General Chat.   Posted by Derrick.Group: 0
evileeyore
 player, 72 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 04:18
Re: General Chat
Dblade:
So I had a question about the fight in the martial arts thread. Why didn't Lane get Active Defense attempts against either of the eye attacks, and instead just rolled against HT?

Lane made the classic mistake of making an All Out Attack* and then failing to land the hit.

That ranks right up there with invading Russia in the winter, engaging in land wars in Asia, and betting against Sicilians when death is on the line.




* Note, it's the All Out Attack that removed Lane's defenses.  Not the missing.  But being parried and thus not injuring Demchugdongrub was just the icing on the being blinded cake.

This message was last edited by the player at 04:18, Wed 10 Oct 2018.

Dblade
 player, 32 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 04:37
Re: General Chat
Ahh thanks! That makes perfect sense, I suppose I just missed the fact it was an All Out Attack.
Whisper
 player, 12 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 10:15
Re: General Chat
Never sacrifice your defense unless you know you won't get hit back.  In GURPs combat, defense is king.  It's meant to be a realistic game system, so getting hit leads to shock, which modifies your defense in the following round.  The whole thing can snowball out of control quickly, as you just saw.
Nicole
 player, 20 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 12:01
Re: General Chat
Though, cinematics are likely to go wonky because of things like pressure points and kiais.  A realistic fight would be likely to last far longer without weird disabling abilities (uh... undefended eye-gouging notwithstanding).
Derrick
 GM, 93 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 13:20
Re: General Chat
All out attacks are very risky. I don't see many people use them, except as finishers, or against foes who can't attack back. We have martial arts, which means committed attack is on the table.

We're using the extra effort in combat rules for martial arts, which means most things you would use an all out attack for can be yours for the cost of 1 FP. I surprised to NOT see those in the combat we just did. see page 131 of martial arts.
Vulco1
 player, 34 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 13:30
Re: General Chat
Yeah, we were going for the classic Kyokushin style of "all out attack, finish it in one blow" and I had forgotten about the extra effort.

Oh well, we'll get it next time.
Nicole
 player, 21 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 22:21
Re: General Chat
Did the rules of the tournament get changed after our match?  I distinctly remember that pushing an opponent out before created a one minute wait, and now it's a way of winning.
Dblade
 player, 44 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 23:12
Re: General Chat
According to the previous rules, it created a three minute break. There was no ring-out win condition unless it's been changed.
Nicole
 player, 22 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 23:33
Re: General Chat
Derrick:
the battle will begin on opposite sides of the platform, to sound of a gong. Contenders may be eliminated via unconsciousness, tapping out, or leaving the platform.

Dblade
 player, 45 posts
Wed 10 Oct 2018
at 23:39
Re: General Chat
That WAS an edit, without any consultation with other players or forewarning. It previously said that it was only one participant leaving the platform voluntarily, as in forfeiting. The result of one player getting thrown out of the platform was a three minute break previously. If that had been in place since the beginning I would have built my character entirely differently.
Nicole
 player, 23 posts
Thu 11 Oct 2018
at 02:17
Re: General Chat
In reply to Dblade (msg # 82):

Maybe we can have a universal chance to re-evaluate our builds?  Just since a lot of us were operating on different win conditions when we made our characters.  (Plus, Push just got wayyyy better.)

EDIT:  Also, can "tapping out" be clarified?  Given that we're otherworldly manipulators of the poor combatants in the ring, the big reasons for tapping out (choking, agony, etc.) doesn't force a player to have his/her character tap out.  Unless there's going to be some kind of will check for continuing when certain afflictions get applied?

This message was last edited by the player at 02:28, Thu 11 Oct 2018.

Derrick
 GM, 111 posts
Thu 11 Oct 2018
at 13:01
Re: General Chat
There was indeed an edit, back on the 4th (if you look at the original fight thread -- either than or its a different edit). I had some memory of people requesting exiting the ring being a defeat, and I was probably thinking of posts 36 and 38 in this thread, by Dblade and Vulco1, both on the 24th of September. It was made just before we started the smasha-Kyokushin fight. I do not appear to have announced the change, either in the martial arts thread, character creation, or in general chat. That is totally my bad, I should have announced it better, and possibly collected more than two opinions before making the change. My apologies. It won't happen again.

If Dblade wants to fight under the old rules for this fight, we can certainly do that. A rebuild to allow tweaks to fit the rules, take advantage of lessons learned, and possibly expand the building rules to allow for more flexibility in spending the "Cinematic skills and techniques" points may be appropriate.

We could also just revert to the old rule for all fights.
Derrick
 GM, 116 posts
Thu 11 Oct 2018
at 17:27
Re: General Chat
Whisper:
You meant this to go somewhere else.
Critical success probably means fight over in this kind of scenario.  No defense allowed if I remember correctly.


Yes, it goes elsewhere.

Its not defended against, its resisted in a quick contest, so criticals don't matter, except for the margin of success.

What really matters is how the recovery roll next turn goes, which is a 50/50 shot.
Dblade
 player, 48 posts
Thu 11 Oct 2018
at 20:06
Re: General Chat
Since the +2 to my DX-based push roll from CA(Determined) boosted my push attempt, does that mean it also boosted my Push damage, which is based off the same skill, determines my knockback damage and is part of the same attack? Or was it only the attempt to hit? Also, does my Karate damage bonus to barehanded strikes apply?

