Where we test out Syntactic magic in fights against each other.

We need a template, and a starting scenario.

I'm thinking the point value ought to be rather high: 300 points or so. I don't think we have a template sitting around. Things we should consider:

Should we have Energy reserves, and if so, how much? 10 ER each?

Are we using verb-nouns or are we using realms? If realms, how are we dividing up the universe?

What is our view on just beating the crap out of the other guy with a piece of iron?

Well, lets try different scenarios.

1) Each mage has 17 IQ
2) Realm based magic (for power level) using that realm's 'skill' to cast spells (complexity)
->advantage for raw power, skill for finesse
3) 1x Level 4 Realm
   2x Level 3 Realm
   4x level 1-2 Realms

4) Realms are a 'conceptual realm', let's not restrict these. So for example "Forces" could be one, or "storm" could be one. Or "life" or "body". Just be creative.

5) Each wizard has an energy reserve of 20ER + HT

6) 150 additional CPs to flesh out the character, and set the skill level, other advantages that are not 'directly' magic related (i.e. you can't take Regeneration(Magical Mana)

Lets try to make a fleshed out character rather than an optimised killing machine and see how magic pairs off against itself.

7) I'd be prepared to use wands/staffs as 'foci', these would have to be bought somehow with points, but may instil a +1-10 bonus on skill, usually they're aspected though. Wands will be done on a case by case basis.

8) I would argue that 'instant casting' of any spell (1 round, or blocking) would be -8 for 1 round -10 for instant



Scenarios include:

 - 1 mage vs 1 mage
 - 1-3 mages vs a horde (how long can you survive)



My goal is to have them as relatively high level wizards. In my game there are aspects to the level of magery. Studied academic magic (traditional magic system), syntactic system (RPM) (sorcerer type stuff) and then when you attain arch-mage levels you get the Realm based, which is pretty epic in scope.

The master and grandmaster/arch mages of my world, are actually extraordinarily powerful just because of the scope and liberty they have with magic. This game is aimed at putting two of that level at odds and making it both interesting, cinematic and not a "1 trick wins all fights".

Re: Beating up with Iron.

Consider the following:

 - realm 4 Air
 - realm 3 Prime(metamagic)/ 3 body
 - bleh rest don't matter.
 - Skill 25 (with wand)

 - a squad of armed heavy infantry charge at the wizard.

 - he defends himself, noting that they have a good 10-15 yards to run at him, giving him chance to spend a few rounds casting.

 - -8 for 1 round cast. He's using forces level 4 (vulgar and gross manipulation) -4 ER
 - rolls skill 17 to force a huge gust of wind at the oncoming enemy.
 - rolls 10 (pass by 7), and causes a hurricane level force to be blasted at the enemy force, launching them away from him.

Note: 1 single blast is a low complexity spell, so no additional modifiers to the skill level. If he wanted to only affect one in every 2 men, it might add another penalty, if he wanted to make it a whirlwind, it might add another -1/-2 or something.


The 'fine details' have to be managed by GM/player in a negotiation of cost.



Also, as noted, the magic is 'supposed' to be powerful and quite epic in its scope.

Ok, so each realm is probably sized for 30 points, about the size of a college of magic. I'm not quite sure what realm levels you're using in this case: could you explain what each level can do? I'm not seeing them in the thaumatology book.

Looking at the general point values:
140 points in IQ,
90 or so points in ER (or does the +HT mean we're just remembering FP?)
150 points of standard character

for a total of 380. does that sound right? do you mind if we raise it to 400?


If you wish, we can set the wizard to three tests:

1) a duel with another wizard over access to a ruined tower on a hill. The hill has one path to the top. The ruined tower has a library spread over four levels, out of seven total (two underground). The tower contains a book that both wizards seek. Get the book, win the encounter
2) an attack from a Monster Hunters warrior (400 points). Fight breaks out in a palace during a royal ball.
3) Fend off 20 warriors with ST 11 DX 11 IQ 10 HT 10, one main weapon at 14, and others at 12. Fight starts with soldiers at either end of a 30 yard narrow city street with the wizard in the middle. more guards may be called in until the wizard hides or escapes the city successfully.

