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01:57, 29th March 2024 (GMT+0)

[OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Posted by ConspiratorFor group 0
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 814 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sun 22 Aug 2021
at 11:05
  • msg #629

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Thanks for coming everyone! I just wrote a wall of text, so let's just say Tidelan distributed everyones payments after the fight but before the horizontal line (which marks a conversation later with Victor alone [Thx for the awesome RP opportunity!])

Here is the payout:

Wightvane: 50 --> 75 Gold (sum +25)
Tusk: 5 --> 0 Gold (sum -5)
Izayah: 50 --> 0 Gold (sum -50)


LMK if I missed anyone :) (I'm aware Carmen tried to place a bet on the enemy team, which is an illegal move. Thus, I nullified her bet [you lose no money, but also don't make any for winning])

I'm making the changes to my inventory now (sum +30 for bets, FINAL SUM -70 for tournie costs), so if you have no problems all of you go ahead and do that when you get a chance.

By the way, since Chelsie didn't even show up, let alone heal anyone, I gave her payment to Victor instead, who I felt bad for loving watching go full panic mode while juggling fallen bodies. I hope she doesn't mind, considering the situation.

When @Conspirator or @Narrator gets a chance to roll/decide a body count for spectators, as well as if any sideline betting occurred, I'll make the monetary changes necessary.

Though it would be hilarious if like four people showed up to watch, I gotta say Tidelan would not have done anything differently. He gives everything 100%, just about.
Malkus
player, 734 posts
AC 18 | HP 33/33 | PP 11
Sun 22 Aug 2021
at 12:03
  • msg #630

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

In reply to Tidelan Wavyrus (msg # 629):

I bet 20gp
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 815 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sun 22 Aug 2021
at 12:11
  • msg #631

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Gotcha, thanks for the honesty.
Sai Nightbreeze
player, 311 posts
Smells of tannin
AC 17, HP 31 / 31
Sun 22 Aug 2021
at 13:15
  • msg #632

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Yeah, I put in 20 as well.
Carmen Diaz
player, 664 posts
AC 18 | HP 22/22 | PP 12
Warlock Bounty Hunter
Sun 22 Aug 2021
at 13:16
  • msg #633

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

/sadface

I was t actually fully aware of the rules. I thought the tournament had a winners prize and was hedging my bets. I did retcon and say I would have changed my bet when told.
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 816 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sun 22 Aug 2021
at 13:20
  • msg #634

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

quote:
Yeah, I put in 20 as well.


Ty ty , I marked it down

quote:
/sadface

I was t actually fully aware of the rules. I thought the tournament had a winners prize and was hedging my bets. I did retcon and say I would have changed my bet when told.


When did you retcon? If you changed to bet on your own team before Izayah's first turn, I'll pay you out, but otherwise I gotta stick to my word, soz.

The deadline is the beginning of the fight, 'cus it's too much to allow a retcon after a fight has already progressed. Since you have TWO two betting options ([YES] or [NO]), analyzing the fight does actually grant unfair benefits, even though you can't place freely.
Conspirator
GM, 1394 posts
Just here to help
Mon 23 Aug 2021
at 08:55
  • msg #635

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

196 people paid to see the event. 215gp was bet on team A, 105gp was bet on Team B. Each member of Team A gets 400 xp. Each member of Team B gets 200. Also, don't forget, every entrant spends 1 downtime unit, and gets 1 xp for it.
This message was last edited by the GM at 08:58, Mon 23 Aug 2021.
Tiria Nailo
player, 121 posts
HP: 20/20 AC:14-17 PP12
{not so} powerful wizard
Mon 23 Aug 2021
at 09:05
  • msg #636

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Ooooh yes! That tasty, tasty XP!
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 817 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Tue 24 Aug 2021
at 01:10
  • msg #637

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Just realizing I wrote 'a small part' on the advertisement page!

