneously.

As far as E6/E8 it tends more towards a compromise in the context of theory/practice. Like E6 is how we set out on paper, but the powerlevel just plays out so ... that they'd both work but the little extra bit of OPness means we don't need to replace or come up with new characters all the time.

looking over the other thread did like it. no argument that they're well developed or that a lot went into them. Its just hard to picture jumping into that without something being lost or whole tone changing. After a bit of reading i was gonna say you're way more focused on characters while i tend to focus on more atmosphere and textures and stuff - then i remembered I'm almost always the DM (though totally cool with that).

Due to a few collapses a long time ago (now) i'm usually pretty take-charge with the game intros and forcing some element of unity into the background. Back during PBEM ppl would still disappear, but it just happened less with a more concrete lead-in.

Think the last two ONLINE games i ran went something like this: (massively shortened ambiguous summaries from memory) (usually intros are broken into a 2 post ordeal with the first line being "ooc: tl;dr : skip to second post if you don't care how you got there")

[homebrew 3.0/3.5 lvls 1-12ish]
The PCs were all dwarves from the same city, grew up together, were in the same clan, just came back from an 'adventure' (little more than practice using a bedroll and eating trail rations), are on the brink of becoming adults, and found they're being recruited by the city's almost mythic mage hunting branch. So it was this is where you're from, this is how you came/fit together, this way to fame and fortune.

[future cyberpunkish early savage worlds]
The PCs all grew up in the same block (dredd-style skyscraper apts), same schools, same jobs after, get laid off together, can't find jobs, get a simple job from i guess what shadowrun would call a mr johnson, and are already in the car on the way there. It was like ok this is where you came from, this is where you are, you're already on the way somewhere, who is driving who is passenger who is back seat, lead with your character intro - go.

as i read my post all i see is:

TL;DR: something new sounds cool

Don't mean to sound so, how i'm reading that as. But that is sorta where i'm going with this i think. I've no problem with most commercial settings, doing something new based on some agreed influence, or whatever.

Setting-wise i'm pretty open to ideas and working something out. In any 3.5 dnd though, E8 is the direction i'd like to go.

Ah, we come ready made with our own background so can happily "fetch up in some far away town" - we purposefully worked the background so that our family ties were pretty much cut - provide the bonding for our characters, but allow us to literally pick up anywhere - ubiquitous tavern (nothing wrong with that), poster advertising for adventurers/mercenaries - we'll know how we got there.  So whatever path you wish to take as GM, we're on it and happy to team up with other chars if you're looking for a wider player base.  We'll play nice. <grins>

E8 ... it'll be a loong time before we hit such heady heights (assuming we survive the adventures in between), and none of us have a problem with a limit on progression or revisiting things as needed for game balance.

System /setting - we were looking at 3.5 (or 3.0) as we're pretty much agreed we like the skills rules to add a bit of flavour to characters, but fairly flexible here too - Greyhawk, FR, any not-too-far-from-canon homebrew ... not Eberron (too far removed).  2nd level for preference, as that fits our builds (we all ended up multiclass - covering the bases on the basis that we might be the only three players), though if you'll allow the 3.0 optional rules for multiclassing at first level <grabs 3.0 DMG, flicks through ... ah, that's p40-41) with primary and secondary classes, we could cobble something together.  :>

Kevin/John, are you both happy with the idea of an E8 game? i.e. level progression basically stops at character level 8, which puts a cap on spell levels and probably rules out prestige classes, etc. (Note that Raise Dead is a 5th level spell.) You've both noted that it would be years before we get to 8th level anyway, so I assume you are both happy to play in that system. I certainly am.

WhiskeyLogic, how would that work for the multiclass characters we have created? I assume E8 means spells up to 4th level are available in the game but if my character got to Ranger 4 / Sorcerer 4 he would only be able to learn 2nd level spells, although scrolls / wands up to 4th level spells would still be available in that game system?

Obviously we are looking for a medieval fantasy setting such as Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, etc., rather than a modern or futuristic setting.

D&D 3.5  E8 is fine with me.   There are some basic progression rules for past L8 - but things slow down dramatically.  As for Raise Dead being a 5th level spell, I am sure WhiskyLogic can find a way to work around that if he thinks that he needs to.

Just about any fairly traditional setting works for me.  I don't know any of the formal settings, because all of my games are run in worlds that I build.

As Kevin said, the character backgrounds are designed to be left behind us as the characters move out into the world.  All those names and places are to give us something consistent to bring out in conversation -  I don't think any of us really expect to see any of them again.  It is just our version of 'Dwarves from the same city' or 'Kids from the same block'.

I do the same sort of thing for any character I get into.  One character background expanded so much that it became a significant part of my 2nd Ed world.

Personally, I would rather stick with the L2 characters rather than try and rebuild multi-class at L1.  That still gives us loads of levels to play with (even in E8).  But I will go with whatever WhiskyLogic decides.

Fighter 4/Rogue 4 multiclass not really affected, except BAB and HP (assumedly) top out, so I'm game.

Robin - you could go Ranger 2/Sorceror 6 - really only sacrificing +1 BAB, Endurance Feat and Animal Companion, for those third level spells.  And I've only once seen Raise Dead used in a campaign (yours !), so again, not a problem.

And yes ... I can gleefully confirm that John does extensive background checks on all his characters.  Though in my game I did manage to kill off all but one of his extended family ... <grrrins>

Ahhh.  I haven't shown you the next couple of hundred generations then?

Personally, I don't know how Wyn will develop yet, but it probably won't be 4/4.  One way or another, he will be able to patch his sibs up a bit, when those two bloody nutters get themselves hurt.  No self control those two ....

"You take that back or I'll ... !"