Magic would be broken down into 10pts per level up to 6.

1 - 3 The mage has understood the basic principles of his tradition. He can use the simplest types of magick, and has reached some self-knowledge. To advance further, he must overcome himself more and more. Many mages change demeanours during their seeking towards the next levels. Many mages never manage to rise above this level, and remain as lesser mages.

4 - 5 The mage apparently masters the external world. Many mages think they have reached a deep understanding of themselves. Most mages on this level have risen far into the ranks of their tradition. The seeking has become very hard, as the mage must not only overcome the flaws of his nature (note the elegant bind here: if the mage roleplays his nature, complete with flaws, he will be awarded more willpower and experience. But if he tries to overcome his flaws, he will not gain this. It is tempting to step off the path.) To raise Arete on this level, the quests can take years.


5 - 6 The mage has mastered his tradition (maybe not in knowledge, but in understanding). He is powerful, and apparently at the height of his power. Many mages on this level are leaders of their traditions. But he will begin to see the flaws, inconsistencies and outright errors of his tradition too. To continue the path, he must take the painful step away from his tradition, losing the support and help it once gave. This may take a lifetime. Many mages never do this, and remain here, trying to lead their traditions. This is probably as far as roleplaying is possible, the later levels are too hard to imagine.

Anything past 6 is perhaps theoretical

6 - 7 The mage has left his tradition, and probably changed his nature as well. These mages are outside the protection and support of the traditions, and their vision is almost impossible to understand even for other mages. Most retreat into the Umbra to escape the Ascension War. Some mages try to find the Oracles to perfect their magick. Others try to find themselves. To continue, the mage must transcend his limited view of the world and/or himself, experiencing a second Awakening. This can take several centuries to do. Many mages prefer to remain on this level, finding pleasure in their power or self-knowledge. 7 - 8 This is the level of the Oracles. They have realized that their old ideas about the spheres work was just another arbitrary way to look at reality. They are able to freely choose they way they like to see magick; in the same way a lesser mage can change reality by viewing it in an arbitrary way, an Oracle can change the way they (or anybody else) see magick. Thus they transcend spheric magick, being able to use magick in any way they want. this can take thousands of years. Many Oracles prefer to remain Oracles, but a few tries to understand the world even further. 9 - 10 These levels are so high that maybe only the most advanced Oracles can even begin


 A lot of the 'power level' comes from Power levels in Mage:The Ascension in World of Darkness.

1 -> Sense and awareness
2 -> minor manipulation
3 -> manipulation
4 -> gross/strong manipulation, minor creation
5 -> major creation
6 -> mastery

I'm willing to go with any number of points, really. I would imagine that characters at the 4-6 level would hit the 300+ mark in terms of character points anyway.

1) Yes, that sounds perfect

2) All good too, though the setting would be fantasy in my game world, rather than contemporary. Though, the warrior could be modified. I would expect that the Mage would win this, however, I'd find it hard to build a 400pt warrior that was not somehow 'supernaturally enhanced'. Though there are 'agents' of the mages that are trained for war/battle/more physical aspects of the order. This could be an example of that - though these two would have magic abilities.

3) Yes, that's fine too. I expect here the mage would also win.


These all sound great.

Oh, my point count didn't include the realm magic advantages. So we're looking at another:

40 points for 1 level 4
60 points for 2 level 3's
40 points for 2 level 2's
20 points for 2 level 1's

that's a total of 160 points, which makes the base mage a 540 point character, not a 380 point character.

Lets start making the characters! I'll be making a mage and the MH warrior.

Are illusion and gates (as in dimensional gates) valid categories?

