Started typing this for Creedrow, and concluded Ornn would need this info, and maybe future players too, so i'm putting it here.

Disclaimer, this is a lot of 'talk' and it still not all the rules, since there are limitations that i'm not going to go into, but they exist so you can't just take these rules and min/max power game with them.  They're a guideline, not the absolute rule on how things work... VERY IMPORTANT for players to acknowledge that take crafting feats for magic items.

There are house rules on what can go in what, and as a general only one spell per item.

ie.

Boots are used for movement based spells, like expeditious retreat.

Gloves are used for spells that require the use of hands or touch, like shocking grasp or lay hands.

Rings and Necklaces are general spells and are a sort of wild card in that they can take any spell.  (It helps to justify the feat specific to forge rings, since they're limited to two body slots).

You can only 'attune' to 'one' item per slot too, so you can't have a bag of rings, to use... put away, and put on a new one.

This concept has been throughly thought through for abuse.




The other way type is i scale down magic items, i scale down the effects and the cost for something.  ie.  The pouch of holding is based on the bag of Holding.


25% of the stuff that shows up will use the scaled down method


This is used for wands too, so some 'fully charged' 'expendable' wands in the campaign will have less than 100 charges.  Really a 100 charages is over kill.


The scaled down method has also been applied to staves.

The normal cost for a staff is pretty obnoxious to the point that you never see them, and in the scale of my campaign impossible to consider.

The core rule cost of a staff are...
1st slot - 400 gp x caster level x level of spell
2nd slot - 300 gp x caster level x level of spell
after 2nd- 200 gp x caster level x level of spell

Caster level was 'no less than 8th', so the cost of that first slot was going to be at least 3200gp x the level of the spell (more if it was a spell that an eight level can't cast)

You EASILY break into the five or six digit cost for staves under these rules.

So how do we make the cost more in scale with this campaign...

First, acknowledge that the highest level spell a character will normally have access to is 3rd level.  I can count the number of third level spells that were actually cast in my twilight campaign on one hand.  (One fireball and a few haste)

The campaign limted class levels to 7th at the time, but they've now been increased to ninth (with the caveat that spell levels are limited to third)

You could learn craft staff with a 6th level caster class.  Minimal Caster level is reduced to 5th level.  These are reasonable scale downs, when you consider that the highest class level is 7th, and the highest level spell you have access to is 3rd.

With these tweaks, the cost of the first slot is reduced to 2000gp x the level of the spell.  A nice price break, but still beyond the scale of the campaign economy.

Then we tweak the forumula.  The Core rules, presume that the max charge of the staff is '10', but what if the max charge of the staff was fewer.  What if we tweak the cost based o n the charges the staff has?  This will put the cost in line with the campaign...


So... this is the forumla used from the above logic.

1st slot - 40 gp x caster level x level of spell x max charge of spell
2nd slot - 30 gp x caster level x level of spell x max charge of spell
after 2nd- 20 gp x caster level x level of spell x max charge of spell


So... running the numbers.  Lets say we want a cleric staff.  We want it to have Bull Strength, Bless, and Cure Light Wounds.  We're willing to accept that Bull Strength will take two charges to use.

Using the Core rules, the cost will be.
Bull Strength 400 x 8 x 2 = 3200gp / 2 (for 2 charge to cast) = 1600gp
Bless         300 x 8 x 1 = 2400gp
CLW           200 x 8 x 1 = 1600gp

Total cost = 1600 + 2400 + 1600 = 5600gp  not a terrible cost for the typical campaign, but... still steep in the scale of my campaign.

Using my campaign rules the cost for the staff, if it has two charges would be...
Bull Strength 40 x 8 x 2 x 2 = 640gp / 2 (for 2 charge to cast) = 320gp
Bless         30 x 8 x 1 x 2 = 480gp
CLW           20 x 8 x 1 x 2 = 320gp

Total cost would be 320 + 480 +320 = 1120gp, this is affordable in my campaign scale, with abilities that are in line with the campaign items.  It should be noted that Spell cast from this staff will be at fifth level , or the casters level, which ever is LOWER.


