In reply to GM (msg # 31):

I can probably mind-control some of their vital support personnel, but I'm not going in deep. The way I've redesigned Nu, she's no longer the charisma goddess she used to be. So the infiltrator is probably not me. I'll be busy coiling around the Grand Duchess' throne once we finish eyeing each other warily.

Heh, as mentioned, alas I don't think Drann will be the best to go about infiltrating the Faithful. Helping push them out? That may be another story, especially if he can recruit enough sorcerers and raise their standing/influence in Belrand of course. #1 and #3 would most likely fit into his purview most easily I'd imagine. :)

Siurinax would be very interested in working with Drann soon after they meet in the Free Cities (if that works for Drann).  Siur's main thing he's been up to is experimenting with growing groups of people - cutting off the useless and malignant, growing the useful and good.  He'd be happy to help Drann do the same with his sorcerers, with prophecies about how to go about a project - whether expansion, unification, clearing traitors, whatever - as well as luck to see it through, in exchange for getting to be part of the working with and reshaping of the organization.

He'd be up for doing the same for everyone else's areas of interests as well.

With his charisma, luck, and (TBD) Facts, Siurinax would probably be the best for the infiltration.  Not sure how I'll do with Dark^TM scenes as a player, though - might end up having to flip the table earlier than planned.  We'll see.

gonna start proper on the char sheet now. not sure how much time I have, tho, so it might not get done until sometime tomorrow.

Anyway, do we roll starting stats or assign the baseline in the book?

I had assumed as much, but wanted to be sure in case you were interested in shifting the focus. Still got a lot of the material from the previous game for you to play with, and no surprise betrothals this time either.



It wouldn't be impossible, but yeah it would stifle your character's goals. You wouldn't be able to entice followers easily with your knowledge since, well it would be heresy. I definitely have more material for you on the Ducal side of the War then the Faithful. I think both you and Nu working together to become Elizabeth's advisors would be a good start.



So Siurnax is already feeling his instincts to Cultivate the world around him. Is it possible he has tried to Cultivate before and failed due to outside factors? Perhaps this is why he joined the group, since he has already tasted failure while working alone?

The Dark^TM portions of the Faithful is less watching gratuitous scene of torture, and deals more with having to pretend to be a villain for a couple of scenes. If you wanna go deep undercover you gotta prove loyalty by being ok with the Faithful's underhanded tactics. The closer you get yourself to the Archbishop the more you will learn, which can give you a massive advantage later when you are ready to end the Civil War.



So it seems like your character would definitely be game for seeing a Draconic Empire grow later in the game. As for territory, it is possible Lellelan just doesn't have the strong natural instinct that make a "Lair" and carve out land for her own. Maybe they really are just content to travel the world, but realized how hard it is with the Faith hunting Dragons and the current Elder Dragons forbidding trespassers. Perhaps they joined the group for the chance to be able to travel between 5 other Dragon's Territory without being attacked. If your allies become Elder Dragons their territory would get bigger, and a vast swath of Nastrondir will become open to you to travel without fear of reprisal.

Not claiming Territory for yourself would make getting Dominion slower, but it wouldn't stifle your characters growth too much. You could also simply claim some lands, but allow it to Cultivate organically while you travel to other lands. Maybe make it closer to another players so that they can help defend it (this again would require a lot of trust, but is possible since you are both players).

As for which side of the War, I honestly think Lell can do both, since I'd imagine either side would love to have a Bard write propaganda to capture the hearts of the people.



You can use the Stat Array from the book, OR roll your stats in RPOL's dice roller.

Antherisax I'll be honest either Faction would work for you, BUT I think your character would specifically be helpful on the Faithful side (and I need more players who are interested in manipulating the bad guys).
This message was last edited by the GM at 15:46, Tue 01 Aug 2023.

Sounds good to me. Antherisax wouldn't have much trouble faking? being a bad guy either. He honestly doesn't care much for mortals. I mean, he's strained around other dragons at the best of times. He could easily go full inquisitoral heretic seeker to earn a place with the faithful. both in demeanor and in abilities. some mortal sacrifices to further their plans won't exactly bother his sleep.

Now, whether I should roll or take base stats.... Hmm, Imma roll. it can be more fun with random stats, even if I have to work around some less than ideal ones.

In reply to GM (msg # 36):

Yeah I agree. I think Lell could be useful to either side of the war effort. I'm willing to work wherever the group needs me.

If I stick to the Ducal side I can start controlling convincing the other lords to trust us, gaining favor with the local population, inspiring the troops, etc.