I would suggest that 'Correspondance' be a realm. and that's about Teleporting, ad moving around. If you could have something like

level 4+ of an element and at least level 3 in correspondence, then you could prob make a gate to an elemental plane of some kind.

Ribald is considered to be an archmage of some distinction, and has had many tales told about  him. Many people suggest that all of the frequent storms affronting the northern terrirtories are his doing, whether in his own experiments or just the weather being the purest manifest of his will and state of mind.

His position within the order, is Primarch of the 8th order and acts as second in command to the grandmaster that oversees the 8th's operations. To date there has been no known magical practitioner more adept at controlling nature's raw power.

Of particular note was his defence of Thelos city against an invasion fleet of nearly a thousand troop ships, where he conjured a hurricane so large that the fleet was almost eradicated to a ship.

Personally, the man reveals a calm demeanour who is quick witted, quick to humour and charming in a most disarming way. Though some say that when his fury is roused, it's perhaps more intimidating than the front of an incoming  thundercloud.


Name: Ribald Periwinkle
Role: Archmage of the Storm, Stormlord

ST: 10
DX: 12
IQ: 17
HT: 14

Advantages:

Attractive [4]
Charisma [5]
Reputation 4 [20] (StormLOrd)
RAnk 7 [35] // Archmage, 2nd in command of 8th Order.

Magic:
 Magery 5 [55] (// is it worth having this?, like a Talent for 'magic', also might say 'what is the highest level one can attain in realm)
 Realm - 4 Storms/Weather
 Realm - 3 Meta/Prime (Meta-magic)
 Realm - 3 Matter
 Realm - 2 Body
 Realm - 1 Correspondance
 Realm - 1 Mind

Combat Reflexes [15]


Skills: // I think [20] points in a single skill for an archmagi/grandmaster might actually be quite low, but I guess it's spread a lot of points over a lot of realms, so maybe within the possiblity

Thaumatology (VH/IQ) [20] - 17+4 +5 = 26

Realm (Storm) (VH/Will) [20] - 26
Realm (Prime) (VH/Will) [16] - 25
Realm (Matter) (VH/Will) [16] - 25
Realm (Bod) (VH/Will) [12] - 24
Realm (Correspondance) [4] - 22
Realm (Mind)           [4] - 22

Riding [8] - 14
Fast-talk [4] - 20
Indimidation [4] - 18
Public Affairs [2] - 18
Soldier [1] - 16
Tactics [1] - 15
Strategy [1] - 15

Knife [2] - 13
Staff [2] - 12

Innate Attack(Projectile) [12] - 16


Items:

Wand: - Made from shipwrecked Yew, cored with quicksilver and base-tipped with dragonscale (silver).

Grants +3 bonus to spells, +5 to spells involving Storms.

Is an 'artefact' known as "Stormweaver".



OOC: This is a first draft of the character. The other mage doesn't have to be the same at all, you can up or lower some skills depending on what you think he might have. I appreciate the character is very powerful, but that is what we're going for here.

I didn't fully 'flesh out' all his skills or backstory, but this gives a good template , I think.
This message was last updated by the player at 16:55, Wed 22 Apr 2020.

Did you give up already?

I'd take suggestions, if you think it's a little overboard.

no, I'm working on it. I might run the warriors first.

I'm thinking my contender will have light as a major realm (for illusions mostly). I'm debating if your version of correspondence is worth it.

I might work up the warrior first

Umm... thats a 268 points of non-magical character, not counting the magery. How are you counting to 150?

I've got the character, and I've got a slightly cheaper build than yours for him.

KRD

Correspondance 4
Mind 3
Light 3
Prime 2
Sound 2
Air 1
Earth 1

KRD is a worldwalker, a member of an order dedicated to exploring the world in all of its glory. His top three realms are dedicated to this: Mind to read and speak languages, Correspondance to travel all over the world, and Light to blend his appearance with that of the natives. He loves to see the stories and cusine of places all over the world.

