In reply to Sani Stormstruck (msg # 71):

All those vines and memes just faithfully waiting to be recreated in D&D.

"What have you got?"
"A Fireball!"
"NO~!"

Gm, regarding the 'limited communication' of common - might be good to remember how hard languages are to come by in 2e, especially if you're not intelligence-based. I think given we're looking at kind of a community, that community would probably have viable common languages to work with? I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but I am curious what kind of limits you're thinking for the common language.


Also, hmm.. Vysol, your character has been around and is old enough. Do you think she'd be the sort of person people might go to if someone got hurt? It's possible she healed Sani up when she was younger?

Some behind the scenes work proved to take significantly longer than I expected, but I did make one public post about languages, it needs to be prettied up. It's just a list of possible languages, along with some additions of my own, namely -

Ancient: An unknown language that will come up in the game

Elder: Basically the old worlds language, this is what most historians of old times wrote in. Will come up in research during game

Sign: basically sign language, useful for stealthy encounters



Also, we will be using the language groups function. I think it is a fantastic tool and will really help immersion. I'm going to keep common as the default language, but I really want to use other languages as much as possible. I prefer to think of common as a very difficult language to communicate in, especially complex ideas. I will generally do -2 to any rolls using common to negotiate or trade.



I won't be able to get the game started yet as I still need to do a few things but we are very close. I just need to finish the opening sequence, post some setting details, and then we should be good to go!

I'll be checking everyones sheets as I go along, and will message anyone if I have questions.



EDIT: Yes, I am working on house rules for languages, but I'm thinking it'll be along the lines of you speak any language(s) granted by class and ancestry, plus 2 X INT mod. Players will be able to learn new languages and purchase potions to understand other languages

In regards to immersion, I imagine that in a fantasy world children are taught multiple languages simply because of how many different sentient species there are. I'll allow for common to be used, I just want to utilise different languages for more than exploring dungeons and always defaulting to common during any social interaction.

I hope I'm not the only one to come out and say that I don't think crippling the Common tongue is a good idea. PF2e's limited stat spreads mean that investing in Intelligence if you're not an Int-Based class is a luxury, and not something that this is going to work well with, in my opinion. I'm facing the choice of 'do I drop my charisma back to 10 and give up the 'okay at social skills' feel for int so I can get a couple of languages that won't be penalized?' I don't think it's a very good place to be in.

I also don't think it really matches the feel of a settlement that has put down roots on the coastline of a new continent and grown together with a diverse group of people for a good 50+ years, but all the people of various races who aren't intelligence-invested can't talk to each other without a struggle?

The only way I might be able to find a way to be okay with this is if the methods of getting languages were accessible, affordable, and not bound to 2e's feat system, because forcing the use of limited character ability resources on languages in this way would feel really awful, I think.


Personally, I'm also really not a fan of RPOL's Language system, and I don't want to have to utilize it. But if that's what people overall want to do, that's fine.  I figured I should at least voice why I'm having an issue with the idea of making common bad, in case anyone else is similarly displeased by it and afraid to speak up.  If anyone was doing a social character concept, this is a huge additional consideration as well, and I know at least some of us are already done with chargen, so this is a bit of a thing to spring now. I don't really care about language as a complication on a large scale, and I am way more interested to roleplay and interact, and I feel like making a common tongue this difficult is... inherently counter to fostering interactivity.

I'm gonna second Sani on this one, removing Common is just going to add an enormous amount of unnecessary struggle to overcome for no real benefit. Keeping it is worth any immersion sacrifice.

The language system is a little tricky to get the hang of but it has a massive amount of slots available to cover even the most obscure languages.

Definitely can be, I have her set up to be as useful to the town as possible so things like medicine, healing, and general aid are all kind of right in her wheelhouse. By no means the locals’ primary source of any of it, but kind of an out-of-the-way last resort type deal. Maybe whatever sort of medical attention Sani could have gotten wasn’t going to cut it or simply wasn’t available, so Vy was her next best option at the time.

I'm at work but heres some thoughts-

 After reading everyone's input I'm willing to drop the common limitations, but I do want say the only thing I'm worried about with having common stay as it originally was is the other languages never being used since common is such a well, "commonly" used language. That's what happens in most of my experiences. After all, why bother speaking in elven or dwarven if you can just speak common?


 That said, I don't want social characters to feel limited and I do recognise that using language groups can be annoying.