If I go infiltrate the other side I might be able to work my way through the lower circles pretty quickly. If I'm lucky I might even be able to sow some seeds of discord along the way. Befriend some middle men, make a mob filled with doubt after a saint's speech, etc. Plus Lellelan isn't evil but she isn't necessarily good either. I don't think she'd have that much difficulty faking being evil for her role.

One question I do have for the DM and the group, how open are we being about our dragon forms on the Ducal side? Are we openly claiming to be dragons helping Ducal's cause so the people/lords favor us directly? Are we working as our mortal guises to help prop up Elizabeth and run Ducal from the shadows? Perhaps something in-between where the humans know dragons are helping but don't know who are mortal guises are?

I think that fits.  If no one else had their eye on it, he might be the actual organizing impetus for the group.  Some dozens/hundreds of years ago he might have been from another area and tried to start establishing himself quietly.  His fledgling territory was squashed but he escaped with his life and a horror story to share.  Since, he'd been toying with Cultivating mortal groups as he used his prophetic powers to try to figure out how to make a truly secure territory.  When he finally got some good results, it pointed in the direction of forging an alliance of dragons.

Since then, he could have been using prophetic powers (and blind Luck) to seek out the particular dragons we have here and bring them together.

---

In reply to Lellelan (msg # 38):

I think we want to be pretty cagey to start, until we have had opportunity to prove our value, so we're not just propaganda fuel for the Faith.

So, revealing your Dragon form is a choice I leave open for the player, but you should read the situaton in Belrand before doing so.

1) The common people generally know two things about Dragons. First is that their last Dragon-Lord was a tyrant who enslaved 90% of the population. That all these beautiful First Age structures spread around Belrand were made from the whipped backs of their ancestors. Second is what the Faithful tells them. Belrand is the "Holy Kingdom", and the Gods claim that Dragons are the spawn of an ancient evil that should be hated and resisted.

2) The Civil War is based around the Faithful claiming that the newly elected Monarch is illegitimate based on their ancestors connection with Dragons. Revealing yourselves openly could turn the population against Elizabeth, because right now the Ducal cause is running on the idea that the Archbishop is lying, and trying to take power away from the Aristocracy. The nobles who are neutral could pick a side if it turns out Elizabeth is a Dragon-Blooded heretic. (Edit: She IS, but the people don't need to know that yet.)

You are all Godbound, so I'm not saying it would be impossible to win the population after doing this...BUT it will change the tone of the game from one of guiding the population to a decision, to one of FORCING the population to decide. It's basically how you want your actions to be viewed by those who can't be directly altered by your powers.
This message was last edited by the GM at 17:01, Tue 01 Aug 2023.

I'm keeping my options open. Nu may reveal her existence fairly early, but not her link to Tanith or her interests in Belrand.

Which raises the question. In this timeline, are mortal Theurges or other mortals who can wield army-shattering arcana known to exist?

Honestly that would probably the smartest way  to do things. You don't have to reveal your Mortal Guise to anyone. Hell if Tanith even wanted to reveal her connection to Dragons, she could also just pretend to be Nu's Dragonblooded servant. Also guys don't forget you can have more then one Mortal Guise, in case you don't wanna use your main one for the Faithful infiltration.



Only Dragon-Blooded and Chosen Mortals have access to abilities on the level of Theurgy.

Dragon-Blooded gain abilities based on what the Elder Dragon wants them to have, and the Elder Dragon will also name them (Dragon-Blooded is actually a derogatory term the Faith made). These powers wane each generation, so unless the Elder Dragon empowers new mortals to replace the old ones, these powers get weaker when they are past on to children. Otherwise the Dragon-Blooded have to keep their family tree pretty well trimmed (incest) to maintain the amount of power they had when their family was first empowered. In the Second Age there are a few Noble Families that have remained "pure" enough to perform anything close to Invocations. Notable exceptions in the Second Age are Cridhe Bheithir's Drow, and Bialanthus Ose's Norns. When you guys gain enough levels you can created your own Dragon-Blooded. I'm currently bouncing around the idea of whether, or not you guys can "re-charge" existing Dragon-Bloods who have had their powers wane throughout the generations (like Elizabeth, who's blood is diluted to the point where she's barely more then a normal Mortal). This would also concern Drann since he wants to teach Mortals Sorcery, and he won't be able to push them past Low Magic until he can bless them.

Chosen get their powers from the Gods, and it's a mixed bag of Martial Strifes, Theurgy, Alchemy, and if they are really blessed, Biblically Accurate Angel forms.
This message was last edited by the GM at 02:36, Wed 02 Aug 2023.

In reply to GM (msg # 42):

If I'm dragooned (pun intended) into helping with the Faithful biz, I'm definitely pulling out a new identity for that unless Elizabeth badly bungles her overtures to Tanith. XD

(On the other hand, I like dark so there's that.)