KRD varies his name to fit the culture he is in, but always keeps the three core letters, or local approximations of them.

I had these as a start for his non-magical skills:

Diplomacy [2]
Fast talk [2]
Acting [2]
Saviore-Faire [2]
Public Speaking [1]
Carousing [1]
Disguise [2]
Streetwise [2]
Pyschology [2]
Merchant [2]
Artist (light) [4]

connisour (theater) [4]
connisour (cusine) [2]
Dancing [2]
area knowledge (Alethkar) [1]
area knowledge (Rohan) [1]
area knowledge (Ixalan) [1]

Current Affairs [2]

Naturalist [4]
Hiking [1]
Riding [1]

Honestly? I just really ignored the point costs of things that weren't relevant to conflict.
So rank, in any real effect (for the purposes of the duel) will not be useful at all. In a real-world context it  might add some bonus to intimidation, perhaps?


so far the build looks good. He would also (unless from another kingdom) be part of the order too, perhaps a different division though.

So far it looks good - the magical realms will be interesting. I particularly like 'Artist' for creating awesome illusions :)

So what is the actual point cost we're using for the "non-magic" part? You're still far over.

These characters are looking much closer to 700 points than to 400. Explains why you didn't think the 400 point warrior at close quarters would be much of a threat.

Well that may be so, but none of the 'extra' points actually make a difference in the fight.

Like having an extra 35 points in Rank, ultimately are just 'character flavour' and could just as well be 0 points.

The skills and the non-flavour advantages/stats come to around 500. Which I think is fine. Rank, attractiveness/charisma/reputation/etc. are all just essentially irrelevant.

As long as we keep the 'rough' skill of the character at magic the same, I am pretty much open to anything else. Let him be a bit stronger, or healthier, or more dextrous. I'd rather have a flavoured character than 2 identical mages.

I think in short, it doesn't matter so much. We could try another scenario where it's the "same mage" fighting a mirror version of himself (perhals with different spheres) but for now, I just would like to try something 'roughly equal in power' (in concept rather than precise numbers)

If you need a precise number. Say aim for 510 points + add anything that is 'flavourful' for free.

I made our "courtly challenger"

He's based on the MH warrior, though the wildcard skill has been broken up to give him greater skill with his main weapon. He's built to tackle big monsters and mages. He's not the brighest bulb, and he's something of an arrogant prick

Yarrilan Beast-Bane

ST 15 [50]
DX 15 [100]
IQ 10 [0]
HT 14 [40]

HP 20 [30]
Will 14 [20]
Per 12 [10]
FP 14 [0]

Combat Reflexes [15]
High Pain Threshold [15]
Weapon Master (All Weapons) [45]
Magic Resistance 5 [10]
Ambidexterity [5]
Destiny 3 [15]
Fit [5]
weapon bond (family sword)

Soldier Talent 1 [5]

OPH (will not stand an insult) [-5]
Overconfidence [-5]
Sense of Duty (Noble House) [-5]
Gullible [-5]
Code of Honor (Knightly) [-5]
Insomniac (mild) [-10]
Bully [-5]

broadsword - 22 [28]
shield - 16 [2]
spear - 15 [2]
Fast Draw (sword) - 17 [4]
knife - 16 [2]
thrown weapon (knife) -16 [2]
fast draw (knife) -16 [2]
Polearm -15 [2]
two handed Sword - 16 [4]

Karate -15 [4]
Judo -15 [4]
Bow - 16 [4]
crossbow -16 [2]

Physiology (Winged Monsters) -10 [4]
Thaumatology - 9 [4]
Occultism - 11 [4]

First Aid -11 [2]
Parry Missile Weapons -15 [4]
Blind Fighting -11 [4]

Climbing -15 [2]
Stealth - 15 [2]
Soldier - 12 [4]
Tactics -11 [4]
Fast-Draw (arrow) -16 [2]

He's a beast!
 I like it.