It should also be noted that house rules have tweaked staves a little.  Staves usually allow the casting of 'touch attacks' with a successful melee attack by the stave.

This has been tweaked by the inclusion of staff like wands.  They allow 'touch attacks' to be made with a successful 'short' ranged touch attack by the wand (25' + 5'/2 levels, max +10').  They are also easier to carry and conceal, but it should be noted that they are more FRAGILE, and likely to break or snap.

---

Rods exist, as a means of providing meta magic feat support.


I've already mentioned the inclusion of Mana Potions, which are the spell casters version of Healing Potions allowing the recovery of a first level spell that has been expended from a standard potion.

Scrolls are replaced by 'Tomes' which are books used to scribe scrolls into, who's pages blank allowing the scribing of new spells into it.

Other magic items are in existence, and experimented with, like items that grant some access to feats (like shadow step?), Keystones (intelligent items), and I-Books (like a magical I Pad).  'Stuff'  I tweak the rules, play with them, but i  make an effort not to break them.

Any ways ... Most of these rules have been tested and ruggedly played with through the twilight campaign, so i'm pretty confident in their game balance (min/max power gamers should be aware there are limitations in place but i'm not going to go into them since this is alot of typing already.)

I think i've been pretty patience with Cass, so i'm putting the character on Hiatus for now.  Don't look for meaningful interaction with them, till the player shows more signs of life.  They've actually haven't checked RPOL since November 11th, so I suspect something serious must have happened to them in the flesh and blood world.

It happens, somewhere along the way if she doesnt return i'll put a new notice up.  Not in a rush, originally i was only looking for three players or so for the campaign which i currently have.  Enough players for back and forth unexpected banter, and a small enough number to be cozy, so i'm not unhappy with the current arrangement.

I find the diametric approach between Creedrow and Ethan interesting btw.  Still waiting to see what Ornn brings along, i suspect eccentric might be the path they're leaning towards, but waiting to see more.

We're almost... out of student orientation, which means I'll focus on private threads more after that.

Will probably compress a 'day or two' of teaching over the span of the rest of the year is my requested time table.

That'll let me figure out if Cassandra is in or out, if Ornn works out, and if i need to recruit a new teacher or two to recover attrition between now and xmas.

Anyways, that's the metagame status of the campaign.  If you have concerns or things you want to talk about out of character here, feel free and I'll try to address them.
This message was last edited by the GM at 12:38, Mon 25 Nov 2019.

While Cass is NOT apparently with us ... I hope we can still refer to lessons "performed in her class" while we are in our own?   I mean it might ease her transfer back in/ make it easier for someone to take on her role in-game.  And some of my classwork is going to depend on my peer's own lessons. Or at least the appearance of the children learning something in classes other than my own.   Such are the ways that such lessons are supposed to be interrelated.

FYI.   I may ask my students what they have learned in school or are learning in other classes. And I WILL want to know what they think they know about the world... so I know either what to correct, what to expand, and what to rely upon.

Modern world kids would have been being taught for 5-6 years already, with formalized classwork.  And as a teacher, I would KNOW what they've learned up to this point. What I can depend on them already knowing.  All I know about THESE children is they are all 'apprentice' aged.  And some of them have a plan and some do not.

They are all at the cusp of becoming, either: 'regular' citizens, or entering an irregular 'trade' an outlier of the norm, or entering a 'trade' which is antithetical to the norm. Taking the 'temperature' of their thoughts is going to be a necessary measure.  And it might even allow them to bond more cohesively as a group if they know how to interact with each other ...OFF of the playground.

We'll see.

That's why i dont want more than a day or two of game time to pass for the next few weeks, to help determine if she's coming back or not.