I don't know how taxing gamblers works, but Tidelan's idea of a small part would be like 5%

I'll mark it down like that for now, but tell me if you think it should be a different rate, Conspirator!
Conspirator
GM, 1404 posts
Just here to help
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 06:13
  • msg #638

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

5% is fine with me, but will you make enough to pay the winners what you promised? You kept 10% of the winning bets on the last tournament.
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 822 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 07:35
  • msg #639

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Hm, I think we have a dissonance in how we interpreted the information...

quote:
To watch the great fight is just one gold!

A fighter can risk fifty gold or less on their team.

There will be medics to keep fighters safe!

A winner who did risk gold will get back their gold and a half!

The watching countrymen may bet on the fight together, but a small part will go to the Arena Master

Come and enjoy the great fight!


This line [highlighted] wasn't very clear, but the ""house"" is only recording the gambling taking place, not paying anything out.

Reasons stands that individuals would still place bets among themselves, because 'gambling' at heart is ''high risk high reward''. Doing the math, 320 gold was bet by 2 to 196 people. Let us say that 50% of the attendees placed a bet (probably not that high, but this is just to explain the concept of 'house-less betting')

Then, 98 people placed 320 gold. Again, who put in what will be different, but let's just say everyone placed the same quantity. Then, 98 people placed 3 gold 2 silver and 6 copper.

Thus, 66 people would have bet on Team A while 32 people would have bet on Team B.

Hence, thirty two people lost their money, while sixty six people each got paid back 4 gold 8 silver 4 copper, for a total gain of roughly 148% what they put in.

(i forgot to subtract my 5% off the top, but the concept is identical)

tl;dr I don't have to pay any money and the gamblers will still show up, with this method

If this changes your calculations for how many people place bets, then I will also update my numbers accordingly when notified. Basically, this system is a lot like horse racing (i think, i've only gone once).
Carmen Diaz
player, 670 posts
AC 18 | HP 22/22 | PP 12
Warlock Bounty Hunter
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 07:36
  • msg #640

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

I thought that you were using the normal downtime units for managing a business for working out the profits for running an arena?
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 823 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 07:51
  • msg #641

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

I think I'm setting the fares, and the GM decides what to roll for them off-screen. That's how we've been doing it so far?

Besides, a battle arena isn't really a traditional business, so those rules don't work for it very well at all.

What is there to pay upkeep for? The field? Hell no, it's just clamped dirt with a bit of permafrost... and terrain damage in 5e is very scarce in RAW (iirc, most AOEs specifically harm only characters)

The bleachers? They are made from cut stone, so they have at least a few in-game years before I'd have to repair them, even in this weather and location.

We don't have any contracts, products or employees, so there is nothing to pay regularly either.

Tl;dr I am a genius [180 IQ] who has found a loophole in the system [lawyers hate me] and if you are envious [u mad bro?] just realize that you could have done it too but I thought of it first! [#maverick]

(... /s, of course :P <3)

Actually, writing this post gave me some ideas to expand the business....
Carmen Diaz
player, 671 posts
AC 18 | HP 22/22 | PP 12
Warlock Bounty Hunter
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 07:57
  • msg #642

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Quite honestly I thought that had been ruled upon by the GM's after the last arena.
Conspirator
GM, 1412 posts
Just here to help
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 08:08
  • msg #643

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

I don't recall ruling that. Since the arena isn't open every day, and for the reasons Tidelan mentioned, the normal running a business table makes no sense. As for having enough to pay out, I meant for the players who bet on themselves. You offered the winners 150% of their bets.
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 825 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 08:14
  • msg #644

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Now that you mention it, I recall a similar conversation, but seeing as how the GMs ran the calculations this time around, perhaps that discussion had been left open-ended?

I can't say much more, since I don't really remember any specifics about what had been talked about.

There is no problem with me if the players / GMs want to rehash the argument, since I'm also looking for a satisfactory set-up. Currently, I'm leaning a bit more towards 'verisimilitude which rewards in game efforts' over 'fairness which rewards out of game efforts' since this is a sandbox style game, and lowering player agency (especially unique ideas like this one) doesn't seem like it's worth an attempt to stick to some arbitrary balance.

TBH; the whole economy of the world (at least what we've seen so far) seems very odd, and I do recall talking about that just a tiny bit before (pretty sure it was near the start of the game, even)

Looking at how the GMs have been running the economy, it seems they don't have much planned behind the scenes, which is totally okay. It's not reasonable to expect them to develop everything before they reveal it.

