If you're allowing Hamaraki to stack, with no penalty, I would be explicitly with that, as you are allowing EVERY character to get +1AC for 3GP, with literally no downside.
As RAW, it doesn't stack, and is only good for spellcasters who want to enchant it as a cheaper alternative to Bracers of Armour.

For your Lamellar Cuiraass - https://aonprd.com/EquipmentAr...e=Lamellar%20cuirass


Also - https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2...be-made-with-Mithral

Why not have Mithril Chain Shirt, for AC+4 Dex+6 ACP-0?

Personally, I get all my mechanics from Archives of Nethys, as even Paizo now backs them, and allows correct names unlike d20pfsrd.

In reply to The Meta (msg # 244):



In my printing of the core rule book, it says that only the armor with the highest AC counts, and benefits from multiple armor do not stack.

That makes absolutely no sense to me, but that is what it says.

Was this... hopefully altered at some point?

And I didn't realize in Pathfinder  treated Quilted cloth better than silk... interesting... oh well, ... the sling is a clear example of realism being tossed out the window too.

In the words of Yoda,  got to unlearn what I have learned.

It was not changed.

By RAW....

Only circumstances bonuses from different sources stack..
And dodge bonuses stack...

No other bonus type stacks with itself....

Some people confuse armor and shield, and call both armor bonuses, but technically a shield is a shield bonus not an armor bonus.

There's a lot that's unrealistic, don't forget about the heavy crossbow.  Various editions of D&D have switched back and forth between a round measured in seconds and one measured in a minute.  Ultimately, you'll satisfy neither group.  While swinging a club only takes a second, reloading a heavy crossbow requires a winch and crank arrangement (and a lot of time).

About the closest that I've ever seen to a satisfactory balance goes back to the movie Hawk the Slayer, which was done back in the 1980s.
This message was last edited by the player at 19:55, Tue 31 Mar 2020.

Personally, yes my preference is to allow haramaki. That preference is based on the inferences presented by many other GM's, if you guys as a whole express issue with it then I will take it as a majority vote not to use it. The reason I do not want it debated here is it's clearly a issue of R.A.I. with r.a.w. presenting a mildly confusing item. It's wildly regarded as a unique beasty. We don't need to get into all that.


I think there is an English interpretation of the lamellar, I see what you are saying, but it still looks like a light breastplate and leather shoulder gaurds. The wording could suggest both are made from leather based on the syntax though.

A breastplate, coupled with that it says lamellars are commonly made of metals but uncommonly uses stone or leather (yes, I see how it says leather plates, a weird thing to say) says to me it uses metal.

Once more, I feel a preference to say yes to this.

That archive I have was something I presented to other GM's and they approved.
I feel this justifies my perspective on it.


As for armor stacking. Yes, that's changed. Nevermind armor piecemeal mechanics you can find stacking armor rules with how magic armor/items stack.

In reply to The Meta (msg # 249):

If there's something you don't like, you can always change it.   Just warn us when you make house rules.  :)

In reply to The Meta (msg # 249):



My opinion is this, its your game, and if you want to  having stacking armor, that'f fine by me, to a certain reason of course, I'm just trying to make sure I have the rules right, mostly.

In reply to Aithne (msg # 250):

Please remember, I make a point not to be arbitrary. I've said it multiple times, I dont just make things up on the fly and most everything I say is either due to researched understanding or straight from the rules. Where there is a divide in understanding, I try to keep with RAW but otherwise will go with the majority 'opinion' on RAI.

That said. I just started class but I will get back to this after and show where and how armor stacks with quotes. I encourage you guys to look over piecemail armor rules.
This message was last edited by the GM at 20:39, Tue 31 Mar 2020.

https://aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?...nal%20Rule%20Systems Piecemeal Armour rules, for those interested.

As a note, I also love Nethys. great resource, I remember when he first started making his site.

A lot of the kingmaker stuff I've been reading recently is off Nethy's rather than paizo.

I use paizo more though because of it's forum space.

Thank you for posting the link.

see here:
https://rpg.stackexchange.com/...efit-from-two-armors

that, of course, is not an official source but it shows how stacking can work and the sort of stacking I have in mind when I say yes you can stack and yes things have changed.

It is absolutely correct that AC, or armor bonus to ac, does not stack. you get the highest of all contributors and that's that. However, Things like Quilted cloths DR is not an armor bonus.