Nu will probably be inducing a variety of powers, but it's an open question what she'll tie to the blood and what she'll tie to teachings. (NB: I'm talking about using Dominion to shape her followers, not the Cultivation Word ability, and her creating such things as lesser strifes and low magic schools.)

Anyway, good to know how Tanith will be seen then. She probably won't be Nu's Hans Brackhaus, because that's a really obvious trick and I have more use for her than that, but she can probably hint that she's got a strong bloodline to Elizabeth, especially when...well, I'll let everyone guess at my plans there before I reveal them.



If their blood is that weak, then of course we can awaken them again.
This message was last edited by the player at 03:21, Wed 02 Aug 2023.

The issue I'm running into is whether to give you that ability earlier then outright making Dragon-Blooded yourself. Lets say as a boon Nu decided to make Elizabeth her Dragon-Blooded. Her abilities would be based on Nu's abilities so (Dragon-Sea-Psycho-w/e Nu evolves at later levels). But what if Nu had the ability to reinvigorate the Dragon-Blood already present in Elizabeth? Well that would be Baal Shax's blood, and that would be tied to War and Might. Are you just injecting Seithr back into their bodies, or is it something unique to the original Dragon? I have to think on it more.

Also I have gotten all the new players Character Sheets. There is currently an issue where I'm trying to get in contact with a player who is unresponsive (none of you who have been replying), so I'm trying to figure out what's going on with them before I progress anything yet. By Friday though we're moving forward so the IC can be up on Monday.

In reply to GM (msg # 44):

Let me answer your question with another question...Would you say that in this setting, the Dragon Word inherently comes with some of the reproductive elements we associate with Fertility? Empowered and sacred bloodlines, as well as dragon lines in the Chinese sense? (Chinese mysticism associates ley lines and fertility.)

If so, we should be able to possibly mess with and reawaken Elizabeth's bloodline with an act of Dominion if we choose, because that'd be within the scope of our Word.

In reply to Nu (msg # 46):

It's less esoteric then that (or is it?), cuz I sorta just wanted to combine the way Dragon-Blooded work in Exalted (empowered humans passing their power through family, and it weakening if they cross-breed with normal humans), and the Mark of the Prophet Gift that lets you award followers with talents reflective of your portfolio.

With Dominion it goes without saying, cuz Dominion solves everything in this game. What I'm talking about is building a feature into Cultivation that allows you to do what I'm talking about without Dominion. Since it's tantamount to changing a Fact about someone.

Like I said I'm still thinking about it.

Edit: Also this is about reinvigorating other Dragon's Dragon-Blooded not creating your own. I already know how you guys will create your own Dragon-Blooded. This is can you effect other Dragon's Dragon-Blooded without Dominion. Which I want to emphasis since Dominion is always an "of course you can" situation.
This message was last edited by the GM at 04:08, Wed 02 Aug 2023.

Changed up Character Creation a little bit. I want to get Character Advancement codified since it's going to be slightly different from what's in the Core Rules (p. 19).

The changes to Dragon Gifts have nothing to do with how they work mechanically, but are related to how things are perceived in the world. This will explain how Gifts/Miracles are compared to other magical powers in the world, as well as the difference between regular and overt Effort.

The Cultivation section will explain what the Cultivation Word is, how it differs from Apotheosis, as well as how it ties with Influence and Dominion. Then it will list the mechanical Gifts you receive from it.

Then I wanted the Character Sheet at the bottom, since it makes it easier to quickly get to it so you don't have to scroll past a bunch of fluff.

These sections should be finished by this weekend.
This message was last edited by the GM at 15:49, Wed 02 Aug 2023.

Yeah I can definitely see the appeal of keeping our dragon forms a secret. Driving potential allies into the arms of the Faithful would not be great. On the flip side though being too guarded could also kind of hurt us. If Elizabeth gets all the glory it would be pretty easy to denounce us once we reveal ourselves and then we're just back to square one.

I think Nu is on the right track and perhaps we aim for somewhere in the middle? One or two dragons might reveal themselves and help to start mending the people's views of the them without necessarily giving away their mortal guises. Maybe rescue a village or two after the faithful are revealed to be the mustache twirling evildoers they are.

Alternatively we can choose to keep our true forms a secret. We just need to make sure our mortal selves are becoming the heroes and not the army.

This is obviously for those supporting the Ducal side, the infiltration side wouldn't have to worry about revealing themselves as much.

---

Speaking of infiltrating for the sake of the gm and others summarizing where everyone currently stands:

Antherisax open to infiltrating (msg #37)
Drannathorin reluctant to infiltrating (msg #33)
Lellelan open to infiltrating (msg #38)
Nu reluctant to infiltrating (msg #32)
Siurinax open to infiltrating (msg #34)
Toraas Veer unknown

Seems we have a pretty even split of those who are willing to infiltrate and those who would rather avoid it.