How is the polished version of Ribald Periwinkle coming? with disads and proper accounting? I'd like a version that marks what's considered "Fluff" and has a firm point total.

I'll get it finished later today

I included the cost of everything 'pertinent to the fight' and it comes to 517cps - which actually is kind of inline what you'd expect a character of this level to be. I think in a real game world he'd probably have another 100cps or so tied up in things like 'contacts' 'wealth' 'etc' but these things can be omitted because he's more of a 'free and liberal roamer' than someone who would set up shop in a mage tower collecting wealth and things. So it doesn't matter. So here he is, finished.


Ribald is considered to be an archmage of some distinction, and has had many tales told about  him.
 Many people suggest that all of the frequent storms affronting the northern terrirtories are his doing, whether in his own experiments or just the weather being the purest manifest of his will and state of mind.

His position within the order, is Primarch of the 8th order and acts as second in command to the grandmaster that oversees the 8th's operations.
 To date there has been no known magical practitioner more adept at controlling nature's raw power.

Of particular note was his defence of Thelos city against an invasion fleet of nearly a thousand troop ships, where he conjured a hurricane so large that the fleet was almost eradicated to a ship.

Personally, the man reveals a calm demeanour who is quick witted, quick to humour and charming in a most disarming way.
 Though some say that when his fury is roused, it's perhaps more intimidating than the front of an incoming  thundercloud.


Name: Ribald Periwinkle
Role: Archmage of the Storm, Stormlord

total cps: 40+140 + 40 + 36 + 15 + 130 + 40+32+12+8+12+8+4 = 517
ST: 10
DX: 12
IQ: 17
HT: 14

Advantages:

Attractive [4]
Charisma [5]
Reputation 4 [20] (StormLOrd)
RAnk 7 [35] // Archmage, 2nd in command of 8th Order.
ER 15 [36](magic only -20%)

Magic:
  Magery 5 [55] (// is it worth having this?, like a Talent for 'magic',
 also might say 'what is the highest level one can attain in realm)
 Realm - 4 Storms/Weather
 Realm - 3 Meta/Prime (Meta-magic)
 Realm - 3 Matter
 Realm - 2 Body
 Realm - 1 Correspondance
 Realm - 1 Mind

Combat Reflexes [15]


Skills: // I think [20] points in a single skill for an archmagi/grandmaster might actually be quite low,
but I guess it's spread a lot of points over a lot of realms, so maybe within the possiblity
Skills
Thaumatology (VH/IQ) [20] - 17+4 +5 = 26
history [1] - 16
Area Knowledge(current kingdom) [1] - 17

Realm (Storm) (VH/Will) [20] - 26
Realm (Prime) (VH/Will) [16] - 25
Realm (Matter) (VH/Will) [16] - 25
Realm (Body) (VH/Will) [12] - 24
Realm (Correspondance) [4] - 22
Realm (Mind)           [4] - 22
Innate Attack(Projectile) [12] - 16
Innate Attack(Beam) [8]   - 15


Riding [8] - 14
Fast-talk [4] - 20
Diplomacy [1] - 15
Indimidation [4] - 18
Current Affairs [2] - 18
Soldier [1] - 16
Tactics [1] - 15
Strategy [1] - 15
Housekeeping [1] -17
Research [4] - 18
Leadership [2] - 17
S.F(Magical) [1] - 18
Teaching [1] - 17
first-aid [1] - 17

Knife [2] - 13
Staff [2] - 12




Items:

Wand: - Made from shipwrecked Yew, cored with quicksilver and base-tipped with dragonscale (silver).

Grants +3 bonus to spells, +5 to spells involving Storms.

Is an 'artefact' known as "Stormweaver".