Note how they say about where the normal ac is bypassed that the force armors armor bonus works. this shows a different reason for amror stacking then just for more ac, you can stack for 'back up' armor already on you.

In piecemeal armor, Linked by Cornelius and the paizo link is below.

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamem...les/piecemeal-armor/

There are mechanics for how different layers of armor will change your armor into a heavier tier when it has like layering as heavier armors. This can also be used in the reverse. Changing the way AC stacking works, you actually have a way to wear mithral plate over a chain shirt and its half plate body armor. Like buying pieces of a suit rather than the whole suit. They are effectively stacking but mechanically counting as a higher armor. Then, say something is sundered, you lose that piece but otherwise only downgrade the armor mechanics. This also works with magic armor, you no longer need to toss or sell that mithral chain shirt youve ran with for 10 levels.... just because you are ready for some full plate. You can piece it with other armor to keep the magic and have the new armor bonus.

That example I showed, was pushing it in regards to light armor, its weight is some 20 lbs and its quite a few layers. It would probably actually count as a type of medium armor.

People have also dissected the act of putting a +1 haramaki with + effects in with a +5 platemail... and presented you get the +5 platemail and the effects from the haramaki. I'm trying to find that forum thread, when I find it I will post it.

The piecemeal mechanic creates segement zones of armor, you can actually have just a sleave be enchanted, or one enchantment on one sleave and a different enchantment on another sleave, while the rest of your armor is mundane.
(these rules also account for partially wearing armor, cool stuff).
(also, as a note, in there is the Lemallar cuirass and the wording is shifted enough to clarify RAI. I just saw it.

*Lamellar Cuirass: This cuirass is made of lacquered leather plates bound together and fitted over a silk shirt. It is sometimes worn alone, especially during ceremonial occasions when wearing other armor is frowned upon.

Demonstrating you are right, in large, on this cornelius. two out of three so far. Unfortunate, seems me and several others were wrong about it and I will have to find another decent base.)


My class is winding down now so I will be posting in the IC thread soon.

In reply to The Meta (msg # 252):

It was not my intention to say or imply that any changes made are/were arbitrary.

Okay so we are using optional rules from rulebook that's fine, we all know now :), it wouldn't have affected my build :).

Anyone need a bodyguard or mercenary?

Humble fist for hire here.

Potentially, but I need to arrange a revenue stream first.

I apologize for not getting to your dailies, Aithne and Aisent, you guys can post more though while waiting.
also, aithne, what alchemy are you doing?

It's okay I can't post my 3rd day Dailies until I know what the plan is from Kalven.

Aisent might not of thought this jumping in the water through :), but then again she does suffer from that low stat.....common sense is not so common :)

In reply to The Meta (msg # 260):

Let's see....making Sunrods.

This is totally a useless and unimportant  fact, but the fact that cloth  is sold in square feet in this game always makes me snicker, considering that no one does that in the real world ever, and it would result in a lot of wasted material.

Useless fact.

that is snicker worthy, lol.

The rules for siege  weapons state that I can armor a siege weapon.

I have been running with this assumption for vehicles as well, which could be incredibly dangerous.  So, DM yay, or nay on this?

Also, if anyone wants to know what the total lifting capacity for an airship is, I know someone else is purchasing one, let me know, since its more than 30 tons, whether you use hydrogen or not, what kind does matter though.

if you see paizo rules that say you can do it, the default is you can do it.

If you mean, 'can I use the siege weapons armor rules for vessels?' I will have to go read them to see if they are translateable. I am pretty sure there is a modification in the vessel rules that represents armor for vessels, theres also that you can always use the custom material per 5'x5' square thingamajig to add metal plating on vehicles as armor... limited by its maximum weight of course.

There are several ways to handle it, for sure.

Do you want me to look at the siege weapons armor rules?

In reply to The Meta (msg # 266):


While the vessel rules are interesting, their armored sails are a bit too hyper-specific for what I am after. The siege weapon modification is more streamlined as well, and allows for greater range of possibilities for construction, but would possibly grant vehicles greater AC, since the driver's statistics help to determine AC for the vehicle.

Given all this, the completely from scratch approach, or unit by square would allow me to do what I want, while being a bit more expensive, without complicating things over much.     I'll post links to the ship c rules and siege rules later.

thank you, perhaps post them to the player share space thread

Is it all right if we buy crafting materials in bulk, say enough to create a dozen at a time, instead of just one at a time?