It is an ancient thing: the rivalry between various styles of unarmed combat. They are both bound together and fiercely jealous of their status. In a remote but ancient village that was once a great city, representatives of various arts meet to display their skill.

The fight will take place on an ancient stone platform 10 yards across and 1 yard high. Each player will build a 200 point contender using the character templates from martial arts with a cinematic lens added. The Contender template is highly recommended, but Monk is a strong option for those who want better chi abilities, And Duelist has high DX. Some others may also be appropriate. Student and Instructor are not options, as they are not the proper point range.

You must of course, pick a style, and it will be an unarmed one.

the battle will begin on opposite sides of the platform, to sound of a gong. Contenders may be eliminated via unconsciousness, tapping out, or leaving the platform.

Most cinematic options are available, though innate attacks are not. Spending FP for extra effort is most certainly in. Technical Grappling is not in play.

As a general rule, traits than can be bought in martial arts (with the exception of innate attacks) are valid. The extra options in chapter 4 of martial arts are in play (except for "matter of inches", limiting dodges, Harsh realism for unarmed fighters, and all of Realistic Injury except for new hit locations)

Everyone is considered to have Hard to kill +3 for free.
This message was last edited by the GM at 13:18, Thu 18 Oct 2018.

Our first fight pitted Lane Webber III, practicing Kyokushin Karate, against Demchugdongrub, who is trained in Smasha.

The fight was quick. Demchugdongrub quickly blinded his opponent, then crippled his foot and knocked him cold with a mighty blow to the head. Weber will take quite some time to recover from his injuries.

There was an edit back on the 4th, changing the ring out rule from a break to a loss. I did not announce that as I should, and possibly we should revert it. Its also an option to build new characters to take advantage of lessons learned. It may also be a good time to make the 50 points spent on the style more flexible.



That's a good thing to consider. I was going to have it be played out without any will rolls: if you think you don't have a chance and you've lost, you can tap out. Does anyone have other ideas?

If people* want to be able to force a 'tap out', I'd say Will rolls every time some one takes significant damage† once below 0 HP, or in the face of any over the top pain (Limb Lock on a Crippled Limb), a submission hold when some one has been Blinded, when two or more limbs/hands/feet/sense organs‡ are crippled, etc.

I'd also toss some penalties and bonuses like:  -1 for every multiple of HT they're below 0 HP, -1 for being below 1/2 FP, +1 if their foe has taken more injury than they have, +1 if they're above 0 HP, +1 if their foe is below 1/2 FP and they aren't.  High Pain Threshold's +4 is clearly significant.



* By which I mean every one participating in the tourney.
† Half HP or more in one turn.
‡ Eyes and ears.  Each pair only counts once, so if an eye is plucked and then the second eye get's blinded I wouldn't force a Will roll.  But if one eye is plucked and then their hand gets mangled, Will roll time.  Okay, I guess if someone get's their tongue ripped out, I'd count that as well.

Derrick, the Extra Effort in Combat optional rules in play?  I'd suspect they are, but they are optional so I thought I'd ask and make sure before spelling them out for people.

Yes, as stated in the Opening post of this thread:


I try to post switches and optional rules in the first post of the thread.

You know, I should really learn to read one day.  (I swear I reread the first several times and missed that end line every time)

Posting it here as it carries across the other Martial Arts Style Competitions:

Arm/Wrist Lock does not require the arm or wrist of the foe to be directly involved in the attack.  It may be performed following any melee attack so long as three conditions are met:

1) A barehanded Judo or Wrestling parry was performed, 2) two hands are free, and 3) the foe is still within 1 yard.

I have updated the opening post to include a ruling made in the character creation thread two weeks ago:



This is not a new rule or ruling, just increased visibility of an existing one.

Our second fight pitted Baogang, practicing Tia Chi Chuan, against Pingbi a shaolin monk.

The fight was slow, and both sides struggled to overcome the defenses of the others. A few engagements ended indecisively. Pingbi eventually conceded, concluding he was unable to defeat his foe.

This fight has shown grappling by itself is not enough to win this competition: you can't use grappling parries while grappling, and grappling struggles to overwhelm a foe quickly. It also requires Strength to avoid break free attempts, something pingbi lacked.

This is true.  You also require ST to leverage your grappling.


This isn't necessarily true.  I have a wrestler in a DF game that rapidly overwhelms her foes... however she has a ST of 30 and simply rips limbs off people.  That's a bit over the top for this competition (and not possible with chargen rules).

Now, for this tourney a more modest ST (say 14-16) is better and would have had Ping maintaining his armlocks and slowly crippling limbs.  But that's because you're using Arm Lock.

If you want a low ST* martial artist to deal out fast incapacitating damage you have two routes:  Luck or better chi (like Pressure Secrets, Lethal Strike/Kick, etc).