Really, if the group is working together at least in part (or in full) just through various angles, I could see those NOT directly involved in infiltration helping on that angle without the need to break character. Those who have embedded themselves spread the world that 'dragons are not evil - that's the Faithful spreading lies to take control'. Queue one of the others winging their way in (in dragon form) to help rescue a village or perform some great feat that helps the people. Those working at spreading the word in mortal form don't blow their cover, but the end result is the same. IF/when those directly involved want to reveal themselves, they can, but going that route lessens the risk of being exposed too soon. Plausible deniability as it were.

In fact, I could see that sort of mutual 'fly in to help out, then disappear' angle being useful for everyone at some point. Having one of the others be the dragon just keeps our individual covers in place. "It obviously wasn't me.. I was standing there too - remember?" Who helps with what activity could go to the strengths of everyone involved. Best suited gets the job for whatever the particular situation requires. But it'd make a great way for the group to interact and help each other build up influence.

TY for this, really helpful. I'm attempting to write scenarios with certain characters in mind, which is why I wanted to know how everyone was leaning.



Brings a tear to my eye watching you guys plot to gaslight this country. Friendship really is magic.

Just in case anyone is wondering, the first scene in the game will be one with you all present. Afterwards you guys will be the ones to decide how you split up tasks, what factions you infiltrate, and what your plan is the end the Civil War or prolong it to gain more benefits.

I have a plan for ensuring my own mortal self is securely part of the winning team, which I'm not going to reveal just yet because I'm trying to keep our GM guessing for a bit. (Though he probably has my big early figured out already.)

In reply to Drannathorin (msg # 50):

I really like this idea. It might take some work to coordinate the infiltrators with the others. I don't know how big Belrand is but presumably we wouldn't be able to walk down the street to converse if we're on opposite sides of the country and getting spies to deliver the news seems like a very slow method of gaining information.

The first idea that comes to mind would be the "Terror of the Skies" gift. A dragon could conceivably fly into and out of the area pretty quickly under the cover of nightfall to try to avoid detection. Could be a way to keep both sides updated on the progress of the other, let the support side use the knowledge to the fullest, and organize aid like you suggested Drann.

In reply to Lellelan (msg # 53):

Yep, I definitely will have Terror of the Skies for Drann. As a collective too, communication between us is something I could see taking advantage of that ability too (if everyone has it - or something similar-ish). Designate a spot for a monthly gathering as it were. We gather, share updates and plan for any such showings that might come up. If we need to do something a bit more urgently, we could always go to visit the other more directly (if not discreetly) to request quicker aid for a specific project. IF we're all in Belrand, it could be even easier to make such meetings too (without requiring Terror of the Skies); the same concept would work. Have a pre-arranged meeting time and place we gather to discuss things.


Of course, each would be able to keep private whatever specifics of their own workings they wish, but for a fellowship type arrangement of us being a bit more cooperative, it would provide the avenue to do so. Somewhere that only dragons could reach (ie. Terror) would be good, but that would depend on everyone taking that Gift too. If not, we could arrange something a little more 'ground level' as it were. Hehe.

In reply to Drannathorin (msg # 54):

If you want communication between us, let me see if I can take Of One Mind at level 2. Instant mental communication between me and any of my linked people (and I don't mind being a mail server for the group). And immunity to mental influence, because I'm a nice dragon.
This message was last edited by the player at 02:03, Thu 03 Aug 2023.

I also have terror of the skies. Antherisax is leaning fairly heavily into the dragon side of his words at the start of the game.

I imagine a good meeting spot for the group would either be on some mountaintop, or maybe in a hidden glade that's hard to get to on foot. Make it Antherisax's glade were he goes when he needs a break from people, and he won't be able to dip out on meetings if he's feeling particularly antisocial that day :p

Dunno any other ways we could easily contact each other. Anther can speak to animals and send messages through them, but since the rest cannot, as far as I know, it would be limited to them carrying mail between us.

As an aside, I don't think I've really mentioned what my words are.
Antherisax has the deception word, more precisely the ability to detect lies and see through illusions. That's what made him so antisocial, as feeling lies is unpleasant at the best of times, and makes being around people.
He also talks to animals through the beast word, and can make links with them to spy through them.
The rest of his gifts are in the dragon word. Wings, strength, breath weapon.

I considered keeping some of it secret, but it would go against what anther's like. He's blunt both in action and demeanor. He would totally have told the others that he can tell when they lie, and ask them not to. Because it feels like tasting cold mud and having something tickle his spine. Unpleasant, and he'd rather they just not.