This message was last edited by the player at 20:11, Thu 11 Oct 2018.

evileeyore
 GM, 84 posts
Mon 15 Oct 2018
at 23:55
Re: General Chat
Dblade:
Since the +2 to my DX-based push roll from CA(Determined) boosted my push attempt, does that mean it also boosted my Push damage, which is based off the same skill, determines my knockback damage and is part of the same attack? Or was it only the attempt to hit? Also, does my Karate damage bonus to barehanded strikes apply?

Only things that raise the Skill would effect damage... so no, Committed  Attack (Determined) wouldn't apply...  however...  Committed Attack (Strong) would have.

As for Karate, it increases damage done by Karate attacks, not 'unarmed' attacks*.  For instance it doesn't increase Judo or Brawling attack damage.

However Weapon Master (Unarmed) would apply.



* For future reference if you wanted this combo to apply you'd take the Perk Skill Adaptation (Karate damage bonus with Push).

This message was last edited by the GM at 23:56, Mon 15 Oct 2018.

Dblade
 player, 56 posts
Tue 16 Oct 2018
at 00:00
Re: General Chat
Thanks that's all really cool to know. Were we supposed to be getting additional Perks because of how we invest points? Because Tai Chi doesn't include it as a Style perk but I thought for every so many points you invest in your style's components you get a perk.
evileeyore
 GM, 85 posts
Tue 16 Oct 2018
at 01:47
Re: General Chat
Dblade:
Thanks that's all really cool to know. Were we supposed to be getting additional Perks because of how we invest points? Because Tai Chi doesn't include it as a Style perk but I thought for every so many points you invest in your style's components you get a perk.

That Perk, Skill Adaptation, comes from GURPS Power-Ups 2 Perks.  Taking it would require GM approval (naturally).

Your style, T'ai Chi, has the Perk "Unusual Training (Push, May not step or move while doing so)", which has only one purpose:  To allow Push to be taken without needing the TBaM Advantage.  If you take TBaM this Perk is a waste of points and detrimental.

Where do you get Perks?  Most of the Templates in Martial Arts have the Advantage "Style Perks [1/perk]" that are available as Advantage choices.
Derrick
 GM, 129 posts
Wed 17 Oct 2018
at 14:43
Re: General Chat
As a note, we can run more than one martial arts combat at a time, if someone wants to fight Whisper.
Dblade
 player, 62 posts
Wed 17 Oct 2018
at 14:48
Re: General Chat

That Perk, Skill Adaptation, comes from GURPS Power-Ups 2 Perks.  Taking it would require GM approval (naturally).

Your style, T'ai Chi, has the Perk "Unusual Training (Push, May not step or move while doing so)", which has only one purpose:  To allow Push to be taken without needing the TBaM Advantage.  If you take TBaM this Perk is a waste of points and detrimental.

Where do you get Perks?  Most of the Templates in Martial Arts have the Advantage "Style Perks [1/perk]" that are available as Advantage choices.
</quote>

The martial arts book says that you automatically get a number of non-style perks for every certain amount of points spent on your style though?
evileeyore
 GM, 87 posts
Wed 17 Oct 2018
at 20:22
Re: General Chat
Dblade:
The martial arts book says that you automatically get a number of non-style perks for every certain amount of points spent on your style though?

No.

Martial Arts, pg 124 Style Perks:
"A student with Style Familiarity may buy one Style Perk per full 10 points he has in that style’s techniques and required skills."

This rule supersedes the suggested general rule of "allowed to purchase one perk per 25 Character points invested in your Character" from Basic* Power-Ups 2 Perks.




* I always think that rule came from Basic, but Basic has only the limit of "Rule Zero".
Vulco1
 player, 35 posts
Mon 22 Oct 2018
at 19:22
Re: General Chat
We're at that halftime break in every martial arts movie where the fighters are just walking around staring at each other until a single drop of water falls, or a pigeon turns it's head.

lol
evileeyore
 GM, 91 posts
Mon 22 Oct 2018
at 20:14
Re: General Chat
I was going to say this is the first time I've seen a decent lull in a fight that wasn't forced.

I'm impressed with both of them.
Whisper
 player, 22 posts
Mon 22 Oct 2018
at 20:29
Re: General Chat
The suspense has developed nicely.  What will they do? Continue to circle around?  Or will they choose aggression over patience?
Dblade
 player, 72 posts
Tue 23 Oct 2018
at 13:07
Re: General Chat
Honestly kinda wanna give up on Baogang's fight. Can kinda see how this is gonna play out and have for a while. It's honestly not much fun fighting a stone wall. XD
Derrick
 GM, 143 posts
Tue 23 Oct 2018
at 13:34
Re: General Chat
Dblade:
Honestly kinda wanna give up on Baogang's fight. Can kinda see how this is gonna play out and have for a while. It's honestly not much fun fighting a stone wall. XD


Yeah, I'm extremely disappointed in Pingbi's offensive capabilities. Gurps let grappled foes attack (at a penalty), and I can't use Judo to defend him from them. His damage output is super low, so a foe with more power can safely trade attacks. We also Both took enhanced defenses, and that means hitting with anything is pretty darn hard. Grappling also has the break free option, where ST is all that matters, and Pingbi is the weakest guy in the game.