I wont keep her on as an npc if i determine that it's a dead end because i dont want to limit the teaching options available to a new player.  I also had an martial npc mentor lying about that i wasnt going to use if there were two players, but will bring out for use if she's not coming back.  Cassandra's background makes it easier to justify her ducking out, and maybe returning at a later time, so...  (shrugs) nothing is in stone yet.  All a moot point if they show up in the next few days to reclaim their spot, but i've learned not to bet the farm on those things.

Posted a table with student notes.

Really... i sort of have my hands full with the current list of students, i'm unsure of my ability to do a 'full' class, so we might have 'small' classes for any number of reasons from the lack of an establish reputation, a new and unknown institutions, exclusive admittance to the academy, whatever.  I'm comfortable with the current number of students, more would be pushing my luck and putting the health of the campaign at risk as i think i might be over reaching.

When I said "full"  I meant with regard to matriculation. A student typically needs to carry a number of classes to be considered a matriculated student.  I don't know what that means for you... or your school.


As there are more than two professors, I would expect that the students would cycle through classes. And the professors would teach a different set of students in the same class over and over again.  Though I suppose you could go the OTHER way and have one teacher teach a set of students their whole set of subjects.  But that seems unreasonable given that Creedrow Ornn and I will likely teach an entirely different manner -- as well as different subjects.

It was presumed, that there would be more students than i can reasonably roleplay.

I'm pretty good, but i'm not about to attempt to roleplay dozens of students for the campaign, more than that, I'm going to presume you dont want to track dozens... maybe hundreds of students.

So i'm good with presuming that the students at orientation are the creme of the interesting ones, and the rest are shades of grey and mediocre.

When it's said and done, there should be four classes of '30' in the academy.  Figure '30' in each 'grade', with the earliest and youngest being between 12 and 13.  They'll be around 16 or so when they graduate is the presumption in three~four years.  (Three is the average, though a short 'trade' program might be two years, while a longer four for those with a scholarly interest.)

Taking my original example, the Harry Potter experience, there were dozens of teachers for hundreds, if not thousands of kids, divide by four grades and 'sortings'.  Yet, you really only focused on a handful of kids, a dozen or so by name?

There were other characters that i really liked in my twilight campaign, that i'll introduce as students just because i really liked them, but for now, the class of twelve is fine.  This is 'advance' academy, so i'm good with going with a college arrangement of classes, as opposed to short classes of a repetitive nature.  So presume you have the kids for ... six to eight hours a week seems reasonable.  You can break up the timing as you like.  Anywhere from 60 minutes to a 120 minutes seems reasonable for a session.  You can arrange for longer ones, if you have say a class trip into the field or some such to make an all day affair or some such.  A holiday break to the capital or Northshire could be several days to a week or two.

I'm really not thinking about it too hard or too far in advance, i have inklings of direction, but till i get to the crossroads i'm putting off actual decisions.

NPC teachers will pick up the slack on stuff you dont want to roleplay or do, and npc students that arent roleplayed will balance out their time so they stay 'busy' in a meta sense.
This message was last edited by the GM at 21:43, Tue 26 Nov 2019.

okay holiday schedule over, so i'm hoping tomorrow to get a new post up for everyone.

Ornn, what's your status, are you still interested in the campaign, or have you lost interest.

I'm going to get ready to put up a want ad soon, and i would like to know if it's for one or two players.  An honest (and realistic) answer is prefered.  If you're not ready to play, or have lost interest, best to know up front than to linger and try and spare my feelings.

Right.  Ornn has fallen off into the 2 week no show with out notice catagory too.

So... I will operate on the presumption that i have two players at the moment, and shortly see about a third... and maybe a forth ?

(shrugs)

sorry guys.

got tied up with stuff during the day, and its too COLD to be typing into the night on the computer at the moment so i'm going to huddle under the comforter of Endure Cold and camp out till morning before posting.

a post here is at the top of my do list for RPOL tomorrow though.

