0: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)   Posted by GM StarMaster.Group: 0
Aniyu
 player, 24 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Fri 16 Oct 2020
at 17:33
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
@GM: I'm not sure if this matters on the information given, but Aniyu does have Endure Elements constantly on, so he can get as close as possible without taking Environmental Damage. With this in mind, am I able to get within 60' while flying?
GM StarMaster
 GM, 45 posts
Fri 16 Oct 2020
at 22:54
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
Endure Elements doesn't do what you think it does. Not only is the upper limit 140 degrees, but it doesn't stop you from taking fire damage. Magma is about 1,300 degrees--way beyond what the spell can handle. Just getting close to it causes severe fire/burn damage.

Flying 60 feet above it would be tolerable if the air currents were in your favor. It wouldn't affect the roles, since I was already going with you flying close enough to see the creatures.
Aniyu
 player, 25 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 03:32
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
I think I'm of an inclination that any intensity of heat above Endure Elements becomes an Environmental Concern (ie: heat above 140 degrees would cause fire damage per round). Are you suggesting there is a range of heat that doesn't cause damage but is not covered by Endure Elements?

Otherwise, If you tell me I'll take 5 Fire Damage per Round if I'm within X feet of the magma -- I can work with that info too (not with Endure Elements, but probably Fire Elemental Wild Shape).
GM StarMaster
 GM, 48 posts
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 05:26
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
I suspect Endure Elements' temperature range was meant to cover the range found on Earth, which are all natural temperatures. Hottest temperature recorded on Earth was 134 degrees in Death Valley in 1931, so Endure Elements covers that. But, we're talking about a fantasy world where magic is real, so there can be places where the temperature might exceed the 140 mark.

What Endure Elements is meant to do is to protect you from the collateral issues of high heat or extreme cold--thirst, dehydration, searing your lungs from the hot air, etc. Once you enter an area where the temperature would be higher than that, the protect doesn't end but it's not going to be all encompassing any more.


Lava flows can get as hot as 1,600 degrees while magma can reach 2,100 degrees.
So, yes, getting within 30 feet of the magma will cause damage. How much depends on other factors: angle of exposure, air flow, the reflectiveness of what you are wearing, toxic fumes, and the actual temperature. The damage rises exponentially as you get closer. Within 30 feet, 4 points of fire damage per round; within 20 feet, 16 points of damage per round and 2nd degree burns on exposed skin; within 10 feet, 64 points of damage per round; within 5 feet, 250 points of fire damage per round.
Trickster
 player, 17 posts
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 05:42
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
On the other hand if you can scoop it up with a bucket we can power a forge for a long time.
Aniyu
 player, 27 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 14:01
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
I simply believed the intent of the spell was enough that a person didn't have to worry about mundane discomfort in regards to the natural world. I totally agree that it does not cover anything that becomes damage. If you say this volcano is beyond the scope of Endure Elements -- I'm totally fine with that. I was never arguing that, I was just making sure you remembered my defenses before giving me a description. For the record -- Aniyu also doesn't breathe.

You're the GM -- so happy to go with whatever. Your risk assessment of lava/magma is much higher than the standard Pathfinder Environmental Damage system. Again -- your call, but typically touching magma/lava deals 2d6 per round. Your current numbers suggest any commoner that gets within 20' of lava is immediately burned to cinders (16 hp likely being enough to insta-kill a level 1 character).

Either way, in Fire Elemental form, Aniyu has Fire Resistance 20, so he can be just beyond 20' of the lava without issue. As noted, he also doesn't breathe.

I really don't mean to whine about this. It is unfortunate that I made a character all about being 'in tune with the elements/nature' and the first encounter is 'Oh no, you're not THAT in tune, you can't even go NEAR this natural phenomena'. It was just a little disappointing, and I wanted to understand so I could adjust the character to mechanically fit the idea I had.

This message was last edited by the player at 20:35, Sat 17 Oct.

Ozrus Wither
 player, 21 posts
 Elf Druid/Wizard
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 20:03
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
Does the Tongues spell work with written languages? Or only spoken languages? Ozrus has one casting available, but I wasn't sure it would be useful.

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/t/tongues/
Trickster
 player, 18 posts
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 20:34
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
Ozrus Wither:
Does the Tongues spell work with written languages? Or only spoken languages? Ozrus has one casting available, but I wasn't sure it would be useful.