Wearing:
 - Leather trousers and a cotton jerkin, well made with full heavy cape/cloak.
 - Leather tunic (light leather armour) well adorned (DR2)
 - Wand
 - Full length Staff (+2 to reactions)



OOC: This is a first draft of the character. The other mage doesn't have to be the same at all, you can up or lower some skills depending on what you think he might have. I appreciate the character is very powerful, but that is what we're going for here.

I didn't fully 'flesh out' all his skills or backstory, but this gives a good template , I think.
This message was last edited by the player at 13:32, Thu 23 Apr 2020.

is he supposed to have his magery, or is are his skills supposed to be lower?

Kirond is almost ready.

Alright, I just added it in to increase the point cost by 55

KRD
180 + 90 + 160 + 55 + 44 +18= 547

Attributes [180]
ST 11 [10]
DX 11 [20]
IQ 16 [120]
HT 12 [20]

HP 11
Per 16
Will 18 [10]
FP 12

30 ER [90]

Realms [160]
Correspondance 4
Mind 3
Light 3
Prime 2
Sound 2
Earth 1

Magery 5 [55]
Charisma 2 [10/0]

magic skills [44]
Light (will/vh) -23 [12]
correspondence (will/vh) -22 [8]
Mind (will/vh) -22 [8]
Sound (will/vh) -21 [4]
Prime (will/vh) -21 [4]
Air (will/vh) -21 [4]
Earth (will/vh) -21 [4]

travel skills [18/35]

Diplomacy [2]
Fast talk [2]
Acting [2]
Saviore-Faire [2]
Public Speaking [1]
Carousing [1]
Disguise [2]
Streetwise [2]
Pyschology [2]
Merchant [2]

connisour (theater) [4]
connisour (cusine) [2]
Dancing [2]
area knowledge (Alethkar) [1]
area knowledge (Rohan) [1]
area knowledge (Ixalan) [1]

Current Affairs [2]

Naturalist [4]
Hiking [1]
Riding [1]

37+72+15+64 +80 +55

-----------------------------------------------------
ST 15 [50]
DX 15 [100]
IQ 10 [0]
HT 14 [40]

HP 20 [30]
Will 14 [20]
Per 12 [10]
FP 14 [0]

Combat Reflexes [15]
High Pain Threshold [15]
Weapon Master (All Weapons) [45]
Magic Resistance 5 [10]
Ambidexterity [5]
Destiny 3 [15]
Fit [5]
weapon bond (family sword)

Soldier Talent 1 [5]

OPH (will not stand an insult) [-5]
Overconfidence [-5]
Sense of Duty (Noble House) [-5]
Gullible [-5]
Code of Honor (Knightly) [-5]
Insomniac (mild) [-10]
Bully [-5]

broadsword - 22 [28]
shield - 16 [2]
spear - 15 [2]
Fast Draw (sword) - 17 [4]
knife - 16 [2]
thrown weapon (knife) -16 [2]
fast draw (knife) -16 [2]
Polearm -15 [2]
two handed Sword - 16 [4]

Karate -15 [4]
Judo -15 [4]
Bow - 16 [4]
crossbow -16 [2]

Physiology (Winged Monsters) -10 [4]
Thaumatology - 9 [4]
Occultism - 11 [4]

First Aid -11 [2]
Parry Missile Weapons -15 [4]
Blind Fighting -11 [4]

Climbing -15 [2]
Stealth - 15 [2]
Soldier - 12 [4]
Tactics -11 [4]
Fast-Draw (arrow) -16 [2]

Current affairs (kingdom) -10 [1]
swimming -14 [1]
Carousing -14 [1]
Riding -14 [1]
Hiking -13 [1]

*****************************

Note that the 55 magery may or may not be part of the build, depending on how Periwinkle is built. It is probably necessary though.

I think we're about right to have a little go  of it.

You want to do mage v mage first? Or perhaps Mage + MAge vs an group of enemies?

Lets start with Periwinkle in Scenario 3:



Is that good with you?

Also, it is customary to put one version of the character in the final characters thread, and then edit that if any changes will be made.