Well as a human player ,go humans, common we start with and don't most players usually take Elven I found for smarter pc's its so common in games to be the de fatco 'common' of the people who matter.

I appreciate leaving common as a viable language.

I don't think that languages are a bad thing for flavor, but 2e really makes languages less accessible if you're not an Intelligence class. You can't drop a skill point into Linguistics anymore, it's a bigger investment. Also, the sheer number of languages on that list is hard to manage when various races only get 'common and our own language', so a diverse group isn't going to share languages without mechanical investment.

(also, my dislike for RPOL's thing is both a 'I like to enjoy the game and not miss out on meaning even if my character doesn't know it' and also 'formatting for language is a pain' thing for me.)

So as someone whose only ever played 2e in person, is there a decent online character sheet, character builder tool, or template that should be used? I’ve not really had a chance to find anything outside of just doing it by hand from the source books prior to this.

I found an google sheet (whatever their version of Excel is).  I didn't care for it, made everything too finicky and honestly it didn't help with my understanding of the rules either.

I'm using the mythweavers site to host my sheet. My only gripe is that it doesn't have much place to copy the text of your features, but I'm gonna be mixing that sheet for reference with the text for features and feats in my RPOL character sheet and a combat HP/Hero Point/Spells Tracker I'll construct when the game is closer to launch.

My character is coming along nicely I never played this version of Pathfinder so its slow going. I find it not as good as the first edition but its nice step-oriented and like its hard to start a character with major bonuses in statistic.

Its mixed but maybe it plays better than 5e, the character creation beats that like I noted as stages are decent.

I've been enjoying dipping my toe into both PF 2e and D&D 5e.  Very different things, but both worth playing I think. One thing about it is just that there's not as much stuff out for it as there is for PF 1e.  I personally love the way 2e here handles actions on turn with the three 'action point' system. Focus spells are a really great idea, and Refocusing and Medicine coincide very nicely, so it's possible to do Skill-Based healing that works pretty well. My 'Tabletop' (Discord) 2E game of Age of Ashes is still pretty early on,  but my monk in that game is also the only healer in the party and it's so much fun :D

(She's actually kind of a tomboy local to the town, just old enough to go adventuring herself, and a local... not troublemaker, but she doesn't get along with the local kids, and also got so many earfuls from clerics that she outright dislikes clerics and gods, so she's doing the Godless Healing thing. Her ki stuff is a blend of cultural stuff and stuff she's picked up from travelers and experimentation. Chaotic Good monk. Fun :D And with battle healing, a variant on risky surgery, and godless healing (and eventually, possibly the medic archetype, she totally does the  *hit your ally to make them pull themselves together* thing, but also pressure-point flavored healing stuff.)

PF 2e can do some really cool things. (mind I do admit that by the rules ability scores are very fixed. I figure maybe a good idea for players who want higher scores leaning more into the 'high fantasy' builds I really like would be to an additional set of bonuses to the current chargen, but I'm not suggesting that here, mind.)

I think my sheet is good to go, 2E is a heck of a change from 1E, feel free to let me know what might be mixed up.

Will attempt an intro post at some point, have some mild food poisoning so am kinda gross.

Oh, yeah, I should declare prepared spells too
0: Electric Arc, Tanglefoot, Prestidigitation, Ray of Frost, Light
1: Heal, Pummeling Rubble

Focus: Tempest Surge

I'm fighting Colon Cancer I'll trade  for your food poisoning. They cut out the cancer tumor but have radiation and chemotherapy for a good while.

*asked about the weather... reminded of how much FUN the 5e Druidcraft Cantrip is*

I am waiting for Kell to answer which is why I have not posted in the past few days..

I should have my character sheet up for approval today

Character is up for approval

Sorry it's taking me awhile on my pc besides near daily radiation therapy and such its a non-adventuring pc so the setting her up is unusual. And the holidays of course.

GM has also not logged in since the 16th. I wouldn't worry until after the new year, though.

Anyone mind if I play the new Teacher my gal knows the Lores:
Academia
Art (Woodcrafting)
Guild (Woodcrafting as in Carpentry)
Religion

And some supporting feats so she should fit in the town and be a productive Cleric. Idle hands is the playground of laziness. (Book of the Lady, Scroll of Wise Proverbs)
This message was last edited by the player at 22:08, Wed 30 Dec 2020.

Hey. I'm still here. Just had to get started and get past the holiday chaos!