Okay, Private threads updated for Creedrow and Ethan.
I'm presuming Cassandra, and Ornn are bygone conclusions at this point and i've gotton no nudgs on the ad, which i guess is okay too at this time.  Im good with what were doing for now, rather have 2 interested players than a party of less than optimal players mucking up the works.

Let me know if you have comments or thoughts on what's being done.

Private lessons have started, and as such i they will procede at whatever pace the players and myself decide to establish.

Joint threads will quietly move along at what ever pace and direction we decide 'outside' of the private threads.

Some projected 'expectations' are made on the state students will arrive in class based on what happened in other classes.

ie.  They show up to Creedrow's class with practice weapons that i will presume Ethan hands out earlier to get them use to carrying about... and swinging about to build arm strength, as befits their experience with weapons.

These sorts of things i will announce and discuss OOC, though if you have things that will affect students out of class that i dont anticipate please discuss it here.

ie.  Creedrow could assign them reading out of class, and they will arrive to Ethan's class possibly in a sleepy state to reflect that they've been trying to keep up with the reading homework... equally they might show up in Creedrow's class exhausted from doing laps beyond what they are capable of... possibly being absent altogether.

Creedrow, would you like to have me skip forward a day to when the kids have their assignments done?

That would be fine.

Havent forgotten about you guys, but i'm entering a holiday schedule at the moment, and a little distracted to post properly.

Will get stuff up when  i find the time and energy to do so.

sowwy.

Well, that was a busy holiday season for me, hope you all had a good one, going to look at starting things up again.  Hop back in when you can.

*ugh*

need to pick up pizza for the kids, will finish posting later today though is the plan.

Okay... i just posted for Creedrow, a seriously long overdue post i know.  Sorry.

I'm browsing Ethat's last response now, and... it's a lot to look at, too late for something like this particularly after posting for Creedrow, so i'm going to beg off posting for him till tomorrow.


sorry....


but... at least i'm making progress and got Creedrow done?

Ethan, the academy has weapons that you can issue to the kids that are enchanted to only do non-lethal damage, and light padded armor that has been enchanted with temp hit points.

Just so we understand, when you 'let the class talk among themselves', do not expect me to roleplay an entire class.

At most i might do a handful and give you a sampling of what's going on, but unless you're going to engage in conversation with specific students you're only going to get the most general response from the class room.  not cause theyre shy, but cause i'm not going to type a response for nearly a dozen students roleplaying among themselves...

Duly noted.

But in most of the classes, I've ever been a part of there were those students that seemed to have the most to say.  Whether they were speaking for the entire class or not.

And then there were those students that gravitated to the teacher and felt comfortable enough to speak to be judged by their teacher and allow that acceptance to over arch... whatever other judgment they'd get from the rest of their peers.

While MOST students will only answer those questions made DIRECTLY of them.

There were no times when the class would "discuss amongst themselves..."
... UNLESS two champions were selected to debate some singular points.
Just my experience.

All sorts of irritated at the moment.

The long ~> short story is my computer died.  Been in need of a new one since october of last year and was going to pick one up in november, but was told by my bff, that she was giving me a computer for xmas, dont buy one....


so i didnt, the catch was she was building it from scratch, has all the components bought, and ... like most xmas gifts for kids, some assembly required.

Current computer had a current fatal moment, and... i tell her i need SOMETHING to work on...

I'm told the end of this month... then... this corona thing... gets worse... now i'm told...  not sure when.

aside from cutting into my rpol time, this has murdered my professional functional ability.

Ive since reinstalled the o/s for an old, craptastic computer so i can at least get on to rpol, but... other aspects won't be solved with this, any who... i plan to read up and try and get back in the swing of things, if this lapse has had a fatal effect on your participation, i apologize.

Sadly, I'm on RPOL more often than most of my players. ... or perhaps not sadly as being participory on a roleplaying system allows me to manage my emotional  health (And the method/madness is effective.)

Anyway I am here and still interested.

I'm still here.