I'm still got a few more tweaks I'd like to make to Kirond, and I'd like to see one-sided magic before we mess around with two sided.

Alright, lets try that!

:)

Wow, Realm magic is a lot more expensive than I initially realized!

By page 181, the base cost is equal to TWICE (not once) the level of the highest realm, plus the level of any others used. That puts your spell at a base of 9. Though I don't think you need prime on it, unless that's an in to manipulate the spell after casting it or something like that. That would be a base of 8.

Duration wasn't specified on the working given, but a base duration of a minute or 10 minutes makes sense for an artificial micro-storm.

Applying area of effect rules here can get energy costs out of hand very quickly. The base energy rules on page 182 suggest multiplying base energy by radius, which is frankly ridiculous. I don't think we want skill to be a part of controlling area... though we can do it that way. RPM would have us add twice the size modifier in energy. I do think this needs to be well defined, and I'd think weather would have a naturally large radius and that increased levels would give larger "base" radii. Also, you didn't specify the radius of the effect.

You're adding 1 Energy for each additional effect in the weather. I'm not sure where that rule is. My instinct would be to charge the level of the control needed for the effect for each element. So Hurricane Winds and lightning are each level 4, rain and mist are each level 2. That's my instinct, and I think its coming over from RPM. I don't think the different elements actually make the spell that much harder, but  the "constituents" table gives four elements a -3.

Casting Time is 6 seconds, but page 183. page 183 specifies -3 per halving of the casting time. That would imply a one second casting is -9 to skill, though I'd be happy with -8. Of course, you've previously mentioned alternate rules for reduced time.

So its a -12 to cast, and at least 8 energy. We need a radius, payment for the radius and a way to handle additional effects. As a final note, you forgot the bonus from the wand, so the spell still succeeds.

**********************************************************

This is of course by RAW. I'm not at all married to these costs, but if we're changing the rules lets be explicit about it. Things I think are ripe for changing:

The base cost is too high. Sure, its a fair cost for a standard mage (maybe) or RPM (who don't pay properly), but You paid 40 points for the privilege of access to that spell. I'd be happy halving those costs so they cost 1 per level for the first effect and half after that.

I think some discount on additional related effects is in order. maybe the first suggestion is sufficient, but maybe we could halve them again if they're exceptionally related (your spell hangs together very well, except for the mist)

I'd think that higher levels of realms would give higher base radii, especially when casting lower level effects.

I'd think that each realm has strengths compared to others, and weather effecting a wide area feels natural to me. Though I couldn't tell you how wide.

*****************************************************************

Let me know your thoughts.

Okay, sorry I've been a little absent (looking after my folks) but From what I've read from this, it looks fine.

I did have the books somewhere lying around - but not to hand when iwrote this, so I had to mostly work from memory in terms of applying costs/penalties.

I think the main use of prime is for affecting spells similar to the 'meta magic' college. Like delaying, setting triggers or extending the range too.

We all know that happens.

<prime>
I think the main use of prime is for affecting spells similar to the 'meta magic' college. Like delaying, setting triggers or extending the range too.
</quote>

Sure, but why do you need it for this spell?

**************************************************************

We still need to decide how we are doing area. We can either multiply the base cost for each doubling of the radius, or we can use the RPM way of just adding the size range table cost of the area.

**************************************************************

Rules I think We're going to use:

cost of the spell is 1 Energy per realm level for the first effect, and 1 Energy per two levels for follow up effects, and 1 energy for four levels for extremely related follow up effects.

The duration and area of the spell may be doubled for each realm level above required level to cast possessed.

*****************************************************************

That puts the cost of the spell at 6 Energy, plus what we charge for area.

OOC:

I think altering the shape of it should be a skill thing rather than a power thing. I would say creating odd area shapes requires the finesse of higher skill and so doing more complicated things would incur a higher penalty to the skill rather than a higher power-investment (in terms of FP)

I think FP investment is precisely to make the effect more powerful, by putting more energy in it. I think skill can augment that, though.