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/t/tongues/


I thought another spell covered writings. https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic...omprehend-languages/
Tyrol Halverschlagen
 player, 13 posts
 Gnome Alchemist/Rogue
 AC: 29/18/25; HP: 120/120
Sat 17 Oct 2020
at 20:44
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
The spell Tongues is poorly worded in the first place, but I meant Comprehend Languages and wrote Tongues instead. Oops. Tyrol has both.
Aniyu
 player, 31 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Tue 20 Oct 2020
at 19:08
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
@GM: How is timing going to be handled in this game? For example, the Mt Doom Investigation thread has probably only taken about 5 minutes of time (if even). The other threads are spending hours working on reading. How are we going to get on the same timeline in order to reconvene?
GM StarMaster
 GM, 54 posts
Tue 20 Oct 2020
at 19:40
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
Those going through the journals were taking hours to do so, and those investigating the paintings are probably on the same schedule. It was taking longer to decipher the writing than just what it took to read my post.

Two of them have now flown off. It will probably be 12 hours or more before they return.

In the Mt. Doom recon, more time goes by than what a single line post indicates. Teleporting there was instantaneous, but after that, several minutes (at least) were spent on observing what you saw. Each of you would have spent time studying the various aspects of the landscape and then the creatures.

If those at Mt. Doom return sooner, then you'll have to wait for the others to finish what they are doing.
Aniyu
 player, 33 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 14:57
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
@Mount Doom Investigation Thread: I got more information from the GM in PMs, so I did an Edit on my previous post instead of replying to myself. Just noting here so people see the changes!
Aniyu
 player, 34 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 18:32
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
After extended conversations with the GM, I will be stepping out of this game.

I don't join Level 10 Gestalt Mythic games to have the GM say "Uh, it just doesn't work" over and over again to everything I try. I don't join Level 10 Gestalt Mythic games for CR 3 creatures to be untouchable.

The story as to why I can't possibly succeed on one of these tasks keeps changing -- from 'you failed because they're immune/resistant (a +20 to the DC seems like immune with more steps to me) because of reasons' to 'I don't like the rules as written, as far as I understand them' to 'actually, you did succeed, you just didn't get the thing you wanted' to 'the situation doesn't allow a check' -- which seems like a GM who just doesn't want me to succeed.

Please feel free to do whatever you'd like with Aniyu.
Trickster
 player, 22 posts
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 18:49
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
You're jumping the gun mate. Been with this DM near on a decade. Good luck and safe travels but a DM whom story is king, well that is rare and worth.
Aniyu
 player, 35 posts
 Human Winter Witch/Druid
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 19:00
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
I've had over a dozen PMs with the GM on these topics. I feel confident I am not jumping the gun. Perhaps it's personal then? Another reason I should step out.

Enjoy yourself either way! There isn't one way to play games, and I'm not suggesting people shouldn't have fun with the GM. Personally, I believe The GM's story should not be king -- the PC's stories should be king. I want a GM who is excited for my clever ideas, not invalidating my abilities because they threaten his story.

To each their own, but I join role-playing games to make the story, not be told a story.
Ki'nae Bashemath
 player, 25 posts
 Gunslinger/Steelfist
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 19:54
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
I will be following suit with Aniyu as well, and will be leaving the game. I don't not feel as though the GMs style and my own play style necessarily mesh in the best way for this game, nor do I feel as though the number of people and the way it is handled is best conducive to great storytelling.

Good gaming to all of you, and happy role- and rolling.
Kurat
 player, 31 posts
 Hobgoblin Monk/Wizard
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 23:00
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
Take care to both of you. Happy Gaming

I'm staying though. I didn't like the players taking my mirror but I'll just not loan them anything in the future.....
Hardcore Jimmy
 player, 3 posts
 Half-Elf Ranger/Rogue
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 23:33
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
In reply to Aniyu (msg # 143):
Announcing you are leaving, and smearing the gm, promoting a leave party... is gauche. You dont know what the gm is going through, though you do know 2020 is shit, but you want to make more drama?

This gm has been one of the most patient and understanding of all the ones i've ever been with, and he has always offered to work with me.

I too am staying, take your smear drama elsewhere please.

This message was last edited by the player at 23:36, Wed 21 Oct.

Ozrus Wither
 player, 26 posts
 Elf Druid/Wizard
Wed 21 Oct 2020
at 23:48
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
Kurat:
I'm staying though. I didn't like the players taking my mirror but I'll just not loan them anything in the future.....