Yet, when it comes to a dynamic, interdependent system like global, regional or local economies, you should at least lay a framework before introducing any absolute values.

I'm a bit too tired to explain exactly what I mean with good examples, but in simpler terms I'm saying that the whole system is kind of made up on the spot (no condescension intended) as the players raise questions.

That's fine given the circumstances, but it is astronomically improbable to result in a situation with a balanced economy, anywhere. At this point, the most that can probably be done without an overhaul (which would require either major retcons, shoe-horned lore justification, and/or huge changes that the players may not unanimously agree with) would be attempting to make a sense of the chaos. Basically, the residents of this world would have to accept that money IS subjective, and very much more so than it is in other settings. They would know the only way to succeed as a merchant long-term would be adaptability and knowledge.

This isn't a totally unique issue with this game either, DND in general does very little to answer the question of how things like literally godlike magic would affect a land's economy.

That is because the focus of DND is adventuring, and the only intended 'economy' is probably ''did i loot enough gold from the fire giants to buy a mythril sword plus two'' or variants thereof.

Basically, if any of us wanted to, we could have made ten thousand gold by now simply by becoming murder hoboes. Not like much can stop us, right?

The real threat wouldn't be getting assassinated in your sleep, having good-aligned PCs hunt you, or having to fight the whole town guard equipped with nets and long-range weaponry but being kicked from the game.

honestly the more i think about it, I just pity those who would mainly find enjoyment in this game through economy manipulation. That is a totally legitimate playstyle that is mostly shattered by the fact that so much is possible for a PC given their existence level, that running a business is probably inferior in terms of monetary gain to doing literally almost anything else.
Tidelan Wavyrus
player, 826 posts
Level 4, HP 39/39
AC 15, PP 15
Sat 28 Aug 2021
at 08:16
  • msg #645

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

I think I've already paid out the PCs who won bets?

Just above in this thread, actually.
Conspirator
GM, 1415 posts
Just here to help
Mon 30 Aug 2021
at 22:09
  • msg #646

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Tidelan Wavyrus:
...but in simpler terms I'm saying that the whole system is kind of made up on the spot (no condescension intended) as the players raise questions.

I think he's onto us!
This message was last edited by the GM at 22:11, Mon 30 Aug 2021.
Victor Iusticia
player, 650 posts
AC19 DC13 PP10
31/31 HP 0 THP
Sun 19 Jun 2022
at 21:33
  • msg #647

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Let's move things over here, I'd forgotten this thread existed...

Attention residents of Smith's Gambit!

I am wanting to hold some competitions at Victor’s Arena in the not too distant future and would like to know if there is sufficient interest in the following events.
As players are restricted to one business, and I intend to have Tiria run her business for profit, any profits from Victor’s Arena will be put into prizes and/or quest rewards to capture monsters to be fought in the arena.
I will also be cheeky here and suggest that the GMs may choose throw some XP rewards around in a similar fashion to past events, who knows...

Single Elimination Martial Combat:
No magic that uses a spell slot or ritual cast is permitted - Single Elimination format.
Characters may take a short rest between rounds to expend hit die etc.
First to land 5 blows, else to cause your opponent to yield or fall unconscious is declared the victor.

30gp entry fee.
40% goes to to first place, 30% to second, 20% to third, 10% to healers or future prizes if no healing is required.
Structure would require 4, 8 or 16 entrants to set up the appropriate brackets.
Our lovely GMs may facilitate some open slots with an NPC or two, otherwise we’ll have some characters getting a bye in the first round. I will use a fancy random number generator to decide placement in brackets.

Free For All Martial Combat:
No magic that uses a spell slot or ritual cast is permitted.
10gp entry fee.
80% goes to the last person standing, 20% to healers or future prizes if no healing is required.
At least 4 participants desired for this one.