I agree that Energy makes it more powerful. Using skill to boost that? I can see it, but we should take care skill does not become the primary way power is boosted.

You still haven't said anything about what the cost for area should be.

Ah, sorry I didn't get to that bit, So tyupically I could envision that the cost would go up as the area increases, but I don't think an 'epic' wizard is truly limited to that level by FP - having 30FP available and then doing a simple area of fire spell at a 5m range shouldn't take 15-20fp... and leave them all but spent.

I think this is where 'prime' actually comes into use. In the same way you can make spells from the meta-magic college increase range (distance casting) or hold them for later (delay, etc.) the prime spell can affect the spells in such ways too.

So for example, a cunning mage rather than spending 15 FP to cast an area of say 3m radius, might be able to modify it with prime to use the 'range modifier' table (in the same way long distance spellcasting can work). So it becomes easier to cast much larger effects.

Similarly, given that Prime may well be the most utilitarian (especially for defence), I would assume that many mages learn it to some reasonable degree. A level 4-5 mage in prime may well be able to even 'create mages'.

So what specific rule would apply to determining the area of the spell you're trying to cast right now.

poke?

Hey dude,
sorry for the delays between posts. I have a lot of stuf fon IRL atm. I'll re-read and post tonight though :)

I'd say, if you used something like prime too and took a skill penalty you could change the 'area difficulty table' to be something like the ranged table instead of the same FP cost per +1m radius.

So i'd say, if you added an extra 4 cps, you could get a 10m radius, for example.

And we'll give weather spells a base radius of SM+4, because that's the nature of weather. +1 Energy per size modifier. If they take the normal amount of time to show up, we can use long-distance modifiers, but the modifier cost is doubled. Sound fair?

Also, what is the radius of this storm you are instantly conjuring?

I'd say, if they're 30ft away, that's 10m, so no more than say 4-5m

Ok, a few notes:

I don't think the realm of Matter is sufficient to transform random debris into explosive or even burning debris. Burning and Exploding really isn't the path of matter, and the path of matter is a little broad to start with, so I'd be expecting it to be more limited. Especially when only working with level 3.

Also, realm of storm workings get a radius bonus that matter doesn't.

OOC: Volatile matter is though.

I don't understand what you are trying to say. Could you expand on this?

Some matter is more volatile than others.

While i like to believe that the magical system focuses on the 'concept' of the in-game universe rather than the scientific reasoning, it is very true to say that some forms of matter are unstable.

For example, gunpowder, a mixture of substances (but would qualify under matter realm) is volatile. Phosphorus, Sodium, (any reactive element francium being the most).

With matter With matter, you could change substances to acid, etc. Or give a matter property 'flammable', for example

It's also true to say that you could get the same effects (in essence) even if the path to casting is different.

Using body to say increase the strength of a punch, is not so different than increasing the impact force (using forces) to cause more damage. It's the same effect, but manifest in a different manner.

So what concrete effect do you want this to have?

EDIT: sorry about the long delay. I've had some several things come up in my personal life that have made it difficult to get back to you.
This message was last edited by the GM at 01:41, Thu 25 June 2020.

It's fine - I've been having a lot of IRL things causing problems too actually.

I just would assume that making the matter volatile enough to be explosive on impact, so every time a physical object hits someone or something in it it does 1-3d6 damage.

The matter wouldn't be an area cast, exactly. It'd be combined with prime to make it a cascading effect.

So, i would say this:

Within the tempest there's a probability of bring hit by an object (this might change over time as more or less debris comes into it) but lets just say something like 1 in 6 for the first few minutes than 2-3 in 6 chance of being hit. Hit location is random.

Upon being hit, 1d6-3d6 damage explosive is done.

In reply to archypetro (msg # 42):

And how much do you expect this to cost?