* Anything less than 19.  Unless you're using the optional Rounding Damage Dice rules, then a lower ST can hit multiple dice a bit faster.

Looking at building a fighter and I had question...


With the above in mind... what about the Optional Traits in a Style?  Are they considered appropriate Advantages buyable with Template Advantage points or can they only be picked up via the Style points?

Followup Question:  Can two styles be taken?  For instance Kachin Bando is often taken after learning Lethwei.


[EDIT]
Never mind.  Had nothing better to do tonight so I built a Hung Gar Kung Fu master...  he's in the Character Building thread for Derrick to approve.
[/EDIT]
This message was last edited by the GM at 08:19, Sat 24 Nov 2018.

Optional traits don't have an official status, which is sad, because there are some very nice toys in there (for example, shaolin has combat reflexes). It may be nice to include them at some point, but I don't know that now is the time.

This tournament is about style vs. style, so I'd say stick to one style.

What Templates and Lenses is everyone using?

Master Mu Kao is built on Contender and Tough Guy.

In reply to evileeyore (msg # 14):

Contender (Cinematic)

I check templates when approving characters. Everyone but Mu Kao and Pingbi were contender (cinematic). Pingbi was a Monk (cinematic).

Then I have to ask, where is Baogang picking up Combat Reflexes from?  It's not on Contender or it's Lenses.

Ugg. I always take less time checking reworks of previously approved characters, and it always bites me. People seem to struggle to follow a template when revising rather than building. And I must have been tired, because there are errors in several places.

Combat Reflexes just jumped out at me as I struggled (and failed) to find a way to get it on Master Mu.  So few Martial Arts templates offer it.




Second question, Derrick, you keep saying this:

"They start out one yard in from the edge of the stone platform, on opposite sides. the platform is 10 yards across, so they are 8 yards apart."

But if they are 8 yards apart, this means they are standing on the ring's edge, not one yard in.  So are we one yard in (and thus 6 yards apart), or 8 yards apart (and thus on the edge)?

6 yards apart:
https://i.imgur.com/RVB8Rsr.png

8 yards apart:
https://i.imgur.com/ETnjIfM.png

I'm measuring from center to rim, and from center to center. What are these "Hexagons" you keep talking about?

The 'space' where someone is standing?  The area they occupy?  Not being 2 dimensional paper mens?

But sure, you're not using 'hexes', so for those of us that Think In Hexes, it would look like this:

https://i.imgur.com/MOYRgef.png

But you are probably imagining it like this:

https://i.imgur.com/CM0xjNS.png

Yes, that's essentially the situation.

Pulling this conversation out to here:

Derrick:  I'd like a ruling on the +4 to hit from AOA (Determined) being applied to Kiai.  There's arguments back and forth on this one.  But AOA (D) says to 'hit' not to 'skill'.


I've spent a few hours scouring the foruns and the rule books and the only things I can find to support either 'yea' or 'nay' is Martial Arts stating that AOA(D) Feints get the +4.  Which is a nebulous 'can go either way'.

And, Basic states that Evaluate and Move and Attack affect 'skill', not 'to hit'.


My house rulings on it of 'nay' are based on this post years back:

http://forums.sjgames.com/show...9813&postcount=5

I also shot Kromm* a pm last night and asked him.  This was his response:









* That's Sean Punch line editor of GURPS and author a lot of GURPS books for those that don't hang out on the SGJ Gurps forums.

some form of all-out attack giving Kiai a +2 does sound about right. +4 feels overwhelming, but no bonus also feels a bit wrong. I'm not sure if all out attack (strong) is a better option than determined though.

Ok, the ruling is that All out Attack (Determined) and All out attack (strong) both give the Kiai user a +2 in the quick contest. Remember the rule of 16!

Who is still in the competition? and who is waiting on the other guy to attack? Its january, and the holiday break should be over!

Master Mu is waiting for Demchug to stop teetering on the edge and get back into the fight.... but to be fair to Nicole she might not realize that Denchug didn't ring out.  If my maths were correct (can you pop in there and verify my calculation?).
This message was last edited by the GM at 18:15, Mon 07 Jan 2019.

Made my post for the Baogang vs Lane fight just now. Sorry for dropping off the face of the Earth a bit.

Also question! If I have two attacks and my first is a committed attack, can I also make a Defensive Attack with my second to mitigate the penalty of the Committed Attack somewhat?

No, Defensive attack and committed attack are maneuvers, and you only have one maneuver. In order to attack you need to make a maneuver with "attack" in its name. (Though "Feint" is a weird edge case).

Okay. Can I still do a deceptive committed attack?

Yes, you can. please redo your second attack. As a note, you cannot "Parry" as an attack.

I wasn't parrying as an attack. I was parrying as an Active Defense against Lane's kick, then doing my first attack once that parry succeeded. I haven't made a second attack yet.