Chilli Cook-off:
Magic is encouraged, with judges awarding bonuses for creative use.
Three criteria to be scored and weighted equally, which each expected to be roleplayed:

Quality of gathered ingredients (Survival wisdom based ability check)
Cooking ability (Cooking Utensil dexterity based ability check)
Presentation (Performance charisma based ability check)

No entry fee, prizes sponsored by Victor: 30 gp for first place, 20 gp for second.
Three volunteer Judges to choose a winner, some banter is expected.
At least 4 participants desired for this one.

Archery Contest:
Straw ranged targets set at 40', 80', 120’ and 160' will test characters' abilities to hit targets, with an AC for the bullseye, inner ring, middle ring and outer ring. Those whose longest range is not long enough can still attempt the shot with disadvantage and a -2 penalty to hit.
Spellcasters can utilize magical cantrips only. 2 shots at each target with a total of 8 shots to achieve a final score.
20gp entry fee. 50% to first place, 30% to second, 20% to third.
At least 4 participants desired for this one.

Victor insists on acting as bookie by holding on to funds for security of any bets made on any of these events. He will be charging a 5% fee on the amount won which is to be put aside for future prizes/trophies etc.

For the moment I am focused on these particular ideas but am open to other suggestions via PM.

Table of Interest
EventCharacter to participateHealers/Judges
Single Elimination Martial CombatIzayah, Malkus, Sovok 
Free for All Martial CombatIzayah, Malkus, Sovok 
Chilli Cook-offMalkus 
Archery ContestIzayah, TuskN/A

Brohm of Clan Stonehelm:
So Victors' martial tournaments allow for Cantrips, and magic items?

So long as they do not involve use of a spell slot or ritual casting then they are fair game.

A Flaming Longsword +3 would be fine if you have one, the Eldritch Blast cantrip would be fine, using charges from a wand of Web would be fine. Class features like Flurry of Blows, Favored Foe and Channel Divinity are fine as would be spellcasting through class features like sorcery points or racial features.

Familiars (ritual cast), Ring of Spell Storing (requires slots to be expended to charge it),  Find Steed and Paladin Smites etc would not be allowed.

The spirit of these competitions is displays of martial prowess rather than that of devastating magic.
There will be other spell focused competitions down the line.

I'm hoping at least a few of the fights in the single elimination combats to be ended with the first to 5 blows.
This message was last edited by the player at 11:23, Tue 21 June 2022.
Tusk Bristleback
player, 228 posts
16 AC | 28/28 hp | 0 thp
Let slip the hogs of war
Sun 19 Jun 2022
at 23:11
  • msg #648

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Ah screw it, sign me up for the archery one.


If needed to fill out your list, I'll drag Malkus along with. He'll happily participate if it improves the enjoyment of others, won't you?

/Glares at the Paladin
Sovok
player, 55 posts
Male, Goliath, Barbarian
AC.:14, HP.:36/36, PP:13
Sun 19 Jun 2022
at 23:29
  • msg #649

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Sovok leans down to the board,scrawling a mark, a rune of some kind, upon the sheet.  He then passes the small man the required coins.  Both martial contests will he compete in.
Conspirator
GM, 1810 posts
Just here to help
Tue 21 Jun 2022
at 02:41
  • msg #650

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Tusk and Malkus must enter different contests.
Malkus
player, 944 posts
AC 19 | HP 41/41 | PP 11
AC 13 | HP 26/26 | PP 14
Tue 21 Jun 2022
at 09:13
  • msg #651

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

In reply to Conspirator (msg # 650):

Ok.

Tusk will do archery.

Malkus will do the first two martials.
Malkus
player, 945 posts
AC 19 | HP 41/41 | PP 11
AC 13 | HP 26/26 | PP 14
Tue 21 Jun 2022
at 10:44
  • msg #652

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

Malkus:
In reply to Conspirator (msg # 650):

Ok.

Tusk will do archery.

Malkus will do the first two martials.


What the heck -- I'll also enter the chili cook-off
Victor Iusticia
player, 660 posts
AC21 DC13 PP10
31/31 HP 0 THP
Sat 2 Jul 2022
at 00:17
  • msg #653

Re: [OOC] Arena Signup and OOC chat!

*Bump*
Any further interest in this at the moment or shall I put it on the back burner?
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