Haha, why does everyone keep assuming Ozrus took the mirror with him? :-P I mean, if you want him to have taken it for story flavor reasons, sure, perhaps he forgot to give it back. But otherwise I see no reason he wouldn't have given it back after borrowing it. I even mentioned he should have left it behind in my last post.

All in all though, I will let you guys decide if it is still there or not. Just know that if he did take it, it was accidental. It would kind of be funny if Ozrus was an accidental kleptomaniac.
Lucien Soulban
 player, 39 posts
 Human Paladin/Sorcerer
Thu 22 Oct 2020
at 04:18
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
  It's rare when I jump ship at all. More than a little interested as to how this is going to go. That being said Mt. Doom Recon will need some sort of update on how this is going to play out since we lost 1/3rd of the team.
Vogh Kath
 player, 19 posts
 Human Bard/Oracle
Thu 22 Oct 2020
at 07:11
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
That is too bad for those players leaving.  I am not going anywhere.
Hardcore Jimmy
 player, 4 posts
 Half-Elf Ranger/Rogue
Thu 22 Oct 2020
at 07:47
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
In reply to Lucien Soulban (msg # 148):

once I stop fooling around in char creation (I have a problem >_< sorry), I can probably join the mt doom team and fill the gaps left by those who left.
GM StarMaster
 GM, 57 posts
Thu 22 Oct 2020
at 15:18
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
For the moment, those two characters are still around as NPCs.

For the record, I'm sorry those two players left, but in Bash's case, she was probably right. Her playing style didn't seem to be mesh with my GMing style. Most of the time, I had no idea what she was even saying!

Since this thread is in Group 0, both of them can still read the posts. They are both welcome back if they change their mind at some point.

In my own defense regarding Aniyu, I can only tell you how it went from my point of view.

Aniyu made an Intimidate check against the mephit, plus he cast a few spells and such. It wasn't that the Intimidation didn't work, it just didn't produce the results that Aniyu wanted or was expecting from the RAW. In all fairness, it may be that I didn't fully understand what he was trying to accomplish, or he may have not written his post well enough to convey that.

In any case, he then wanted to know why it didn't work. I thought that was a perfectly reasonable request, so I tried to explain it to him in a PM. First of all, the mephit was an extraplanar creature--it didn't think or react the same way a mortal 'human' from the Prime Material Plane did. Second, it was already being intimidated long term by something else. Third, it was a fire creature--there's nothing more intimidating than fire so it wasn't going to be intimidate easily.

That was my thinking, at any rate. He wasn't happy with that answer because it wasn't in the rules. Nowhere did it say there could be be conditional modifiers or extenuating circumstances. He felt that the Hit Dice of the creature was enough to allow for all of that.

When he wasn't happy/satisfied with my answer, I tried explaining it in a different way. He still couldn't accept it. So I tried yet a third time. Still wouldn't see it. So, I didn't keep changing the rules--I just tried to explain the situation to him differently. But, since none of them let him do what he was trying to do, it suddenly had to be 'personal'. Of course, it wasn't.

I have no idea how he could come up with that thought, since I don't know him personally, I've never played in any game with him that I know of, and I don't believe he's been in any of my other games that I GM (though 200+ players across 10 years is a bit hard to remember).

Anyway, while his post was a bit hurtful and annoying, I have no hard feelings against him. He's perfectly welcome back at any time.

Thanks for the kind words from Trickster and Hardcore Jimmy.
Hardcore Jimmy
 player, 5 posts
 Half-Elf Ranger/Rogue
Thu 22 Oct 2020
at 20:40
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
I'm pretty sure there are things in the rules for that sort of thing. Circumstantial bonuses and penalties, for one. It's like trying to stealth in bright light... or while running... you get a -20.

charsima skills often have modifiers for social conflicts depending on circumstances.

Intimidate even lists a few modifiers, showing there are things that modify the situation and roll.
Lucien Soulban
 player, 41 posts
 Human Paladin/Sorcerer
Thu 22 Oct 2020
at 23:11
Re: 7: Hole In the Wall Pub (OOCs)
In reply to Hardcore Jimmy (msg # 152):

There are. And in several places it also notes the GM has the right to push certain modifiers beyond reach. Golden rule at the end of the day. GM says this is it this is it.