Ah ... good point. ;>

Yeah i just mentioned the futuristic because it was one of last ones i ran. Am looking for something in a greyhawk or realms-type setting - actually forgotten realms sounds pretty solid. I have the obligatory homebrew that every single dm ever feels he has to have, and its fairly fleshed out- but mostly on paper. Soooooo, the realms are looking good.

And as far as how spells over 4th level work it goes something like this: they don't, except as naturally occurring ...  from say a sufficiently aged dragon, or a titan, or pit fiend, or deva, or or or... so 'generally' out-of-reach artifact-level rare.

The part of that most people don't think of at first is that it also extends to magical item creation. Items in these games are generally thought of as magical or non magical, because in an E8 game any item that needs more than caster level 8 is unmakable (since no one can be higher than level 8).

. . .
If we're open to dropping the characters somewhere in the realms for instance and you guys are open to a few background tweaks to fit that, then I'm open to keeping the general flavor and 'character' of the characters. Though we might not be able to concretely track what their tenth generation grandfather's cousin's on his wife's side's neighbor did. . . I think we could keep most of the rest.

The only exception is something like this:

http://www.myth-weavers.com/wi..._Spell_%28E6_Feat%29

I generally don't allow that feat, since the two extra levels over E6 give casters so much of an increase in power level. That being said the only exception has been something like raise and teleport, but i usually attach a requirement like Cleric8 or Wiz8/Sorc8.

One i do allow is taken from some of the original E6 discussion threads and the original pre epic handbook epic suggestions at the end of the FRCS. Goes something like this:

Archmage
Prerequisite: Expanded Casting, Expanded Knowledge,
Benefit: You gain a single (1) 5th level spell slot; this does not grant the ability to learn a 5th level spell. It may, as usual, be used to cast a spell of lower level (including those modified by metamagic feats). You do not gain bonus 5th level spell slots for high ability scores.
Special: This feat may taken once./This feat may be taken twice.

Expanded Casting
Prerequisite: Level 8th
Benefit: Choose a spellcasting class in which you have levels. You gain an additional spell slot of the highest level currently available to you from that class.
Special: This feat may be taken more than once.

Expanded Knowledge
Prerequisite: Level 8th
Benefit: Choose a spellcasting class in which you have levels. You gain an additional spell known from that class's spell list at any level you can cast.
Special: This feat may be taken more than once.


The exact prereqs and how many times they can be taken always depends on the campaign, little less with a single caster or more with several casters, thats about as far outside of lvl4 spells as we usually go. But it goes like that with certain feats. Balances and stuff.

Actually I like the idea of a low magic game - as WhiskyLogic says, that extends to magic item creation as well as spells - be a bit more realistic.  I'm in ! :>

Of course, I'm the only non-spellcaster, so I may be biased ! <grins>

*grin*  I am happy with E8.  Warts and all.

I  will have a look at the backgrounds (at some point) and see if anything needs trimming for E8.  I don't think it will because we tried to be generic as far as descriptons went.  There might be an illustrative level  buried in some of the descriptions, but I can  dig those out if needed.

As for locations, I don't think the backgrounds specify any particular cities or countries.  They certainly didn't have named cities initially, but they may have been tweaked in the days of TS and Hizzle.

I might need to re-think Wyn's god -  but again -  that is no biggie.

Yes, I had realised the limitations on item creation but just forgot to mention it in my post. Doesn't put me off at all.

I'm not worried about whether my character will be limited to casting 2nd or 3rd level spells either. I don't know yet whether he will turn out to be a ranger who casts a few spells or a sorcerer who uses a bow when he doesn't have a better spell to cast. I'll see what role he ends up playing in the game.

I'm quite happy with the idea of an E8 game.

Forgotten Realms would be good. I don't know all that much about it yet but I did start reading up on it a bit because the other game we started playing these characters in was set in the Realms. Our family home was going to be in Yhaunn, which is Sembia’s port on the Dragon Reach, so we should be able to fit in anywhere in a Forgotten Realms game easily.

We had thought out a fairly extensive family history for that previous game but we didn't want to put off a potential DM with that much baggage. So, we can either keep that hidden on a back shelf somewhere for future reference or put it up for you to read at your leisure, whichever you prefer.

All good to hear.

Addressing E8,
yeah E8 lets magic items be toned down enough to balance a lot really quickly, and makes that random odd special material masterwork item (or alchemical oddity) that someone has held onto since the campaign started much more significant. And there's not really many warts on E8, there is the occasional feat that is just too good on its own but most stuff was fixed by (late) 3.5 errata.

The Realms,
just because they're from somewhere doesn't mean they're there now and

Lost my train of thought, can't.... brain good, without coffee. Gonna crack out the old FRCS tomorrow and go from there.


Other thing, I usually try to keep it rules light-ish and let the PCs RP out most things, which with 3.5 is either easily doable or a nightmare and FRCS doubles the available books. With 3.5 my standard is something like "allowed source books are PHB, DMG, Spell Compendium, Magic Item Compendium, (Rules Compendium if rules lawyers/munchkin present), + each player may (communally) add a book to this list from the Complete series" and end up with like 10 books max, but with The realms it explodes super wide open. I don't mind a like 12-15 sourcebook list, especially for realms, and usually look for player input completing the list.

You guys' half of the list would need to talk out amongst yourselves. (tome of magic, unearthed arcana*, PHB2, DMG2, Savage Species - are all NOs)

I'm thinking for DM's 'half': PHB, DMG, Spell Compendium, Magic Item Compendium, FRCS, Players guide to Faerun, and like one more i know i'm forgetting.

*=the only thing i never had a problem allowing was weapon group feats; http://www.d20srd.org/srd/vari...weaponGroupFeats.htm

*grins* -  I don't have any 3.5 books at all - so I work from the SRD.  But I tend to stick to the basics anyeay.